Schugger

Thanks for posting the link to the Panzermuseum, machineman. It seems like the KT is still there. Unfortunatly their forum does not work for me, so I couldnt ask some questions but I saw some posts made by DesertFox. Small world

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by kump: ...The trick is to keep my armor moving every turn... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I think that is exactly the way armour should be handled. My experiances with mortars against tanks are the opposite of yours. When I order them to target a tank, I'm happy if the shoot at all and if they do, they very rarly hit as their shots landed wide. Perhaps they are geting nervous and their shots are inaccurate because of this. Even area fire is more accurate than their fire against tanks.

Hi Silesian Jaeger If you plan to visit germany as well and you like museums visit the tank museum in Munster ( not Münster with the u-Umlaut) near Wolfsburg. I hope they still have the KT. Another one is the "Museum for wehrtechnische Studien" in Koblenz which has a lot WW2 stuff in top notch condition ( including a Panther G).

istari BTS has put up some armour penetration diagrams for small arms vs HT, but I'm unable to locate them, so everything I say here is from my memory. The german MG42 ( wether the one which is incorporated in an infantry squad or the heavy variant) can penetrate the M3 HTs frontally up to a range of 250 meters. The US .50 cal MG can penetrate the german HTs ( 250 or 251 variants) up to a range of 1500 meters frontally.

I saw it in the Villers-Bocage-Op. Wittmann's Tiger fired it at an infantry squad which was to close and routed it on the spot - also immobilizing his Tiger... Edit: I hope I get this right with the UBB thingie. The link should go to DesertFox's weppage where the Nahverteidigungswaffe is dealt with. http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Capsule/2930/NahVtdgW/artnahvtdgw.htm It works!! [This message has been edited by Schugger (edited 10-21-2000).] [This message has been edited by Schugger (edited 10-21-2000).]

MAMA!

*Chuckle* <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by iggi: ... better quality units react different to stress than newbies ... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Excellent idea, iggi As much as I like your suggestions, one should also consider that being in or out of command does not only effect the delay times for orders but also FP and morale. Reward high quality troops with a higher command radius would make them still more effective, which should also effect their purchase price.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chupacabra: Sorry, but I disagree. I think that suicide charges wouldn't be a whole lot of fun to simulate. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> But..but..the Pickelhauben alone are worth a WW1 simulation

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by patboivin: ....If I got PzIVs, the Allies can't have any really good tanks.... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> LOL! I think that were the famous last words of many german TCs

Interesting thread and when I read the posts here I'm getting more and more excited of CM2. I think the horrendous losses the Russians suffered in the war were not because the inefficiency of the individual soldier rather then of poor doctrine and strategy. I start to ask myself if a game with CM's scale could picture this without making harsh restrictments of a player's options. How would you picture the German battle weariness in the first Winter of the war? They captured and killed so many soldiers in the initial cauldron battles that the had (perhaps) believed there wasn't any enemy left to fight against. But still they had to face fresh and combat ready soviet troops at the gates of Moscow while they were themselves totally unprepared to fight in the Russian winter. I don't think the Russians there were Conscripts, neither were the Germans but how will you simulate this CM? I think there were many occurrences on the eastern front which fit in CM's scale where the Russians actually made an excellent assault or put up a sounding defense even without numerical superiority, but perhaps they are overshadowed by the larger events which are covered in many books. Perhaps this make many of us believe that the Red Army usually sucks. Do you not smell an old fish when a German general wrote in his biography that he failed in accomplishing his mission simply by the enemy's numerical superiority? It is much easier for him to say so, than to admit that he was simply outguessed. Many suggestions I have heard here would it make rather boring to play the Russian side. It is absolutely not my intention to step on someone's toes here and I just want my two Pfennige to the "brainstorming thread" here. I just want ( I assume as anyone else here) to get CM2 as realistically as possible, even if this leads to some nasty surprises. For example: If it proves to be a fact that the Russian infantry rifle was inaccurate, prone to malfunctions, etc. than the FP value of that rifle should be toned down. If it is a fact that soviet platoon leaders weren't well educated in the early years of the war, their leadership boni should not be determined by random but decreased in general. T-34 variants with the two-man turrets, a slow ROF perhaps? Many, many other things are debatable: How long should be the delay times for tanks without radios ( btw, were not a good part of the US tanks in North Africa not equipped with radios)? Should it be a flat 60 seconds ( do or die!) or shouldn't it be modelled at all, as the tank is treated as an individual unit in CM with no tank platoon leader? Just because any book of the eastern front mentions the tenacity of the Russian infantrymen, is this enough of a reason to make them all prone to fanaticism in CM? What about the huge number of prisoners the Germans took? The whole eastern front appears to me as a big can of worms. As much as I enjoy when people on this board exchange reasoned arguments over an issue, they enjoy the luxury of not having to agree and find a consensus ( a luxury which BTS obviously can't afford). That this sometimes ends up in a p*ssing contest, is a different affair; and a sad one too. I fear that exactly this will happen when people see how CM2 is modelled, when they see that their wishes are not being implemented in the game. I'm just glad that I'm not in the skin of the BTS guys and I still look forward to the game. Schugger ------------------ Specking checked with Checkspeller? Checking checked with Spellspecker? What the heck?

Thanks for the clarification, CavScout

Well, I thought there was an article about mortar indirect fire procedure at http://combathq.thegamers.net , but I couldn't find it under the article section. You should check them out, as you find them to be very informative anyway. But I could not let you go without the information you requested, so I have to put on my director's cappi and say:" Indirect mortar fire in CM, Take 3278 aaaaaand ACTION" There are two ways you can use mortar IF ( indirect Firing) in CM; the first one is using a TRP ( Target Reference Point - the big target marker the Germans have in Valley of Trouble) and using HQ units as mortar spotters. Lets deal with the TRP thingie first: During setup you can put the TRP anywhere you like. For example at chokepoints where you think the US is going to make their main thrust towards the objectives. Your mortar units can target or a position close to it the TRP from any position, but they may not move at all!!! After your mortar units have moved all the precious pre-calculated data of vectors, projectile drift and relative moon humidity are lost. Did I say you shouldn't move your mortar units when you want to use the TRP? Fire at the TRP is highly accurate and the ROF of the mortars is increased. When you have the full version ( I hope you order it soon) the delay times for your artillery forward observers is also decreased, but that is another matter which is dealt with in John Woo's new action movie " Friday night firefight - ChoppieChoppie in Chinatown". Now for the HQ units used as spotters for mortar units: The mortar units must be in command of the HQ unit used as spotter ( look at the red-brown line from the HQ drawn to the mortar units). Use then the LOS toll from the command menu for the HQ unit to check out what the HQ can actually see. You can now target any spot with your mortar units ( commanded by the HQ in question, of course) using AREA FIRE. It is important that the target line for each mortar unit is orange ( indicating area fire). It doesn't matter if your mortar units have moved before for using this kind of IF. The drawback of it is that your mortar units fire at the spot for the whole turn, using up precious ammo, weather the enemy has moved out of the area or not. Yes, that's it. Where is my free copy of CM2 BTS? [This message has been edited by Schugger (edited 10-16-2000).] Cool, they have a spell checker! [This message has been edited by Schugger (edited 10-16-2000).]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by *Captain Foobar*: [b....but the scoring system that CMHQ is supposed to use would be superior to any of them....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> It is so superior that it doesn't work I like the RD ladder. It has a simple scoring system and - most important of all - it works.

Lol! Cool story. I like the first picture where the guys didn't face the the tank and I swear I heard someone saying: "Huh? Where is the tank, Sarge?"

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by STRAKER: The ai does stupid, funnny and sometimes crazy things.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hehe! Believe me, the same holds true HI

Well, I never posted a picture but to do it, the image you want to post has to be hosted on a webpage. Then, when you post a message where you want to include a picture you post the link to the picture using the ubb-code thingie ( whatever that means). The whole process is described in the faq section ( upper left corner of this page, below the "post repley" button). I hope I didn't miss the point of your question. Schugger

Weren't the 75mm sherman variants not designed as Main Battle tanks? IIRC the M4 variants entered production when germany's MBT was the Pz III. Perhaps it was just bad luck that they entered the ETO and faced an opponent which had already learned his lessons in tank warfare in Russia. However, I find the 75mm Sherman one of the best "allrounders" in the game: They excel in support roles, can destroy most of the german tanks frontally and with their fast turrets and high speed they can catch the heavies off guard. ------------------ Ich liebe Dein! Ich kann ohne Dir nicht bin.

Oh cool, Macho women with big guns...and beards they must have, really long beards like those we saw at the Olympic Games by the chinese athletes. Prone to fanaticism they have to be, ripping apart german armour with their bare hands. Lets not forget about the late war german BDM Kampfgruppe, each individual a real, mean Kampfmaschine capable of performing combat actions which put the Rambo movies to shame. I have a vision... ( Huch? Where are my pills?) ------------------ Ich liebe Dein! Ich kann ohne Dir nicht bin.

Fabio The CM turney is hosted by the <Rugged Defence website at http://home.wanadoo.nl/edwin.vos/cm/cm.htm Unfortunatly, the turney has started ( it is in round two, IIRC) and we have to wait until it is finished before we can participate in a new one. ------------------ Ich liebe Dein! Ich kann ohne Dir nicht bin.

I'm sure you get well soon, Slapdragon. Main charakters got script immunity, "Redshirts" don't Markus

Yes, I have and I tell you that these were the most satisfaying games I've played. It does not happen very often though and spmetimes there are games when you know that you're definatly going to end as the looser.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Olle Petersson: From what I've read in the manual, Sneak is the leg equivalent of Hunt, i.e. troops are most likely to shoot while sneaking, lesser so while walking, running or crawling. As usual they rarely stop to shoot until they reach a waypoint though... Cheers Olle<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hi Olle Well, my conclusions came from personel experiance with the game. In my first games I tried the sneak order to establish combat contact but usually the result was that the squad sneaks towards the plotted waypoint and only shoots if it recieves fire ( which is usually disastrous at close ranges encountered in woods for example). However, if you use the sneak order and plot the waypoint exactly so far that your squad get in LOS of the enemy, your chances that you close in unnoticed by he enemy are better which results in you getting the important first volley. One of the greatest disadvantages when using this kind of micromanagement ( i.e. "I must plot my sneak order in this direction for exactly 9 meters to get LOS") is that enemy infantry moves sometimes and are not in the position where they were during your order phase. The drawback of using the move order to make contact is that the Firepower is penalized. After all, I know only one man who was able to fire the german LMG from the hip while moving and hit something. Dr Brian AFAIK, close combat occurs only at very close ranges ( I guess 10 meters or less). You must be really careful if you want to engage the enemy at close quarters. Charging an unsupressed enemy squad in good order is bloody for both sides - if you were lucky. Also check out if the squads you are planing to use for the assault have LOS to the enemy. If they have not do not use the run order for your entire movement plot as their awareness is reduced ( they don't see so much) and then blunder into the enemy - breakfeast time! Use different movement orders for your attack path, a short move order at a point from which your squad can see the enemy to be attacked and then again a run order for the final path. Better yet, take the time to prepare your attack: Postion a platoon with which you plan to assault where you can see the enemy. Lay down surpressive fire for a turn to see if they duck their heads ( then you know your fire has some effect) and then clean the house, foxhole or whatever.

I only use the crawl order if I want to disengage troops which are under fire to a safer place. I rarly use it to move MGs, mortar units, etc. into position. Units acting under this order tire very easily. Sneak: I use only if I want to be sure that my moving troops do not open fire while they advance, to prevent that they give away their position. They shoot only if they are under fire so it is definitly not the right order to engage the enemy. Usually I finish the sneak order with a hide order. Move: I use this order usually when combat contact is close or I suspect the enemy to be near. Units under this order seem to fire as soon as the enemy is in LOS. Run: To bring a squad from cover A to cover B, often followed by a sneak order so that the enemy will loose LOS to the squad. Also to enter close combat. Hope this helps Markus

I'm also very sorry to hear this, pzvg. My best wishes for your father, yourself and your family. Markus

Do you have any old board games? Some players here have converted ASL maps into CM maps with the editor. I have an old AH boardgame called "Thunder at Cassino" and started to make some maps at 1km X 1km scale. OoBs is a different matter as one counter in the game is an entire infantry platoon.