AAR-AXIS - Clearing the Niscemi Highway

[Hister]

Aw, damn! Well you probably have to look this from the bright side: maybe Steve et. al. will be more prone to check the problem and fix it for the next patch

[John Kettler]

snake_eye,

It occurs to me that the difference you note in the higher frequency of FO teams being spotted in CMFI, as opposed to CMBN, may well lie in the much lower amount of concealment available there. Ground cover is far more sparse, and what's there is generally not exactly lush and leafy. Also LOS is much longer, greatly increasing the likelihood of being seen, and from farther away, said LOS greatly aided at times by elevated terrain which is usually both higher and more frequent than CMBN. All those eyeballs add up! Though I don't have the game, I'd suggest staying well back in concealment, which preferably is also cover, and Sneaking the team into position.

Regards,

John Kettler

[Michael Emrys]

Sneaking the FO team into position is something I generally did in BN. If I had smoke available, I'd move up behind a smokescreen too. I went to considerable lengths to protect my FOs, and as I posted earlier only lost one once.

Michael

[c3k]

FWIW, when I played through this, I would SLOW that FO team into the densest overgrowth on the flank of the hill. They'd have a 50m circular covered arc and NO ONE would be NEAR them. Nothing like hiding a team only to have the enemy bombard the area because a nearby squad gets spotted.

Tough luck on the arty. Pulled a red chit on that one.

Your options are simple. Group your men in cover, give them a stirring speech, then lead them in a beautiful charge against the enemy! You man not gain the position, but you will not lose your honor. It has been a pleasure. We'll be watching your assault from the far hill.

[Bil Hardenberger]

Your options are simple. Group your men in cover, give them a stirring speech, then lead them in a beautiful charge against the enemy! You man not gain the position, but you will not lose your honor. It has been a pleasure. We'll be watching your assault from the far hill.

Hey, there is still an hour left in this battle.. I can bore ND to death and then walk into the Villa when he and all of his men are asleep.

[John Kettler]

snake_eye and c3k,

Drat! I used a CMx1 command. c3k has the correct command, which he has generously brought to my attention via strong capitalization.

Regards,

John Kettler

[Bil Hardenberger]

The Thirty First Minute

The battle is heating up nicely now... the Pz III that I had placed in a hull down position spotted and got a few desperate rounds into the Sherman, alas to no effect, before taking one in return.

Don't worry, the tank is fine, a little beat up for sure but still operational. The crew however loses its TC, panics, and bails.

One of my overwatching Pz-IVs gets a spot and fires a round into the Sherman..not sure what damage the partial penetration caused but the Sherman popped smoke and reversed out of LOS. So if nothing else I have told ND that this side of the Villa is not a healthy place to be for his armor.

Both Grilles are on line now and one of them fires off a couple of one-five-ohs into the side of the Villa putting a large hole in the side of the building. That has to hurt.

Due to all of the smoke and debris though neither has a good LOS to the Villa and I will be pulling them back next turn to rest. I am thinking about pulling at least one of them into the area where my overwatching Pz-IVs are located.

Finally on the other side of the map I had one Pz-IV creep forward in the hopes of getting a spot on the Sherman he has posted on the backside of the Villa.

Unfortunately instead of my tank getting a spot, his got one and fired off a round... which thankfully landed short. I'm not sure if it is the trees which saved me or if he just had bad aim, but being in the treeline could not have hurt I'm sure. The smoke to the right of this image is a smoke screen my tank fired to screen the other Shermans ND has on the ridge.

[c3k]

Excellent turn! The armor battle heats up. (Oh, the punning is poor, but I tried. )

Funny synchronicity: there's a thread lambasting the lack of crews bailing in-game when they get hit, and your AAR shows the PzIII doing exactly that.

Good turn.

Thanks,

Ken

[sburke]

Love this cat and mouse game between the armor. The suspense is outstanding.

[John Kettler]

Bil Hardenberger,

A real rip snorter of a fight! Your tactical dispersion, though, reminds me of mine in the CMBN Demo scenario "Closing the Gap." Sometimes, you have to sacrifice dispersion if you're going to be able to fight at all. Judging from what did and didn't happen to the Sherman, am guessing you had no PzGr 40 available.

Love the pics! Are they stock, or do you have some mod installed? Either way, it looks as though shaders are on.

c3k,

Given the Panzer III commander most likely suffered traumatic amputation of all or part of his head, I'm good with his sudden descent into the turret in that condition's triggering a bail out. Losing a driver or codriver would be far less likely to trigger such a reaction, what with fewer to see the event. A semi beheaded or headless TC, though, gushing blood, falling into the three man turret is simply impossible to ignore. I consider the crew's possibly temporary response to be both appropriate and expected.

Regards,

John Kettler

[GerryCMBB]

Hello Bil:

1) Question about this:

"Finally on the other side of the map I had one Pz-IV creep forward in the hopes of getting a spot on the Sherman he has posted on the backside of the Villa."

Did you use Hunt here? I thought I read where you wrote one time about only 2 speeds for tanks, Quick and Fast, to minimize time in LOS/LOF of enemy AT assets?

2) How do you get into hull-down positions? Using Hunt or Slow?

Thanks. Great write-up by you and ND here.

Gerry

[Bil Hardenberger]

Bil Hardenberger,

Love the pics! Are they stock, or do you have some mod installed? Either way, it looks as though shaders are on.

Hey John, yeah shaders are on.. the only mods I'm using are my grid mod, marker mod, and floating icon mod. none of which affect these screenshots.

[Bil Hardenberger]

Hello Bil:

1) Question about this:

"Finally on the other side of the map I had one Pz-IV creep forward in the hopes of getting a spot on the Sherman he has posted on the backside of the Villa."

Did you use Hunt here? I thought I read where you wrote one time about only 2 speeds for tanks, Quick and Fast, to minimize time in LOS/LOF of enemy AT assets?

I actually used fast for this move. I will occasionally use Hunt but only when I am being very careful, especially in woods, I probably should have in this case actually.

2) How do you get into hull-down positions? Using Hunt or Slow?

Depends on the situation.. usually I go fast into the hull down position (I never use slow or normal for a tank movement)... if I know an enemy tank is on the other side and I am trying to surprise it I will Hunt into the position.. that way I know it will stop immediately upon sighting the enemy tank.

Thanks. Great write-up by you and ND here.

Gerry

Can't speak for ND, but thanks... this has been a very frustrating scenario but I am having a lot of fun with it.

Bil

[snake_eye]

To :

Michael Emrys - John Kettler and C3K

Sure the landscape offers less cover, John than in the CMBN bocage, but there are always entirely or partly hidden positions than can be used like small forest hedges, thick bushes, stone walls, artillery craters, foxholes and houses.

The 360° target arc, if set to a short radius could prevent the FO to fire and disclose its position. That’s a sound idea C3k.

The hidden order I used did not prevent them to be discovered. I had time to plot the barrage (in that particular battle) but just before the bracketing rounds were fired the FO team was KIA by mortar and or artillery barrage rounds.

In other CMFI scenarios the FO’s teams and or Platoon leaders escaped injuries when the small farm, from which they directed the mortars, was levelled to rubbles, by the 88’s they were attempting to destroy. They survived to my astonishment and did their job, bracketing the rounds onto the 88’s hidden among the rubbles, till their destruction.

Michael. In a coming CMBN scenario about a town attack, I am finalizing, 2 FO’s teams well hidden succeeded despite their positions on a hill slope with trees and bushes to stay alive and undiscovered.. However, one FO’s team was denied all assets, despite having a radio in at least two testing of that battle. Maybe they were shaken and I did not notice.

Another thing, I have found in CMFI, is that the MK IV’s are rather unable to destroy the Shermans in that battle (unless firing on the rear and or flanks). One or two Sherman’s shots and they are brewing up. In “Alvano Anvil”, I was able to smash the German tank counter attack from the left and right sides, for the losses of only 2 tanks. Clearly the Sherman’s had the hedge over their German counterpart. In CMBN the Mk IV were up gunned and it is another story. In my coming scenario, despite the fact of knowing the A.I, I managed to lose 18 US tanks against 1 German. Sure a Pak 40 and 2 88’s did their part, but I had less than 6 or 7 German tanks doing the tally. Needless to say the MK IV’s did a good score.

These remarks do not mean that there is something wrong with the setting of the armor datas.

I just thought that the Mk IV’s 7.5cm gun KwK 40 L/43 with a muzzle velocity being the double from the L/24 and from 1943 the longer 7.5 cmL/48 would have made the difference against the Shermans.

[Bil Hardenberger]

Another thing, I have found in CMFI, is that the MK IV’s are rather unable to destroy the Shermans in that battle (unless firing on the rear and or flanks). One or two Sherman’s shots and they are brewing up. In “Alvano Anvil”, I was able to smash the German tank counter attack from the left and right sides, for the losses of only 2 tanks. Clearly the Sherman’s had the hedge over their German counterpart. In CMBN the Mk IV were up gunned and it is another story. In my coming scenario, despite the fact of knowing the A.I, I managed to lose 18 US tanks against 1 German. Sure a Pak 40 and 2 88’s did their part, but I had less than 6 or 7 German tanks doing the tally. Needless to say the MK IV’s did a good score.

These remarks do not mean that there is something wrong with the setting of the armor datas.

I just thought that the Mk IV’s 7.5cm gun KwK 40 L/43 with a muzzle velocity being the double from the L/24 and from 1943 the longer 7.5 cmL/48 would have made the difference against the Shermans.

For a good explanation of what is going on under the hood specifically with Pz-IVs versus Shermans see my CMBN AAR (link in my sig).. particularly this entry: http://www.battlefront.com/community/showpost.php?p=1239443&postcount=303 I have quoted a nice blurb from Charles who explains the problems Pz-IVs sometimes have when taking on Shermans. They are not equal tanks.

Read the posts before and after that one to get a better appreciation of how al this data works in game.

Bil

[snake_eye]

Thanks Bil, I shall read these as quickly as I can.

Hope you'll fare better against the Shermans in that battle. At the moment, in the KT4 gully, I have lost a Semovente (it did some damage to a Sherman) and a MK IV coming up near it had its crew bailing out leaving the undamaged tank to its probable unpleasant fate !

Keep up with your AAR. Both sides are perfectly illustrated and written. A real pleasure.

[Bil Hardenberger]

Thanks Bil, I shall read these as quickly as I can.

If interested, there are links to all of the AAR posts for the CMBN AAR embedded in the initial post:

http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=95456

Bil

[Bil Hardenberger]

The Thirty Second Minute

Thought I would start this turn by showing you the state of the Villa... bit of a mess isn't it? You can see my 105 is still dropping spotting rounds, one hits in the right side of this image. That should keep him guessing, eh?

I'm calling this my Run for the Hill (TM, Patent Pending). I think I have these guys coming outside of the LOS of where I know his remaining gun is sitting. I know that gun is still alive, I saw it a few turns ago when it opened up on my Italian infantry.

As soon as I saw his Sherman backup popping smoke last turn I decided to make a move. I will be overwatching this movement with as many support weapons as possible.. but once they are in position (if they make it) then they will pretty much be on their own until I can reinforce them.

I am also sending another infantry platoon in on the other side... the red lines you see are the smoke screens that I am laying with my Pz-IVs and Grilles. The wind is blowing right to left in this image. I want a nice layered screen that will cover my infantry's approach. Once they get to the end of the gully, approximately where the point of the arrow is they will dismount and then proceed on foot.

[Hister]

Wish your men all the luck!

[Broadsword56]

I like this plan. Certainly giving the enemy more than one thing to worry about, too.

[John Kettler]

Bil Hardenberger,

I believe you've invented a whole new smoke tactic. Certainly, I've not seen it before.

Regards,

John Kettler

[Heinrich505]

Oh man, a patented Truck Charge! What a bold move. I would have said a crazy one but you are popping smoke to cover it, so it is pretty cool.

The enemy can't hit everyone at the same time, and you are moving up really fast. This should be very interesting. Nice move! Those guys in the trucks look quite nonplussed - must have icewater in their veins.

Heinrich505

[c3k]

Ack! I was kidding when I said we needed more action. What are you doing to these men??? (Of course, if it works, I'll say that I helped prompt this bold and tactically decisive action. )

Ken

[Javaslinger]

Damn... I want you guys to live close to me so you can by my CM tutors...

[snake_eye]

Bil,

I read again the Sherman versus PZ IV data. I agree with it. Besides the armor differences, the Sherman quicker turret traverse is clearly seen and rendered in the game. Quite a few times I got a PZ IV close enough for a side shot and saw that damn Sherman’s turret turning quickly. If the first shot was missed or longer to fire, it was too late to avoid the Sherman shot.

About your Thirty second minute turn:

The truck racing down the road with troopers is a bold dash. That is a gambit. If the others coming through the KT4 gully are unable to be levelled with them (that is if they get where you intend them to go) they will be pretty much on their own.

The smoke screens are good assets to cover your approach through KT4 gully. However I would say that if the truck loaded troops can be brought rather quickly to the bottom of the gully, they will have difficulties moving along it till the area you intend to dismount.

I have found playing that battle (RT –Iron) that the trucks were being slowed by others getting on their way and it looked more like a traffic jam than a coordinated progression. The tanks did it better. However, if fire had been taken it would have been a slaughter. Thanks to the smoke.

Once at the edge of the Villa summit, I have found difficult to reorganize the assault forces as well as deploying the tanks. I wished I had more time allowed to do that safely, since once you are there, you have to face new threats on the other side, not seen very well from your right frontage troops LOS.

For these reasons I am really impatient to see, Bil, how you will get through that. Anyway that battle will make me reverse for a time to WEGO, since it allows a better control and allows a Recon feasibility through the recording.

Can’t wait the next turn

Cheer