Heirloom_Tomato

The ability to start vehicle crews outside of their vehicle is currently possible. All you need to do is order the team to bail out and you can put them anywhere on the map you wish. I made a rough scenario where an Elite Tiger tank crew parked their tank on the edge the woods outside of town and went to the bar in town. They start the mission as "unfit" from drinking too much and need to get back to their tank to join the fight. I can't remember if they were able to recrew their tank or not. But for an H2H style scenario this would certainly add an element of tension to the battle. As for the game play continuing after time runs out, how do you design a scenario to allow for these kinds of conditions? Or do yo wish to have the battle continue but have the AI do nothing? I can see how this would be applicable for H2H missions but not too sure it work for single player. I think your other suggestions are great ideas.

I assume you play a lot of quick battles if this is how you prefer to fight. If this is indeed the case how about trying to add a forward observer team to your platoon of tanks, This will make him a part of the tanks formation and he will share any spotting info he has across the tanks radio net. He will come equipped with a radio and if you keep this observer in close contact with your Infantry company CO, ( move together as if they were one team) these two men will share information with each other and often times within one minute of either force spotting something, the other force has the same information.

TEST # 5 This test had the halftracks again remaining stationary but this time they were given area fire orders to the edge of the woods. The infantry advanced just like last time, in blocks to 400 yards out and then leapfrogging forward from there. Each time a squad could not see any enemy they advanced 50 meters. The halftracks had their area fire commands adjusted to the known locations of the US as they were found by the infantry. After 10 minutes all halftracks were advanced 250 meters to help improve their spotting. The result?? With 10 minutes left in the battle the US side SURRENDERED automatically. The final results show the US side with 65 men OK, 168 KIA and 79 WIA. The Germans had 246 OK 11 KIA and 23 WIA. The Germans managed to advance to within 150 meters of the US positions. My final analysis would indicate it is indeed a suicide mission to ride your halftracks into contact with the enemy. Your men are indeed far safer to walk under the protection of the area firing machine guns of your halftracks. As soon as you are able to spot your enemy, dismount your men, leapfrog them toward the enemy under the protective area fire of your halftracks. This also shows a buttoned up halftrack is safe to drive to close to the enemy, so long as it stays buttoned up. You should be able to drive loaded halftracks across an open field in full view of the enemy and you men should stay safe, provided the enemy has no AT capabilities. In my test this was a safe thing to assume, in a real battle do you think it is a good idea to assume your enemy has no AT capabilities? I don't. It would also indicate passengers are susceptible to enemy fire out to at least 700 meters. Is this an accurate depiction of reality? I don't know. Maybe the position of the passengers needs to lowered when the halftrack is in the open state. However, this does raise a different question, do you want the passengers to be able to spot and engage the enemy while in the open state or do you just want the gunner to be engaging the enemy? If you want the passengers to fire over the sides of the halftrack, then they should be actively looking over the side, thus exposing themselves more. If you only want the gunner to engage, then the passengers could be lowered and potentially safer. Is it possible to add a third option to how we can manage our halftracks? Fully open, with everyone actively searching for and trying to engage targets, Gunner up with the passengers safely tucked down and finally fully buttoned?

TEST #4 In this test I had the halftracks remain stationary and did not give them any area fire orders the whole battle. I did open up the halftracks. The infantry were dismounted and ordered forward. For the first 300 meters they were ordered "quick" in 100 meter bounds as whole platoons. They were given a turn to rest between bounds. After this, the squads were split and ordered forward in leapfrog bounds for the next few turns. Once solid contact with the US was made, the Germans did not advance for three turns to open fire and try to suppress the US forces. The battle ended after 13 mins with the Germans 150 to 200 meters out from the US positions. If any of the halftracks fired, I missed it. They certainly did not fire very often, even though they were taking multiple hits each turn and even the odd casualty. The results: After the first two minutes the US side had still taken no casualties and the Germans had 276 men OK, 2 KIA and 2 WIA. After 4 minutes the German troops were about 375 yard out or approximately the same distance as they were in turn 1 while riding the halftracks. The casualty count: The US had 307 men OK, 4 KIA and 1 WIA. The Germans had 272 men OK, 4 KIA and 4 WIA. This shows that walking was indeed safer. The Germans suffered 3 less KIA and 4 less WIA walking 300 meters than riding the same distance in halftracks. The battle ended with 17 minutes left to play. The German troops were unable to advance any further. Any attempt to move was swiftly cut down and the troops left cowering. The US side had 275 men OK, 18 KIA and 19 WIA. The Germans had 74 men OK, 97 KIA and 109 WIA. Again the halftracks contributed virtually nothing to this battle. They seemed quite content to let round after round bounce off their vehicles and not return fire.

The halftracks were taken out with grenades. The US side had no bazookas.

TEST #3 All halftracks are given a fast order right on top of the US positions. They are opened up and given area fire commands on top of the US positions. Minute one opens with the halftracks firing first but the US responds right away hitting once again 7 passengers before the first gunner is taken out. Seems an open halftrack is indeed a bullet magnet. Turn one ends with the halftracks at about 390 meters away and these figures: US 309 OK, 1 KIA and 2 WIA. Germans 261 OK, 9 KIA and 10 WIA. The second minute once again proves assaulting unsuppressed positions is a bad idea. The turn ends with the halftracks right in front of the US positions. US: 295 men OK, 6 KIA and 11 WIA. The Germans have 54 OK, 81 KIA and 145 WIA with 2 destroyed halftracks. Again the battle is over by the fourth minute. The US side has 290 men OK, 13 KIA and 9 WIA. (turns out shooting the wounded happens a lot!!) The Germans have 18 men OK, 100 KIA and 162 WIA with 8 halftracks destroyed. Next test is static halftracks and walking infantry. Will they survive better? Will they even make it to the US positions?

TEST #2 All halftracks are given a fast order right on top of the US positions, however this time they are kept closed, ie not opened up. The first minute passes without a single shot being fired. Nothing. The halftracks again cover about 300 meters and end the turn 390 meters from the enemy. In the second minute, the first halftrack spots a US unit at 150 meters and opens up to engage them. Wrong move. Instantly all hell breaks lose. Every gun on the US side opens fire at once and the halftrack is riddled with bullets. Who dies? Not the gunner but rather three of the passengers in a 2 second span. All the other halftracks now open up in attempts to engage the US troops and Germans drop like flies. Turn 2 kill count: US 303 men OK, 6 KIA and 3 WIA. Germans: 84 OK, 91 KIA and 105 WIA with 5 halftracks destroyed. Again the turn ends with the halftracks right on top of the US positions. Most of the German casualties happen with only 20 seconds left in the turn and with less than 50 meters to the US positions. At the end of the third minute the battle is over. Final tally US: 299 OK, 8 KIA and 5 WIA. Germans: 29 OK, 130 KIA, and 121 WIA with 8 halftracks destroyed.

So I built a test map. It is 800 meters long and 600 meters wide. It is divided into four lanes about 150 meters wide and has two platoons of American Infantry against two platoons of German Panzergrenadiers in 251/1 AusfC halftracks per lane. All troops for both sides are elite fanatics with +2 leadership. The map is flat and has no cover except for at the American end of the map. The US troops are in a light forest tile with trees. This map will simulate a halftrack assault against a defensible position. My plan is to run this scenario a few times and then switch the Germans out for US troops and then British troops to see if the 251/1 is more vulnerable than any other halftrack. TEST #1 All halftracks are set to open up,and given a fast order straight to the edge of the woods, right on top of the US positions. At the start of the turn the two sides are about 700 meters apart. In the first minute the halftracks drive about 300-315 meters. The US troops open fire in the first 4 seconds of the battle, with the first casualty coming 13 seconds in. The victim?? A passenger, who was shot not in the gunner position but rather at the middle of the halftrack at a distance of about 650 meters. The next casualty is a gunner, shot at about 500 meters out. All the rest of the casualties are mostly passengers. All were hit at distances greater than 400 meters. The US side suffered one KIA. Totals are 311 OK and 1 KIA for the US, with 265 OK, 7 KIA and 8 WIA for the Germans In the second minute the halftracks closed the distance and ended the turn right on top of the US positions. Lots of lead was flying. At the end of this turn, the Germans had 88 men OK, 58 KIA and 134 WIA with 4 halftracks on fire. The US had 298 OK, 6 KIA and 8 WIA. By the end of the fourth minute the battle was over. The Germans had 12 men OK, 82 KIA, 186 WIA and 12 of 32 halftracks were destroyed. The US had 289 men OK, 14 KIA and 9 WIA. I was surprised to see so many passengers shot first. I had expected to see the gunners getting hit but not passengers. My expectations would be to see the halftrack provide better protection for the men out at these distances. Perhaps the men are indeed sitting up too high.

My comment was addressed to those who say the game is broken and the halftracks are not working properly. I have used them with great success at ranges greater than 400 meters. I will lose a gunner or passenger every once in a while but not to the same extent as if I try to drive them within 50 meters. At 400 meters the halftrack gunners can lay down a large volume of suppressive fire allowing my men to close the distance with relative safety. This is the range I say the gunners are safe. C3K offered to run a test and asked all those who thought the game was broken to tell him how close the gunners should be able to be before they get shot. No one answered him. I am not trying to be snarky or a prick but am trying to help out. I am also willing to run a test or 5 to see what others are seeing and to improve my own game play. So, to all those who say the game is broken, how close do you want to be able to drive a halftrack and consider the gunner to be safe?

I asked this question a few pages ago and no one has yet to answer: At what range do you think a halftrack gunner should be "safe" and at what range should he be "risking his life?"

How close to the enemy do you think a halftrack should be able to drive and not suffer excessive casualties?

After running through the remaining turns, it looks like there is a random chance things will be worse or better. The US had 7 more KIA after the extra 25 minutes but the Germans had 3 less. So I reloaded the save, advanced the game by one minute and then surrendered again. The US had 8 more KIA and the Germans 1 less. So while doing buddy definitely saves lives, leaving the wounded for 5 minutes or for 25 minutes seems to make no difference.

I noticed them as well, but the last panel I liked the best!

I feel your pain. I too lost halftrack gunners like flies, until I changed my tactics. I now consider any terrain within 400 meters that could be holding the enemy to be a no-go zone for my halftracks. I park the halftracks in a great over-watch position and send the troops in to clear the area out. A platoon comes with 4 halftracks and 4 machine guns can lay down a lot of suppressive fire. I still lose a gunner or two but no where near as many. A good analogy would be to consider your halftracks like a ride home from a friend after sneaking out. This friends car has a loud stereo and an even louder exhaust. Do you really want him to pull up to the front door or would you rather have him drop you off a block away and walk home from there?

I have the save and will test this out later tonight.

Great work on the Battle Pack JonS. Really enjoying the scenarios so far.

Nicely done Bud! I liked the smoking barrels in the last panel a lot.

So I ran a quick test, one full battalion per side, a hump in the middle of a grass field. Both sides meet in the middle for 5 minutes of chaos. While watching all the shooting there were indeed a bunch of guys who went from wounded to dead after grenades were tossed, mortars landed or rifle fire came their way. At the end of 5 minutes I saved the game and then surrendered. The US: 315 men OK 211 KIA 88 WIA. The Germans 171 men OK 195 KIA 69 WIA. I then reloaded the turn and proceeded to buddy aid as many guys as I could over the next 25 minutes. There was some shooting still as there were a few broken units who refused to move and were killed off when the buddy aid teams came to the rescue. The final tally: The US: 315 OK 201 KIA 98 WIA The Germans 159 OK 178 KIA 99 WIA Buddy aid certainly pays off. It saved the lives of 10 Americans and 17 Germans.

Just played a scenario after updating to 3.12 I sent out a scout team and one of my men got shot and fall down wounded. About 5 seconds later another shot rang out, hitting the same man, killing him. I have never seen this before in game. Is this something new to 3.12 or has it been in game the whole time and I just have never noticed? Either way, it was very cool to see!

That was close!!

Whoo hoo! Thanks for the update Bud.

The armchair videos are great. Here is a link to the first one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZ6dDlqye9Q If you have done any reading here on the forums you will probably have come across an AAR or two by a guy named Bil Hardenberger. He has a blog you should check out. http://battledrill.blogspot.ca/ Welcome to the forum and enjoy your new addiction!

In CM there is no building of units, no adding to the forces you start out with. If your one and only tank is KO'd in the first five minutes, there is no way to "build" a new one. The combat is modelled second to none. At times it will drive you nuts with how things seem to go against you all the time, but usually a change in tactics solves most problems. I would recommend trying the game out in WeGo mode first, watching the turn over and over again. This is the best way to see what you are doing right and what you are doing wrong. I would recommend getting the big bundle. Once you start to play, you are going to want to have access to all the toys anyway! While the cost may seem steep, I am at about $0,10 an hour maximum for my game play time. I certainly did not spend the same amount of time playing Company of Heroes as I have spent playing CM. The multiplayer is player vs player with each player in command of one force. If you are playing a premade scenario, you will be limited to the units already in the scenario. However you can also play a quick battle in which each player can choose their forces. Different size and types of battles have different point values assigned to them. Each of the units is assigned a point value and the higher the quality of the unit the more it will cost. For example, an Elite Fanatic Sherman Firefly will cost twice as much as a Poor Conscript Firefly. Each player then chooses the force they want and the battle begins! All of my multiplayer games are play by email or PBEM. This game type is the WeGo style. I prefer this style of multiplayer as I do not need to have an hour or two in a row to play a game. With PBEM, I can play my turn when it is convenient for me, at 2 am, or while taking a 10 minute break between shovelling out the driveway at 2 in the afternoon. When you buy the game, send me a message and we can play a friendly match.

Hey Bud, any chance for an update to this thread? I miss coming home from work and checking out your CMFB AAR and this one has become its replacement for me.

I think this is the only way to use them in game. They would add a very real element of tension to any game in which they are in play. The joy of seeing artillery, you didn't call, falling right on the enemy at a key time in a battle would be great. As well, the frustration of them not seeing anything or worse yet blasting your own men would be very annoying. The right balance then for use in game.