hoolaman Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Found on youtube, US Military video of training at Grafenwoehr. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 hoolaman, Nice find! Had never seen a through the CLU view before, though I've seen lots of equivalent shots of Maverick lock-ons. In closing, I wonder if the Americans ever arrested the master spy Suvorov talked about, the German farmer who retrieved TOW missile carcasses that overshot into the woods, collected them in his cart, and sold them to the Russians! Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sivodsi Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Oh boy! Did you hear the noise from the POV of the tank? Little whistle then boom! I want it in CMSF! Somebody pleeease make a sound mod! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoolaman Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Yeah it's pretty sweet. Are the targets old M-60s? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Sivodsi, That would suggest it's not supersonic when it hits, else it would be like that great scene in Operation Crossbow in which a block of flats goes sky high, then comes the shriek of the arriving V-2. Like your idea! hoolaman, Didn't get a good look, but I think so. Thought I saw mid barrel bore evacuators. Regarding the master spy/enterprising German farmer, guess it would be the Germans doing the arresting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M60_Patton Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 The hulks are M48s. They are all over the ranges of Germany. I think the US Army has killed more M48s than any tank in the world. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luderbamsen Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 So, the view through the CLU is black-and-white, not green-and-less-green? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoolaman Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Yes it would seem so. The sight is IR based not NVG style light enhanced. That makes sense because the missile locks on on this basis. There is a video linked in the right "similar videos" panel for a Javelin training system which shows a similar screen view. It is interesting to see how a real armoured target gets hit by a Javelin, it seems to do a good job of penetrating but the explosion is far from catastrophic (allowing for the fact that no ammo or fuel is stowed in those hulks). It is nothing like the famous T72 full of C4 launch that has been shown around the place. I still think the tanks are M60s based on the angular turret sides, but my familiarity with either tank is shorter than the posting of this video. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 You can reverse the image if you want so that darker means hotter but most guys just leave it like it is. I like the CLU's black and white image more than the Red image with the TOW and Dragon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 I used a real Javelin CLU plugged into a computer that provided a simulated environment. The CLU had gyros on it to accurately simulate sensitivity due to breathing and anything else that would move the CLU relative to the real world environment. It is an amazing system, that's for sure. From what I can remember the view was B&W and you had a small joystick to set the recitals on the desired target. The purpose of this is to narrow down the heat signature and concentrate the missile on that instead of background "noise". Once you've got it sufficiently focused you go for a lock and it tells you if it can or can't get a lock. If you do, then you can fire. If you don't, I can't remember if it allows you to fire anyway. With only a few minutes of training and a demonstration, Charles and I were able to use the system without difficulty. It took a couple of tries to get fast on the targeting side, but it really wasn't that tough and it totally depended on what the target was and what it was doing. Much easier to get the lock focused on something sitting out in the open and not moving vs. something moving behind tree cover. But surprisingly easy for the latter situations. I forget our scores, but they were good enough that the Colonel with us wanted to draft Charles Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan/california Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Charles would immediately be routed to the NSA or the boffins that that tickle radars with such delicate precision that it thinks every thing on the screen is 30 degrees clockwise from its real position, and twice as far away. That is if the radar is allowed to realize anything is there in the first place. Steve on the other hand.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 ... would be tasked with cleaning the latrines. Yes, I know! Why do you think I went to college instead of the Army? I'd rather be bent over a latrine emptying the contents of my stomach after a hard day/night of drinking than being the one that has to clean it up Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handihoc Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Steve, I was under the (perhaps erroneous) impression that you and Charles have no military background. If that's so, how do you get to play with Javelins? Can I play too! And what does CLU stand for? I googled it, but nothing relevant shows up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Dave Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Command Launch Unit I believe long night at work here..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handihoc Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Thank you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Yeah, neither Charles nor I ever did a stint in the military. Though I came close to doing stints with chain gangs, but that's another story A number of years ago we were being courted by TRADOC to make a simulation for their anti-tank missile systems. The reason is that they have kick-ass first person simulators (like the Javelin one we used, which was still a prototype) without any context. The simulators, including Humvees sitting inside big rooms with projection screens (which is a funny sight!), presume way too much has already gone on to get the gunner into position. Additionally, these are not combined arms simulators. With field training being radically reduced over the years (this was pre-9/11) it was pretty much classroom chalkboard exercises. So the concept was to have a simulation that helped junior leadership with deployment of their teams within the context of a larger tactical battlespace. Checking out terrain, ranges, neighboring units for support, etc. were all seen as being inherently present in CMBO. Just needed to update it to modern stuff We managed to secure a contract in principle, but just before we finally had a draft contract to look at OIF came and took all our funding. Which was OK with us because military contracts can be a significant hassle for small guys like us. And to continue my useless attempts at squashing clueless rumor mongers... CM:SF was not developed for the US military. We made it because we wanted to make it. We knew going into it that the chances of securing a military contract were slightly better than winning the lottery. If the military liked what it saw, then sure we'd be willing to talk. Unfortunately, there's all sorts of people in the various militaries and defense industries around the world that are authorized to talk, but we never seem to get beyond that stage (we've had talks with a couple dozen probably). Which just reinforces our notion that basing commercial business decisions on fantasy military contracts is not a very smart thing to do. But I do hope I get to the stage of playing with hardware and watching tanks blow up again Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Command Launch Unit I believe long night at work here..... Yep that's what it stands for and you pronounce it as one word not as three letters. The Javelin gunner ends up being the only guy in the unit with a CLU. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Steve, I've played with a bunch of those simulators. The TOW one is pretty neat and so is the Dragon. I never got to play with the Javelin one. Played with the real thing a bunch but never even saw the sim. Of course the Javelin was REALLY new when I was messing with it. In their quest for more situational training aids the Army started using the FATS which some civilian police forces use. It showed a video of a situation and had sever targets to engage with model weapons. It was pretty neat and I was certified to run it which meant that when all the senior guys wanted a break they stuck me running the damn thing for the entire battalion. That was 18 years ago so who knows what they have now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFCElvis Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 I am a Javelin slut. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoolaman Posted September 19, 2008 Author Share Posted September 19, 2008 is the Javelin simulator system video I was talking about. Probably the same thing Steve refers to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Heh... yeah, that's the system, that's the place, and I'm preeeeeety sure I met that guy in the video. But damn, that was a bunch of years ago so I can't say for sure on the last bit. Notice the computer monitor as he's talking. Notice how it's moving in synch with the Jav system he's holding. They were damned proud of the gyro synch with the sim giving a very realistic experience. Damn impressive. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampshade111 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 The Javelin is certainly a very capable ATGM. I would not want to run into an enemy with those in any MBT. In regards to the video of a T-72 being hit by a Javelin, yeah it had C4 in it but that was supposed to represent the full load of ammunition and fuel going off. I get really tired of people shouting "fake" everytime they see that one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handihoc Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 The Javelin gunner ends up being the only guy in the unit with a CLU. Heh-heh-heh! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theFightingSeabee Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Play Americas Army for a javelin simulator simulator. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Lampshade111, We were sitting in a bunker for Jav strike on a T-72 (running) that was not loaded with ammo. The Jav hit the track instead of the top, so there wasn't anything near that catastrophic explosion that the famous video shows. But the assessment team later declared it a total kill as there were penetrations through the engine and crew compartments sufficient enough to render the tank completely incapable of action. So indeed there are a wide range of possible results from a Jav hit, including that one we all know and love BTW, I hung out for 2 days with the 1SGT that fired the Jav at that tank. As he said, "I have the best job in the world"! Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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