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ASL vs CMBO


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I just played a quick ASL scenario conversion in CMBO "Ham and Bloody Jam" a "tiny" 9 turn setup and I got it done in about one hour so.

What's the point? That scenario would probably take a full day and an ulcer to play with ASL. The most amazing thing is that I had fun! No looking at that @#$%^%$ ASL index for every little AFPh/PRC/DRM/FFNAM&FFMO/MPh/VCA take I had to decipher just to figure out if my squad can enter the building from the woods side while eating a sandwich.

Sorry, I'm not jaded enough on CMBO not be totally stoked over this.

If (Or hopefully, when) CM can model as much stuff as ASL does I will dump my ASL modules in the trash. (Maybe not, those damned things were expensive)

A happy CM user.

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>>No looking at that @#$%^%$ ASL index for every little AFPh/PRC/DRM/FFNAM&FFMO/MPh/VCA take I had to decipher just to figure out if my squad can enter the building from the woods side while eating a sandwich<<

damn...that was the fun of ASL! rolleyes.gif

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Keep the ASL stuff - the scenarios, when properly converted, can be quite fun to play in Combat Mission. Most are company sized, and if you can get the balance to work out within the constraints of the CM rules, the results can be rewarding. I've played a few really tight games based on SL scenarios that came down to the last turn or two.

The ASL manual is also a handy (though not entirely trustworthy) reference on weapons and vehicles.

I wish CM would have been around 15 years ago, but some good things are worth waiting for. Can't wait to convert Sowchos 79 or Hill 621 for CM2.

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Gyrene,

I'm a little confused by your post. Are you saying that you rather spend (read "waste") time on looking through ASL manuals and indexes rather than playing the game, or do you like the fact that CM does all this for you?

Maybe I should mention that CM was originally going to be Computer Squad Leader when BTS was teamed-up with Avalon Hill several years ago until AH was bought up by Hasblow.

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Hey look! I can see my house!

And for all you Hamster Lovers out there, check this out! Kitty, this one's for you!

[This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 03-29-2001).]

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Gyrene,

I felt the same thing after first playing CMBO. Playing some of the ASL conversion scenarios that I once played in ASL is a real hoot. The ASL maps are so flat compared to normal CM maps that I wondered how the hell I ever played ASL and thought that is was accurate. I am still on the ASL mailing list and I see these guys babble on about die roll mods and what not and I shake my head. I would much rather play CMBO than ASL and I would never have said that with any other computer game until now. The best thing about CMBO vs ASL is that you don't have to find opponents of questionable hygiene habits and spend 6 to 8 hours with them hunched over a board tweaking your back and neck in terrible contortions. As far as modelling as much stuff as ASL, I think the modelling in CMBO is much better than ASL. Things just feel right. I would agree with keeping ASL for the scenario ideas and chapter H is pretty interesting.

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Originally posted by furryshark:

I'm just happy not to have to go searching through bags of counters to find that last 9-2 leader...

Spoken by an obvious ASL-lite player.

The true ASL player has all his counter properly organized and stored in some system resulting in easy and near instantaneous access to any of the 13,000 counters in his collection.

And if you are really serious, all those counters will be netaly clipped.

Jeff Heidman

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You missed another of the obvious ASL advantages, the opportunity to have your board, with counters, accidently dumped, kicked, bumped, pawed, etc. Then, not only do you get to exercise your hand - eye coordination, you get to test your memory skills. Let's face it, CM just isn't in the same league.

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Air Defense: Shoot 'em down, sort 'em out on the ground (AKA - if it flies, it dies)

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I did the Squad Leader/COI/COD/GI thing, and once ASL came out, I stopped. Too much work for a game.

I waited, and waited, and waited for something like CM, and then one day a buddy tells me about the pending demo.

Got it, fell in love with the game I always wanted. Did a pre-order.

Now I play too damn much.

Oh well.

Favorite converted SL scenarios;

Bucholz Station

Road To Wiltz

I ditched my SL stuff years ago, so I ask an SL gronard this, what scenario was in COI that used all 5 boards (the 6th was called a marsh) and had a rather interesting mix of Soviet AFVs like T-26s, KVs and BTs?

I still remeber my buddy cringing when my Soviet ATR hit with a dice of 3, and killed with a dice of 2 ....

I think the battle was somewhere near Moscow.

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A long time ago I bought AH's Panzer Leader. I started punching the counters, then i looked at the rules, and said "Forget about it!"

Not having learned my lesson, a couple years after that I bought Squad Leader. I never got beyond looking at the boards. The counters are unpunched. The box is gathering dust in a closet in the same room where CM resides on my G4.

With CM, never have to worry about setup, where to put everything between turns, or writing down grid coordinates when I have to put it away before I finish a game.

What a treat! How can anybody ever go back to tactical warfare board games after CM?

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Originally posted by Jeff Heidman:

Spoken by an obvious ASL-lite player.

The true ASL player has all his counter properly organized and stored in some system resulting in easy and near instantaneous access to any of the 13,000 counters in his collection.

And if you are really serious, all those counters will be netaly clipped.

Jeff Heidman

I must confess I did clip my SL counters with surgical precision.

After purchasing Crescendo of Doom, though, I just remember looking at counter sheet after counter sheet. Overwhelming, and I hadn't even cracked the rule book yet.

I'll stick with CM, for sure.

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"You missed another of the obvious ASL advantages, the opportunity to have your board, with counters, accidently dumped, kicked, bumped, pawed, etc. Then, not only do you get to exercise your hand - eye coordination, you get to test your memory skills. Let's face it, CM just isn't in the same league."

Oh yes...The dreaded "Off Board elbow Howitzer" Which I had happen to me on the fourth turn of "Dehezenski Tractor Works" (The name is mispelled...can't find the scenario). That was ASL's biggest strenght, simulating massive 12.0 quakes, with automatic counter placement.

Did any of you ever use VASL? (Virtual ASL)

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Jochen, that was Col Klotz at the now gone and sorely missed ASL 4 CM website.

I and others saved all his maps and I have been able to finish the work, save for desert maps 26-31. I even have the rest of the ASL maps on order from MMP and with luck they will arrive today. Now I will get the rest of the maps done.

You can get these at the DFDR website

I btw, nearly all the desert scenarios I will be submitting for download are based on ASL battles along with battles from the invasion of France in 1940 and with luck some pacific ones.

MikeT

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www.dfdr.net for desert mods

"Quando omni flunkus moritati"

- Motto of Possum Lodge

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I truely enjoyed playing SL and ASL but rarely had the time to play a complete game in one sitting. And I never had the time to play frequently enough to "learn" the rules and get good at the game. Therefore, every game I spent a lot of time rereading important rules and setting up.

Now with CM I don't have to worry about having time to complete a game (although I usually do finish even if it take all night). I still have the problem, however, of not having enough time to play so I'm still not any good. At least now I have fun playing bad. biggrin.gif

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