sburke

I think Christmas came early for someone and screw the red rider BB gun, he got multiple textures. Thanks guys, everything you find and create adds to the enjoment for the rest of us. Y'all rock.

well my second guess (am my percentage of guessing successfully here is not good) is perhaps it is coming in the 2nd add on which would extend the game timeline into Sept/Oct 1944. Now let's see what BFC's response is and am I smarter than a 5th grader.

is it possible they may be date specific? In which case I am not sure you can display all units unless there is a timeline that allows them to overlap. Just a thought.

Thanks, yeah I have been following your's and Broadsword's efforts. It what finally spurred me to do this. (Yes it is YOUR fault, between your latest effort and Ramadi you have increased expectations at an unsupportable pace. Kind of like the housing bust. I shall call you Goldman LLF Sachs as my PC crashes unable to move even a single jeep across my map ) I am still debating the scaling issue. I hadn't thought about it prior to my previous post, but by altering the scale I unwittingly altered the dynamics of how the CM engine is going to be able to replicate the engagement. As the primary fighting is broken up into non mutually supporting fights, maintaining the master map becomes less important. The main battlegrounds are the initial fighting to sieze Vossenack, then the first US thrust that carries all the way to Schmidt then finally the German counterattacks which occur in a couple places but primarily the Schmidt/ Kommerscheidt area. I need to go back over my map and look at the specific combat engagements and see what makes sense.

Mord, you ignorant slut! Bagged-out, dried-up, slunken meat like you and Michael Dorosh know the rules. If you want a copy of CM, sign on the dotted line. Oh, but let's all shed a tear for poor Michael Dorosh. There was only testimony that he had sexual intercourse over forty times with another man while living with actor Lee Marvin. But I suppose that sort of fashionable promiscuity means nothing to you, Mord, who hops from bed to bed with the frequency of a cheap ham radio. But hell hath no fury like a woman's scorn, and Michael Dorosh, like a screeching, squealing, reptatious swamp sow is after BFC's last three million dollars. I guess what you and Michael are saying is that when you're on your backs, the meter is running. Well, please spare us, and tell us the rate's at the top. Then we can choose which two bit fanboi tarts and bargain basement sluts to shack up with. Okay so I stole that from Dan Akroyd and weekend update...doesn't mean it isn't true. My apologies to Mord, British Tommy, BFC and the world in general including Michael Dorosh, but this thread just made me think of Point/Counterpoint and after that it was too late to do anything but borrow that. NOW can we move on?

Have it and though I can't vouch for what is in it, I think the premise is interesting and I don't have anything to refute the data. Another one that Broadsword pointed out to me as being back in print and which will soon take it's place on my shelf when I finish reading it is Normandiefront: D-Day to Saint-Lo Through German Eyes by Vince Milano and Bruce Conner http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?field-keywords=normandiefront&url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks

Thanks for all the input, very much appreciated. Below are a couple pics of the Kall trail for others who haven't downloaded them. I tried your suggestion for the firebreaks using red rock, threw in some stumps and logs and I like the effect. It does make it harder to add trees as they won't stay off what is considered the road, but even without them I think it starts to feel more closed in. Although considering RockinHarry's feedback and what shows in the pictures, it isn't as dense as I'd thought. Check out the tank treads though, gives you some idea of how narrow the trail really is and how steep it drops off. Interesting information in the Green book and critique of the US forces was their unwillingness to just shove disabled tanks off the trail. They had plenty to support the infantry, they just seemed unwilling to do what was needed to push through even at the expense of otherwise undamaged vehicles. I recall a story of the Soviet Bagration offensive where they needed to force a river crossing. They simply drove a tank in till it flooded then used it as the foundation for a bridge. Sometimes you just have to love the Russian army for it's ingenuity and willingness to sacrifice anything to get the job done. I did run out of memory once, but only after dropping in and out of 3D mode quite a few times. Once I think I have the basic map and terrain/ground tiles selected I may start considering breaking up the map, but it does simplify things greatly from an integration point to keep working with it as a whole piece for as long as I can. I will go back to the forest tiles and ground tile within them next. RockinHarry from what your experience has been it sounds like the brush layer of the forest is not quite that dense - under the evergreen canopy would it be your feeling that LOS extends fairly far considering it is forest? I was wondering if layering in hedges for dense brush was appropriate, but it seems that is not the case as you and SgtSchultz have noted. Very helpful on the wire enclosures as well. I would have expected more fieldstone walls simply from people clearing fields and piling them up, but it seems they are mostly wire. The pics I have found online do not have enough detail to really tell. I will play around with the suggestions regarding the Kall itself. It would definitely help get the map elevations back on target to not use water if I can simulate a brook effect using rocks, marsh and mud. Maybe throw in some shallow ford tiles once I get to the bottom elevation layer. Next consideration is, if the map really isn't usable as a whole, should I consider going back and using the original scale and elevations and only create the portions needed for the areas actually fought over. I am not sure that would work as Schmidt and Kommerscheidt would have to be on one map and though it would still be smaller than this map, it wouldn't be by much. What it would do is get the correct distances in and that could become really important in the fighting between 116th Pz Panthers and the Shermans that did make it across the Kall. After all, with all the effort BFC put into penetration characteristics, it seems a shame to skew the distance and in effect discard all that work. Ahh the fun of tradeoffs in map making. I am beginning to understand the pain. MarkEzra, my apologies to you for any insinuation that you slacked off while creating a ton of QB maps. I owe you an evenings bar tab whether you feel I did so or not.

+10 let's move on.

Thanks for the encouragement and the advice. I started experimenting along the Kall crossing with bushes as I wasn't happy with how bald the terrain is. I will also take those suggestions on firebreaks and apply them to the Kall trail itself. Using even dirt road tiles doesn't get the feel right. However your suggestions of rocky red dirt and trees should I think be able to get that more claustrophic, barely hacked trail feel. Add a few stumps and downed tress and it has potential. If only there were a flavor item for discarded tank tracks

Incidentally for folks like Mr Emerys who I think has stated a preference I believe for playing solitaire HTH games, using the format of the TCS game rules and planning maps may add a layer to your own games to enhance the solitaire playability. It is something I want to experiment with in developing an AAR to both create a story of sorts as well as demonstrate the depth you can create for yourself using CMBN. Playing against the AI has it's own limitations, whilst playing solitaire HTH can lose that FOW aspect and unexpected developments. This seems like it might create a more solid framework for solitaire play or even a more complicated two player PBEM game. More to come if folks are interested in hearing an AAR of the travails of 112th Infantry Regiment on the Kall river as well as the 275th and 89th Infantry divisons and one of my favorite German units, the 116th Panzer Division.

I did an initial test to see about the issue of map size earlier when Broadsword and I were having problems. I ran 4 battalions across this, however at that time I had no trees etc. As it stands I don't really know yet how the map itself will be used. The TCS game had scenarios for phases of the campaign that used portions of the map. For a campaign game they present nice options and a framework. That being said I will start running those tests when I see the map itself come together to a point I would actually considering using it. I still have a long way to go. Considering the time frame (the period reflected on the map covered 4 days) fighting on the whole map just isn't feasible from a CMBN game time frame and map size. I simply am following LLF and Broadsword's theory that it is easier to cut up a large map rather than try to make separate maps that then don't align right or follow the same flow. It also allows anyone interested in using the TCS player aids as an operational layer if they desire to create a campaign game. I think the TCS series being a regimental scale game lends itself to an easier to run multi player campaign game than divisonal or greater scale games like Normandy 44. Their organization of planning forms can also be used to create a fog of war for players on the same side. You know what you think your fellow company/battalion commanders are supposed to be doing, but not necessarily what they think they are supposed to be doing. Even if you use the same btt file and are passing it around seeing their units doesn't allow you to know what command orders they are following. Unfortunately the gamers only created one game within the time frame of CMBN (Omaha) and that is an even larger map. Good advice though as I have already seen what happens if one doesn't take that into account---crashed games.

Am in the midst of my own first attempt at a map and am probably being overly ambitious, however would like some advice from those with some time in with the editor and translating images into the CM world. I am converting a map from the old Gamers TCS series game Objective Schmidt. I have had to make some adjustments as the map itself is twice the size of what can be created. I decided to borrow an idea once used for a map created for CMAK I think of Clerveaux where they simply altered the scale. I dropped the overall map scale in half and did the same for the elevations. I think I have ended up with a plausible map. I put in all the elevation lines and may edit them a bit later to stop making actual contour lines and allow the engine to provide a more natural flow where desired, but for the sake of getting the roads, forests etc in it helps to have the actual contours in at a high level view. I have had to adjust for how water is programmed in CM, the Kall river drops some 40' over the course of the map, with the elevation line changes that comes to about 20', still 2 contour levels. While manageable, it does mean having to alter the map. I also had to convert the tributaries to marsh tiles, but again still manageable. Where I need advice is three items. If you look at the googled maps, the fields can be clearly seen, however it is late fall. A distinctly different period for cropland than August. Perhaps this project would be better completed in the Bulge game when released, but I am open to any and all suggestions about trying to get the feel right for the terrain if folks think it is possible in CMBN. Second item is firebreaks. The game map itself only shows roads and the Kall trail itself. In the aerial shots however you can distinctly see the firebreaks. If anyone is familiar with this area or anything like it, what would you suggest as the best way to duplicate these? I expect they played a focal role in the fighting within the forest, but am not sure how to recreate them to try and drive that effect in CM. Last item - Just north of here is the Bergstein ridge, which the Germans used to keep Vossenack and Kommerscheidt under artillery observation. I could simply place Cathedral towers on the border to simulate the OP capabilites but was wondering if anyone else has considered this when you have no way to really duplicate this within the map. I know Broadsword typically would include additional parts of the master map that had observation sights, but 1 those are still within the map and 2 they are literally individual steeples whereas this was a whole ridge at higher elevation. The TCS game rules just simply had any US unit within a certain portion of the map as automatically being spotted barring smoke or poor visibility. FYI if anyone wants to use this map go right ahead and don't credit me - I am more than happy to let someone else take the blame for any deficiencies in the map as well as the belly aching we will hear when folks realize the casualty rates in Normandy are just the beginning. There is a reason the 28th got nicknamed the "Bloody Bucket". Below are links to the map as well as material I am using for it's creation. CM Map http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30964082/Objective%20Schmidt.btt Googled pics from Vossenack - I believe most of these come from the Green Book series http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30964082/Green%20Book%20pics.rar Obj Schmidt player aid map (Available free with Vassal mod if you want to be able to blow up the image) http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30964082/Obj%20Schmidt%20Map.rar Rules and player aids for those interested in the idea of using this for an Operational layer for a campaign. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30964082/Obj%20Schmidt%20rules.rar

I have seen commentary that discusses the use of WP by American tankers in Lorraine. It seemed to have particular success against the green German crews from the newly formed Panzer Brigades frequently causing them to bail out of otherwise undamaged tanks. I had asked early on before CMBN was released if that kind of behavior would be modelled. It is likely one of those were to attempt to do so would have created a huge issue of them doing it when you didn't want them to not to mention being horrendously difficult to code and create realistic behavior.

LOL you could almost hear the platoon commander yelling "No! Your other left you maggots!".

You are exactly correct, however considering you are going to want to crop the pic and clean it up to get the best from it for posting, that is simply a small step when you save it. I have been using Picassa for editing and have it set to save automatically as jpeg so I don't have to do anything additional. If you haven't I highly recommend going back to this thread on the whole posting process. The suggestions really help get the most out of it and they are easy to follow. http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=97288

That would actually be a very good thing. If the behavior can be duplicated and a copy shown to BFC to work from I am certain this is something they will want to look at as needing to be addressed assuming I am even remotely close to what might be going on. Then again keep an open mind until it has had a chance to be gone through in depth. They may find what is causing it is something even more subtle similar to that issue of the crew member being misaligned and putting his ear to the sights in the Tiger.

Better yet, let's get back to talking about the game. The only real opinions I want to hear are those of my fellow players. No offense to Mr D or Killroy or anyone else out there who finds this isn't their cup of tea, but more mods!, more discussion of how to tactically handle the Bocage!, more maps, scenarios and campaigns!, more, heck more everything!! Gee Steve's quiet.... next module for Christmas? My copy of Lions of Carentan is due in October, would be nice timing....

@Wiggum No these are all from Bois de Baugin, a stand alone scenario. I may get around to trying my hand at an AAR of a campaign some day, but right now I am still new to and enjoying far too much PBEM.

an interesting issue and here is a total supposition of what could be going wrong and if so is somewhat problematic. Assume that the Panther for some reason perceives Sherman A is the high priority threat (maybe it is simply spotted first). It then orients towards it but then spots another Sherman now on it's flank. Now that Sherman has a flank shot so it becomes the more serious threat but in orienting to bring it's frontal armor facing that Sherman, it has now exposed it's flank to Sherman A. Repeat ad nauseum. At some point between two objects the angle of facing will transition to one having a superior position, perhaps that transit point is confusing the AI. That is a simple wild shot and a crude one, but a plausible problem. Do you happen to have a save?

Now that was worth investigating. I have to admit to having no idea what foul combination of noxious chemicals conspired to come together to create a Peng thread. Nor was I even sure there was a Mr Peng. Fortunately your note had me prepared and I had set my beer down. It promptly spilled on the floor when I accidentally kicked it while laughing...damn you that was a nasty trick.

Von Kleist. 969 to 295. We both had about 175 casualties. I destroyed or damaged a good portion of his armor while losing... well almost everything. He achieved all his point objectives where I was able to cause enough damage to his Infantry platoons to meet the objectives and held hill 145 at the end. What really grabs me in this scenario/game is all those little moments. I can't speak for the ones form his viewpoint. But for example at one point he had gotten a recon guy up to the villa and a tank had blasted a hole into the wall and building giving him visibility. I had an MG team do a quick attack through another gap in the wall, took down the recon guy and made it back inside the villa before the enemy could bring down fire upon them. It seemed every turn had something like this for a good portion of the game. Between the fact that you can plan these kind of moves and succeed and the game creates a movie for you to watch of it. geez and it only cost what?

What can one say other than a product some of us really like got trashed in way that showed little objectivity or even an attempt at it. What anyone likes or dislikes is always a subjective thing and that is just life. I can easily live with someone feeling that CMBN isn't the game for them. There are plenty of games I don't like. However a purported review that is a thinly disguised attempt to bash a company is just a load of ****. I may not like farmville, but I am not going to slam farmville in a review because I don't like facebook. I honestly do not know and don't care to know what went down in 2008. It isn't relevant to me. However I do object to someone presenting a statement as some authority on BFC and it's products that is just looking for things to trash about it because he doesn't like BFC. There are folks out there who might actually really enjoy this product and are going to read those reviews and put credence into them potentially affecting the community of folks who play this game. For me that crosses the line and it is current, not 3 years ago. However I agree it is a pointless waste of time to allow this to continue to be a distraction and I for one would be happy to see BFC close this thread. Frankly I'd rather discuss Bois de Baugin. My response was simply to address the issue head on, I sent Herr Probst down there to speak for those of us who have found the gold in this here hill.

I hear that, heck this scenario is in my sig line now. Incredibly well done IMHO and I love the map. Geez flavor items INSIDE the buildings?!! Von Kleist spent quite a bit of time reconning but eventually yes he made a thrust into the woods on Hill 146. I had moved most of the minefields over there to create enough delay to allow the German artillery to come into play. I put the German foxhole line right on the heavy forest tiles and a trp right on them. When the American infantry struck the line I pulled back after the intial firefight and called in the artillery and in my one majorly successful moment of the game hit two platoons + of infantry. From then on it was a slow grind downhill. Von Kleist was able to overcome that initial setback, reorganize and come up with a winning plan to overcome the German forces in the woods and eventually backed me up to the fence line. I tried a final flanking manuever on his far left that was counterattacked and over run. By the time we got to the fight in the Villa it was like two punch drunk sailors blindly swinging at each other while still managing to keep landing shots every now and then. I have played that scenario twice now in PBEM and can't recommend it highly enough. Both sides have the forces required to accomplish their goals, but not enough to afford a lot of room for error.

Or the air speed velocity of a fully laden (African) swallow or worse....how do you KNOW she's a witch?

Okay my BFC wish list has only one item- I need more time in a day. Either that or some winning lottery numbers so I can retire now.