Jump to content

C2 icons in the game and in the manual


kensal
 Share

Recommended Posts

Page 29 of the manual covers the user interface for C2. It says:

ScreenShot2014-02-03at224231_zpsf7d1e191.png

If you look at the third sentence of para 7, it says "In the previous example, if the icon beside the "1st Platoon" entry is red, then the 1st Plt is out of contact with A Compay HQ..."

Then the manuscript note tells you that this part of the interface does not tell you anything about the selected unit being in C2 - that is indicated in the C2 link (point 9 below)

Point 9 tells you to look at the eye and voice icons as to whether your selected unit is in C2. In this example it is because it has eyes and ears on 1st Platoon as indicated by the two icons.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

However, now look at these four shots. A German sicherungs battalion, with 1 company, 1 platoon, 1 squad. There is a rather sharp mountainous ridge in the middle:

ScreenShot2014-02-03at223117_zps6e64b639.png

In the above image, 1 squad is out of contact with 1 platoon hq, the ridge intervening. The green/red C2 icon against 1 platoon on 1 squad's UI is red, indicating this.

1 platoon hq, (highlighted), is right next to 1 company hq on the other side of the ridge. 1 platoon is shown to be in contact with 1 company, with a green icon against 1 company on 1 squad's UI. 1 battalion hq is also right next to 1 company hq and is noted as in contact by the green icon against 1 battalion on 1 squad's UI.

ScreenShot2014-02-03at222800_zps52e7f0a2.png

In the above image, 1 platoon hq (highlighted) is now right next to 1 squad. 1 squad is in C2 with 1 platoon. The icon against 1 platoon is green and the eye and voice icons are filled. However, 1 platoon hq, which has no radio, is shown as being out of C2 with 1 company on the other side of the ridge, by the red icon against 1 company in 1 squad's UI.

ScreenShot2014-02-03at222849_zps4c96f378.png

The above image is the same situation as before but with 1 platoon hq selected. No radio, so no C2 with 1 company.

ScreenShot2014-02-03at223038_zps213ea58c.png

In this final image above, 1 company hq has now moved back next to 1 platoon hq. 1 company has a radio (as does 1 battalion). Accordingly, with 1 squad selected, its UI is now showing that it is still in C2 with 1 platoon (as it was in the previous two frames, with a green icon against 1 platoon, but now 1 platoon hq is in contact with 1 company, 1 company having moved right next to it. 1 company remains in C2 with 1 battalion because it and 1 battalion have radios.

I think the manual ought to be amended because it does seem to be saying something completely different to what is happening on the ground.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think I see the point of confusion. Looks like we should simply remove this section:

"NOTE - this part of the interface..."

I think this is an example of the game having worked one way and then another, but the instructions weren't updated. I'll see that it gets fixed.

Thanks!

Steve

I think you need to amend the third sentence in para 7. too - to "in the previous example, if the icon next to "1st Platoon" is red, then the selected unit is out of contact with 1st Platoon HQ while if the icon next to "A Company" is green then 1st Platoon HQ is in contact with A Company HQ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think I see the point of confusion. Looks like we should simply remove this section:

"NOTE - this part of the interface..."

I think this is an example of the game having worked one way and then another, but the instructions weren't updated. I'll see that it gets fixed.

Thanks!

Steve

Steve, thanks for looking in on this and picking it up: can I suggest that, along with the text change itself, the order of explanation is changed to read more left to right across this section, and - say - paras 8 and 9 have their numbers and order swapped, so that the C2 link explanation immediately follows the chain of command explanation (and as the interface shows them, next to one another).

The split of the them was for me part of the problem in the current manual.

Thanks Kensal for prompting this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you need to amend the third sentence in para 7. too - to "in the previous example, if the icon next to "1st Platoon" is red, then the selected unit is out of contact with 1st Platoon HQ while if the icon next to "A Company" is green then 1st Platoon HQ is in contact with A Company HQ

Yeah, that should read:

in the previous example, if the icon next to "1st Platoon" is red then it is out of contact with "A Company".

PhilM, I don't see why not. There was probably some reason for it being in the order it is in now, but I can't see what that reason might be :D

Steve

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Steve, thanks for looking in on this and picking it up: can I suggest that, along with the text change itself, the order of explanation is changed to read more left to right across this section, and - say - paras 8 and 9 have their numbers and order swapped, so that the C2 link explanation immediately follows the chain of command explanation (and as the interface shows them, next to one another).

The split of the them was for me part of the problem in the current manual.

Thanks Kensal for prompting this.

No credit to me for that - I was simply following up James Crowley's post no 136 in the Soviet AAR thread

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Very confusing.

I always thought the indicator besides the Platoon HQ indicates two things, depending on which unit is selected:

If the platoon HQ is selected it displays C2 platoon HQ to the company.

But if a squad is selected, it displays the C2 from the squad to the platoon HQ.

I think it would be less confusing, if there would be a dedicated additional field for C2 of squads/teams, additionally to the eye/shout/gesture indicator.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Very confusing.

I always thought the indicator besides the Platoon HQ indicates two things, depending on which unit is selected:

If the platoon HQ is selected it displays C2 platoon HQ to the company.

But if a squad is selected, it displays the C2 from the squad to the platoon HQ.

I think it would be less confusing, if there would be a dedicated additional field for C2 of squads/teams, additionally to the eye/shout/gesture indicator.

That is what it does show. The problem is that the manual states, wrongly, it seems, that it shows something else. The game engine 3.0 contains, if I understand right, command lines between units on the map and that should give a clearer picture.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, but then it takes up more space :D

Steve

Can you light up the box line? i.e.

----------- (green)

1 Platoon

----------- (green)

A company

----------- (red)

Battalion

for a selected unit that is in C2 with it's parent HQ, it's Company HQ not in C2 with Battalion. Get rid of the lights and save space. (Probably look pretty yuk, but)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to be clear I am understanding this right, the phrase in the manual that says "A green icon indicates that the HQ unit/formation is currently in contact with the next higher HQ unit/formation" is wrong and should really say "A green icon indicates that the HQ unit/formation is currently in contact with the next lower HQ unit/formation"?

This would make sense given that the highest HQ unit can also have a green icon next to it, even though there isn't any unit above it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No credit to me for that - I was simply following up James Crowley's post no 136 in the Soviet AAR thread

Thanks for the 'referral' but it is you who has taken the sensible course of action; researched and illustrated it and put it in it's own thread, thereby getting it noticed by the 'management'.

This has really bugged me for a long time and I think I brought it up on another thread ages ago but it got 'lost'.

So my thanks to you for, it would seem, finally laying this ghost to rest.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to be clear I am understanding this right, the phrase in the manual that says "A green icon indicates that the HQ unit/formation is currently in contact with the next higher HQ unit/formation" is wrong and should really say "A green icon indicates that the HQ unit/formation is currently in contact with the next lower HQ unit/formation"?

Yes, that is correct.

This would make sense given that the highest HQ unit can also have a green icon next to it, even though there isn't any unit above it.

It also makes sense because when a HQ is selected (like the below shot) you get to see the red dot. If the red dot was instead associated with the selected unit (as the manual incorrectly states), then you would look at the C2 Panel and think all was good, even though it is not.

ScreenShot2014-02-03at222849_zps4c96f378.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the 'referral' but it is you who has taken the sensible course of action; researched and illustrated it and put it in it's own thread, thereby getting it noticed by the 'management'.

This has really bugged me for a long time and I think I brought it up on another thread ages ago but it got 'lost'.

So my thanks to you for, it would seem, finally laying this ghost to rest.

Which is what I was getting at in offering the vote of thanks to you, kensal, above. I too had seen and commented on Jim's recent post, and I didtn't mean to ignore that at all, but it was your testing and illustration of the issue that - I think - got it resolved so quickly with Steve.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...