Even more ranting in praise of the Cold War for CMX2 :)

[Berlichtingen]

Originally posted by MikeyD:

I'm (still) torn on platform upgrades. I genuinely fear the PC and I'm getting more comfortable with running mac OSX at work, but it would be SOOOOO nice to have both CMx2 and that new T72:Balkans tank sim to play with. Decisions decisons.

No big decision... I picked up a cheap PC for not a lot more than a Playstation. That's what I use it for. Games that don't run on Mac

[kipanderson]

Steve,

“Kip, it isn't so much about the money as it is the creative burnout and frustration levels.”

Yup..I understand.

There was even more good news for me in your post when talking about the possible titles of future games,

“I'll at least go so far as to say that contemporary (i.e. current/near future) combat is on there”

It may not be Cold War, but I will get a new set of toys to play with the technology is a big part of the fun for me. (But true science fiction I cannot cope with… do not have the imagination gene..)

All sounds great,

All the best,

Kip.

[MikeyD]

I recall an 'official' statement some time ago saying that CMx2 has been set up so that some of the work can be farmed-out then plugged-in. In my fevered imagination I picture some freelance Russian design house assembling - at this very moment - Space Lobster combat vehicle polygons... or maps... or interface graphics, allowing BFC to concentrate on hard-core game mechanics. I rather wonder just which portions of the design work BFC would be willing to relinquish to others' hands!

If you look over BFC's chat forums you can see they're developing relationships with a growing number of interesting game design houses. In the end that can only bode well for CMx2.

[Michael Dorosh]

Originally posted by MikeyD:

I recall an 'official' statement some time ago saying that CMx2 has been set up so that some of the work can be farmed-out then plugged-in. In my fevered imagination I picture some freelance Russian design house assembling - at this very moment - Space Lobster combat vehicle polygons... or maps... or interface graphics, allowing BFC to concentrate on hard-core game mechanics. I rather wonder just which portions of the design work BFC would be willing to relinquish to others' hands!

If you look over BFC's chat forums you can see they're developing relationships with a growing number of interesting game design houses. In the end that can only bode well for CMx2.

Still, to further my musings on the last page - if KwazyDog did up the polygons and data for Canadian units for, say, a Juno Beach module, or a Gold/Sword/Juno module, the relevant data would still be there for, say, a Totalize module, if the map and scenario/campaign editor were "soft" coded. Some exciting possibilities. Or once the units were in place for, say, a Hürtgen Forest module, you would have the hardwired stuff that was needed to do an Operation GRENADE module.

If the community will be lending a hand in producing the "soft" stuff, I say great - I'd buy a FALAISE GAP module edited by Kingfish any day, based on his recent St. Lambert scenario.

Or maybe a few of us would collaborate on a Grossdeutschland module that focusses on one unit over a period of time with generic maps. I can see stuff like Leibstandarte being a popular seller, focussing on the I.SS across the spectrum of operations in Italy, East and West. Lots of possibilities. Look at Panther Commander's and others unit based - scenario offerings - US 2nd Armored Division,

[Tarkus]

Originally posted by Michael Dorosh:

[snip] Or maybe a few of us would collaborate on a Grossdeutschland module that focusses on one unit over a period of time with generic maps. I can see stuff like Leibstandarte being a popular seller, focussing on the I.SS across the spectrum of operations in Italy, East and West. Lots of possibilities. Look at Panther Commander's and others unit based - scenario offerings - US 2nd Armored Division,

Very interesting idea I say.

[Kellysheroes]

Goes away grumbling about "Space Lobsters" even being part of a BFC title. <mumble, mumble, groan>

[aka_tom_w]

Steve? Is this what you are trying to tell us:

There's The NEW CMx2 Engine - (multi-functional, pan-dimensional living breathing, masterpiece of game code, pinnacle of game development achievement of ALL TIME!) or, the underpinings of everything

There's The Game - Era specific... WW2, Cold War (NOT likely or so we are told), Space Lobsters, whateever ( Korean "conflict" MAYBE Arab-Israeli wars? )

There's The Module - Narrow focus addons to The Game. Normandy, Battle of the Bulge, Austerlitz, whatever.

(no more than 2-3 modules PER Game/Era ( with a new one maybe every 6-8 months?)

BUT if the Game/era is WWII how could we (the CMxx Hardcore which are extremely well represented in this thread ) possibly be happy with only 2-3 modules FOR ALL of WWII unless I am missing something here OR the Modules you speak of are somehow quite broad and generous?? (larger than the narrow scope of one battle that I am lead to believe?)

Maybe I just can't see the "BIG" picture yet? :confused:

BUT I am trying

-tom w

P.S. and I am guessing from the tang, taste and texture of the recent bones (gristle and ALL!) the first game MAY not be WWII but some other interesting historically significant armed conflict between WWII about 15 years ago maybe??

Originally posted by Berlichtingen:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Kellysheroes:

In essence we'll still be getting the same "value" for our $$ in cost, but, we probably won't get the "longevity" of each game like we did CMBO/CMBB/CMAK that's the kicker and that is what will turn some consumers off to the new idea of module based games vs full theater of operations and all those vehicles, infantry, etc. etc. all in one package.

Actually, if I understood the module concept, they add on to the existing game. So, new module comes out, I don't though the old one in the drawer, I keep playing with additonal capabilities.

Just in case I misunderstood Steve, here's my take on what he's said...

There's The Engine - the underpinings of everything

There's The Game - Era specific... WW2, Cold War, Space Lobsters, whaterever

There's The Module - Narrow focus addons to The Game. Normandy, Battle of the Bulge, Austerlitz, whatever.

So, we get a game with vastly more play options followed by modules that extend the unit possibilities.

I really don't see what all the whining's aboot </font>

[Michael Emrys]

Okay then, let me say that I'm betting that the first CMx2 game is going to be Operation Desert Storm. Following that as modules, Iraqi Freedom, the Iran-Iraq war, and maybe some other Middle East Combat.

My guess is that the Arab-Israeli Wars would be a completely different set of packages and would not appear for a while.

In between could be all sorts of things, Napoleonics, Korea, American Civil War, ETO, Thirty Years War...

Michael

[kipanderson]

Hi,

We all have to harden are selves to the fact that some of the settings for future games will not be to our individual tastes. Once you get away from WWII NWE and Eastern Front the numbers who are wildly enthusiastic about the setting decreases fast. But Steve knows all this. He made clear that Charles and himself are feeling somewhat burnt out on WWII, but in the long-run WWII is still their favourite single setting for wargames.

My money is on one of the classic WWII NWE or Eastern Front settings for the first game with CMX2. That would be by far the safest bet for them. Also, I would bet on around 50% of the settings for new games being WWII over the entire CMX2.

Of course, remember that one very positive aspect of modules is that while Steve and Charles work on Space Lobsters others will be releasing WWII modules to keep us hard-core WWII fans happy.

Contemporary/current does appeal to me in terms of the toys to play with… but I cannot think of a real world setting that would be credible. But you can be sure BFC have thought of that too… so they must have come up with a fun setting of some sort . (I know there is Iraq, but that is more “shooter” or FPS territory… it is all so wildly one sided I am not sure it would make for a “wargame”, in my view. But it will be fun to see what they come up with even if they do go for Iraq.)

Lots to look forward to ,

All the best,

Kip.

[jeffsmith]

Originally posted by kipanderson:

My money is on one of the classic WWII NWE or Eastern Front settings for the first game with CMX2. That would be by far the safest bet for them. Also, I would bet on around 50% of the settings for new games being WWII over the entire CMX2.

I second that

My thoughts

First CMX2 game is somewhere in NW Europe WWII

with a few modules to follow

to cover the core of the "fan base"

2nd CMX2 game is Arab/Israeli Wars

the beginning part of that conflict

has much of the WWII weapons already researched by BFC

plus "updated" warfare modules as it progresses

for those who want modern combat

[Ardem]

Well just looking at the unoffical top 5 it looks like I may get one or two, and they will probably be worse selling then a Italian module.

Ancient why both the Total War series has got a monopoly, and Rome Total War while wasn't fantastic but was still very good.

Dragonshard made by D@D with the account there will revolutionise Fantasy gaming

Space stuff, Zero interest of future battles.

Space SciFi RTS/strategy have not done well with the exception of starcraft.

US Civil war, quite frankly not being american, and am tired of american only strategies and the civil war would have only a majority appeal to only americans.

Coming from a personal view point I think each of these games maybe a risky business decision regardless of quality of gameplay.

I think your only real seller will be the World War 2 CMx2. Hope I am wrong for your sakes.

[Mace]

Originally posted by Ardem:

I think your only real seller will be the World War 2 CMx2. Hope I am wrong for your sakes.

I think recent events (say over the last 15 years) has generated an interest in modern combat.

For example, Military model sales increased as a result of Desert Storm in 1991, and some popular PC based wargames were released and sold fairly well (eg SSI's Wargame Construction Kit:Tanks, and Steel Panthers 2).

Mace

[Battlefront.com]

Mace is correct. Recent past, current, near future combat is now a BIG part of gaming. I'd say as big as WWII at the moment.

There are plenty of other genres that can generate interest. Timing has something to do with it, but so too does the game itself. Look at Total War for example. No huge, established following for their subject matter (not compared to WWII) but from where I sit they did just fine

Now back to the concept of Modules...

You guys basically have it right. The Engine supports Games, each Game supports its own set of Modules. The purpose of the Module is to expand the scope of the Game.

As stated, the starting scope of each Game will be much more focused than with CMx1 releases. Therefore we would never release a "World War Two" game. We would, instead, release a Western Front Game + Modules and an Eastern Front + Modules. While they are both WWII, and share a little in common, basically they are two entirely different games. That was true for CMx1 and it is certainly true for CMx2.

Steve

[Battlefront.com]

Moving to new home!