flamingknives Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 Came across this pic while nosing through the red orchestra forums. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 Cool. What is it? Cheerio Dandelion 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 3, 2005 Author Share Posted January 3, 2005 Would have thought the thread title would have given it away. It's an Ampulomet. That useless fire-chucker that the Soviets get in '41 and early '42. The Glass globe (1) is full of nasty burny stuff and phophorous and is fired from the launcher (2) using a gunpowder charge. IIRC. I'd never seen a pic of one and thought it worth sharing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meravelha Posted January 3, 2005 Share Posted January 3, 2005 It was. Looks like something out of the Hundred Years War. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pzman Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 It's an Ampulomet. That useless fire-chucker that the Soviets get in '41 and early '42.Well not totally useless. They do well at killing Pz.II's and some other early German panzers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPK Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 In the TO&E of the 1941 Russian infantry bn, aren't the ampulomets grouped into a "Tank Destroyer Platoon"? I've had (some) success using them in this role, but they are also very good at setting fire to grainfields during the week-long Dry Season 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Not useless at all. They can take out Stugs and can be fired from within buildings. Put a +2 stealth HQ with them in a heavy building and they are invisible and deadly. Drawbacks are low ammo load and inaccuracy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skolman Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Thank´s for posting that picture! I always wondered how this weapon looked like! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrpwase Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 I.e. they don't actually look like a slightly longer 82mm mortar at a different angle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandelion Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 Originally posted by flamingknives: Would have thought the thread title would have given it away.You underestimate the ignorant I don't own CMBB, I merely parasite on the forum to read interesting debate. It seemed like nobody was going to ask, so I had to. Didn't even know this here... thing, existed. I agree with Meravelha on the aesthetic issue. Cheers Dandelion 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSX Posted January 4, 2005 Share Posted January 4, 2005 I used to wonder how to use this thing in BB, however i have had a lot of kills with it against Jerry armour, 1 team even managed to take out 2 PzIII and a PzIV, from the side and rear but still it puts the willies up any tank crew if it hits. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted January 5, 2005 Share Posted January 5, 2005 Opponents scream about ampuloments because they seem to be MUCH more effective in CM than they were in real life. The CM troops do have an inordinate dislike for being set on fire for some reason 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted January 6, 2005 Share Posted January 6, 2005 Best picture I've ever seen of one! How's this for a truly heretical idea, though, for Germans invade England scenarios? Mod the Russians into British Home Guard, with the ampulomet as the stand-in for the Northover Projector and Bates Eight-Barrel Bottle Thrower. Obviously, the Germans would remain as designed. Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted January 6, 2005 Author Share Posted January 6, 2005 There's been at least one Sealion mod for CMAK 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted January 7, 2005 Share Posted January 7, 2005 flamingknives, I know, but I am unaware that anyone has come up with any kind of even semieffective approach to model the two weapons mentioned, plus the Blacker Bombard, hence my "modest proposal." Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted January 8, 2005 Share Posted January 8, 2005 Ampulomets If your interested in a scenario that uses these odd little weapons please try the CMBB scenario 'Sons of a Hero'. Made for play with you as the Germans vs the AI or another player. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphus Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 I'm working on one called "Firebug" which uses ampulomets, flamethrowers and FT tanks to set fire to a wood where the Germans are lurking. It's great to see them scurrying out from those burning forests! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted January 9, 2005 Share Posted January 9, 2005 murphus, The Germans in Russia did something similar historically as part of a large scale counterpartisan operation. I have a book of German combat sketches and pastels, and the piece covering that op is quite gripping and looks much like what you describe. Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpitfireXI Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 Ok I know this is an old topic but I was playing with these the other night and found that you cannot use them in indirect fire like a motar. I swear I did this in the past, but have you had any luck using an HQ unit to spot for them? Also, I found out that they can take out AT guns if given enough time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer_M Posted December 23, 2005 Share Posted December 23, 2005 Did the germans ever use captured examples officially? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted December 24, 2005 Share Posted December 24, 2005 MikeyD is not wrong - these are much more effective in CM than in real life. Their effectiveness exceeds that of the 45mm ATG. Here are some test results. 1941 vehicles, lined up facing them at 200m, the ampus in foxholes in scattered trees. At that range and with that cover, the Germans never spot them. Point number one - very stealthy. The hit chances range from 75% to 90% depending on target size. Very, very high, apparently from modeling the chance of hitting the whole tile of terrain. Basically these things rarely miss. They also fire 8 shots a turn, so if unspotted each one will rack up 6-7 hits. Point number two - they actually hit and do so often. IVE was partially penetrated from the front, NSD but crew still panicked, after 53 seconds. IVC front turret pen KO after 40 seconds. StuG III B FUH pen KO and brews up after 1 second. III H track hit M-kill after 43 seconds. III G FUH pen -1 crew, shock in 7 seconds. M-kill in addition at 17 seconds, they bail. 38(t) E model - FUH hit -1 crew, shock at 2 seconds, FUH partial pen, KO at 10 seconds. II F FUH pen KO at 2 seconds Somua S-35 FUH pen -1 crew, shock at 1 second. End of first minute - 5 KOed, 1 M-killed, 1 -1 crew, 1 panicked but otherwise OK. I'd call that effective. Fast forward to May of 1943, just before the tank hunters get RPGs. This time targets of Tigers, Pz IVG (late), StuGs late-mid, and III Ls. One each facing toward them and sideways, flank shot. Tiger front - M-kill 1 second Tiger side - M-kill 48 seconds Pz IV front - NSD, OK Pz IV side - side UH pen, KO after 10 seconds StuG front - FUH -1 crew, shock 3 seconds StuG side - SUH pen, KO after 2 seconds Pz III front - NSD, OK Pz III side - gun hit gun damaged after 35 seconds. After 1 minute, 2 full KOs, 2 M-kills, 1 gun damage, 1 -1 crew, 2 OK. Effectiveness with a flank shot, very high. Yes I will be taking a lot more of these for Russian anti-tank work in the pre-RPG era. Before the 80mm fronts show up, you can use them regardless of target aspect, at near max range to avoid detection. Against the thicker later stuff, wait for a side shot. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 JasonC, After reading your Ampulomet firing test results with considerable interest, I confess myself baffled by the penetrations listed, unless we're talking through vision slits on early German armor and via smashed in vision blocks and such on later armor? If not, then please explain the physics and estimated KE of what I believe was a frangible projectile. IOW, how is it doing all this damage? Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 The "penetration" potential of the flame projectile is apparently being modeled as something above 50mm, but with high variance. Plates with 30mm or less seem to offer little protection. I have never seen an 80mm plate reported as penetrated. I have not seen enough 50mm plates hit to form a definite judgment of the penetration frequency, but I have seen partials and pens in some of the tests. My guess is that internally, the effect of the flame projective is being modeled as 25-50mm highly variable penetration, with highly variable behind armor effect as well. The accuracy is so high that each ampulet gets 5-7 hits over a minute of firing, if the range is sufficient for it to remain undetected and so get off all 8 of its shots (unsuppressed by any reply etc). 2-3 of these will "roll" a high penetration value, sufficient to get through 30mm armor, and at least one of those will "roll" a good behind armor effect. Thus the pattern seen, of 30mm plate vehicles generally KOed or damaged within a minute, while 80mm vehicles are sometimes damaged but rarely destroyed outright. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bannon DC Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Ampulomets are also very effective against crewed weapons. Good chance of getting them to abandon a gun or getting mortar and MG crews to panic and try to pull out of the area. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 JasonC, I appreciate the clarification, but I'm still confused by the dynamics. Am I to understand that the Ampulomet projectile is heavy enough, strong enough and traveling fast enough to actually smash right through armor plate? Tell me more! Do you by any chance have a photo or drawing of the projectile? Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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