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Worrying 60mm mortar behavior


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Pbem game. Have the setup. US defense. I had a 60mm mortar team in a foxhole, about 500 meters from advancing Russians. I target light a patch of woods I saw an RPG team enter.  Mind you this same mortar team had already fired off a few mortar rounds on same setting at another target.  The mortar man calmly stops using the mortar, picks up his m4 CARBINE and starts popping off rounds, in 2  round bursts. He got an ainet over the foxhole for his brilliant move. Mortar destroyed, he's dead, rest of crew yellow wounded. What gives I thought we fixed the crews firing small arms at long distances in like BN 1.12?

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There is nothing worrying about this, don't use target light on close targets, that encourages infantry to use there rifles. On target they will always use the mortar first.

 

I don't think this is true for mortars. For that unit type Target Light means "fire the mortar at a slower rate of fire than Target", not "fire your rifle instead".

 

I'll look into it.

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I don't think this is true for mortars. For that unit type Target Light means "fire the mortar at a slower rate of fire than Target", not "fire your rifle instead".

 

I'll look into it.

That used to be the behavior.  I haven't used direct fire mortars in CMBS yet.

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no. the change in BN was crews woild use small arms less in almost all cases except enemy VERY close. and ive fired 60s at targets 100m distant on light in BN and the mortar just does 1-2 rounds a minute. trust me i was here for every iteration and chance and paid a lot of attemtiom mortars alone were complete game winners for a long time in BN.

MOS you @ss ;) dont make me start posting pictures of blown up abrams from 2 matches ago :)

Edited by Sublime
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  • 3 weeks later...

I finally got around to this.

 

At 450 meters:

 

1) Target enemy unit: mortar used

2) Target area fire: mortar used

3) Target Light enemy unit: mortar used

4) Target Light area fire: small arms used

 

#4 may be a bug and has been reported.

 

Vanir,

 

Thanks for taking the time to do this and inform the rest of us about the results.  Not to mention the reporting of a possible bug.  This type of factual post about game mechanics is always interesting and useful.  One of the main reasons I read through dozens of threads on the forum is to find a useful nugget of information like this.  Thanks again.  

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I am confused, in my mind target light means just that, they should not use the mortar.

If I want a target light w/ mortars. I use target area fire and use the target briefly, normally no less than 30 seconds.

They don't have to see the target, I don't waste too much ammo and I get the max. amount of rounds I can in a short time frame.

But call it a bug if you like

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Well, thus the reason I have never noticed it, because the command never made sense to use anyway.

The only place that would make sense is if I wanted it as harassing fire, which I don't think I would ever do with a small 60. Maybe a 81,

but anyway.

A command that is almost non existent in my playbook

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actually if you use 60s in hedgerow fighting theyre very accurate. well really any fighting but i first really realized how deadly they were in hedgerow fighting in BN. so instead of blowing through half your ammo in a minuteba target light would suffice to KO that MG and select another target next turn. it increased the amount of kills my 60s would get by quite a bit by saving ammunition

its not harrassing fire like one round a minute its more like three/ four rnds a minute dialed back from 8-10 or something (numbers picked at random to illistrate point)

Edited by Sublime
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With Target Light, you can "walk" light mortar fire (works for Brixias and leGw36s in the WW2 titles, too) over a long distance across the space of several minutes. At normal "Target" RoF, you burn through your ammo way too fast. At sub-500m (sub-200 for the Axis versions and the 2", but you rarely get enough ammo to walk 2" fire anywhere, even at Light), the little beauts are accurate enough that you don't need a full minute of "Target"-weight fire to put paid to many classes of opposition. I once broke an entire platoon of german infantry in FI by walking the 60mm's fire up the wall they were behind from out of their effective response range, and still had ammo left. At Target weight, I'd've been dry.

 

If the enemy are moving through a bottleneck, Target Light is enough to stop them where they are, and keep the gap bottled up; with Target, you'd be able to keep that up for a minute. The ones you stop are dead anyway, if you plan on interdicting that route; no point in wasting bombs killing them in the first minute.

 

Oddly, there are occasions where overkill is a thing. :)

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and this was noted at the time as a feature or a fix. it was a direct result of mortar crews screwing themselves by firing their personal weapons at enemy units during direct lay which led to massacres of mortar units and other crew served weapons. Plus whilst I do see some logic in what you say sly though we play differently. at the same the issue was with all crew served weapons and it was rlly frustrating for say Pak 40 crews to open up with rifles on US infantry. yes yes covered arcs mumble.mumble. womble really explained it best.

Edited by Sublime
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actually if you use 60s in hedgerow fighting theyre very accurate. well really any fighting but i first really realized how deadly they were in hedgerow fighting in BN. so instead of blowing through half your ammo in a minuteba target light would suffice to KO that MG and select another target next turn. it increased the amount of kills my 60s would get by quite a bit by saving ammunition

its not harrassing fire like one round a minute its more like three/ four rnds a minute dialed back from 8-10 or something (numbers picked at random to illistrate point)

Understand, but I get the same results in 30 seconds. And if I have not killed them it seems to be more prone to make them panic.

So I will stay with Briefly target and set for 30 seconds

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If the enemy are moving through a bottleneck, Target Light is enough to stop them where they are, and keep the gap bottled up; with Target, you'd be able to keep that up for a minute. The ones you stop are dead anyway, if you plan on interdicting that route; no point in wasting bombs killing them in the first minute.

Well this is what I call harassing fire and yes it makes sense here. But it still is a rare event. Thus the reason I have not seen a issue.

Of course light rifle area fire into this type of situation also works, So maybe still not a big issue.

I am just pointing out that I thought light fire with mortars meant it is not going to use the mortar.(So I see I am wrong)

Saving rounds, I have been using fire briefly. I can hardly remember using a full minute of mortar fire in game except on enemy in a trench line for a long time

Edited by slysniper
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