SeaMonkey

Now this is more like it D4! So how much more are you and your friends willing to pay over and above the usual PC game price for this feature? I'll help, but I would like some other features like combat from sea invasion tiles/hexes or maybe an independent CAG for the Carriers. And yes I'm willing to pay more. How about I match the price you and your friends pay for a copy of the game with your preferred feature? Sound fair? And Xwood, my comments weren't made to catalyze an angry thought, just stating the facts as HC had already alluded to. Stated with the same emphatic reference D4 made to the consequence of not having his feature. Or maybe better said like one of my favorite musical groups, "You can't always get what you want......., but you might find"...... Do you remember the finish?

Got to agree with your assumptions arado. America was in no real position to help(seriously or not) until probably some time in 43 at the earliest given the conquest of the Isles in 40 or 41. Remember Pearl Harbor was the wake up call. In the event of the loss of UK homeland I would assume a more concentrated effort in the Pacific first even though Hitler probably still would have DoWed USA at the instigation of Japan. We can assume that sometime after a Sealion recovery Germany would have gone at the USSR. Lendlease would have been less pronounced as historical I'm sure, especially with the Japanese sitting astride the supply lines. Probably this scenario is better left to be played out on the world map which we should see soon enough in the WaW adaptation. I believe one thing is sure, UK would have kept up the fight from the Western Hemisphere and USSR would have assumed even a greater burden in the years before 44. The Royal Navy would assume nothing but the frosting on the cake as the US Navy grew to the size of all other belligerents combined by 45. I really can't see any competition for the US Navy as they steam the Earth's Seas supreme just like the present. Remember what happens when America gets focussed. A protracted conflict none the less and who knows when the final victory would have been attained? Does it really ever come as long as evil dwells within the hearts of man?

Isn't it obvious D4, SC isn't your game, PG is. Just as you wish flexibility from others, you must also display it yourself. Sorry you couldn't adapt, the dinosaurs couldn't either.

First of all, I don't have any problem with the way the Siberians arrive so long as we're discussing the European theater only. I have long been an advocate for an inherent value(MPPs) for owning player's tiles. This lends a degree of incentive to defend all of one's territory. It also would incite movement from partisans to shift control of tiles, perhaps allowing them some degree of reinforcement. I never play with the Sealion conquered UK capital moving to Egypt...totally unrealistic and as many have noted perhaps gamey as well. Canada is the natural fall back position and UK should be able to obtain lendlease MPPs from USA to rebuild their strength. IMO it makes for a great late game. Sealion....well...I think it can come off pretty accurately if you as the Axis approach it from the beginning turns of Fall Weiss. I mean who here can say that the Germans weren't capable if they truly had prepared for the invasion even before the War started? On the other hand, UK can deliver a crippling blow to Axis forces if they choose to concentrate on defending the Homeland and not go off running around with other adventures. This includes a measured deployment to North Africa. There are of course still some exploits of the game engine as Baron noted in his response in the TAC power thread. But you might be able to delay that scenario with an early involvement in France or some other diversion for the Axis AFs. Ponder some ways to take them out of range of London. So that's the essence of my response, no matter what your opponent might try, there always seems to be some alternative for you to follow to derail his plans. And that's what makes SC such a great game.

Now this is unique, actually a release date ahead of the originally announced date.

This is why I play Canada as the fall back position for UK. Its more historical and it removes the Egypt gambit.

I have one of these going also. Really good against a longtime opponent and the feel is something like it must have been for the original constituents, intangibles. Tiger is right, first timers don't read the scripts, your knowledge of WW2 is advantage enough, thrive on the surprises. WaW adaptation will be awesome, especially if we can get some dynamic features for the Pacific theater.

"The Game is excellent / awesome." Damnit ....there's hope for the World yet! :eek:

You know, I'm with Hubert, its far too early to make any drastic changes. I have 4 PBEMs going, two from each side and before I look at 1.03 I want to finish these. I think many others are in the same boat. Easy fix idea, on the supply check(b/4 victory assessment), enemy unit occupying victory tile must have supply 6 or greater. Idea being that before you can actually claim victory the tile should be "secured", meaning an HQ must be in proximity. I mean who's going to accept the "Articles of Surrender" from a major belligerent? [ April 07, 2008, 10:21 AM: Message edited by: SeaMonkey ]

I have to say A234 everyone of us are culpable in that we want a better game and this is how it gets done, the betas have their own discussion also. Got to hand it to Baron, I tested his perspective and he didn't back down, finally getting through my thick skull and making me a controvert. I'm with Baron, this is very near a game breaker. A patch is needed! What say yee, SC clan? Hubert? You know me, I'm up for simple fixes that contribute to realistic play. I like the ability suggested, allow the Allies the final counterattack, or at least the player that didn't start the scenario before victory is exclaimed.

So now what are the ramifications of Baron's and others proposal of air units inability to vanquish that last remaining strength point of ground units? I believe that this should also be considered for other indirect fire units like artillery and rockets. What is the axiom? In the end it is always left for the ground pounders to occupy the territory, in the SC case, the tile. It is realistic. In fact there may be an argument that as the ground units take losses and become weak...and more dispersed...that it should be less likely that they take additional losses from air, artillery and rockets. Once again leaving the final work for the ground forces perhaps when a unit reaches strength 3 the percentages go down/way down for subsequent losses from indirect attacks. What are the consequences of this feature to overall SC play?

Hmmmm...sounds like TAC is too strong.

No gem to miss, just a cold shower of SC reality cause you don't need to fortify the city(even if you could), just tile 65,17 denies both Chatham and Hull to enemy supply and transports. By 44 you should have had at least 64,17 and 63,18 improved as well....wth...the whole damn Island should have been a fort. :eek: But of course since you had all those flyboys camped out on The Island(s) there wasn't a lot of room left for your counterattacking ground units. Besides being a nappy head you've been skipping class also. Where were those SBs with LR doing recon??? :confused: And by the way...I guess the Red Army had its thumb up its a_ _. [ April 05, 2008, 03:55 PM: Message edited by: SeaMonkey ]

Practice some more Baron, sounds like you went to sleep on that pile of crap! One of the first units I buy as UK is the engineers....now why would I do something like that?

OK it is something to think about it and for the sake of discussion I'm going to state the obvious. I'm risking sarcasm here, so everyone put a smile on your face.....remember.....for the sake of discussion. WTH ...remember. .....what is the dominant piece of weapons delivery systems...well really more of a grouping of systems, on the battlefield today and where are the roots at? :confused: What era did the use of said system display its infancy? :confused: If this isn't the most powerful piece on the board....what is? :confused: Too powerful! :confused: IMO I don't think so.....there are ways to slow it down and you can do the same thing to your opponent. :cool:

I'm with Liam, Tiger....an admirable gesture. I have already given numerous SC games away, from SC1 on. Not that I wouldn't again, but I'm a little more focussed on things like the USO and DAV presently. I have limited resources.

And so A234 what are we going to do with the FW190F-3 whos use began in 1942. 2 20mm cannons and 550 lbs of bombs. 370 mph at 18000 feet. Now only about 500 of the 20000 produced actually had this ground attack capability, but SC is a "what if" and maybe you, as the supreme commander, would have delegated more of the 20 grand to this role.

I have had only one other game hold my interest as long as SC and that was TOAW, notice I said was. SC is still current, over 5 years now. The player to player interaction and the many user created scenarios leads me to believe that it may make a decade. Huberts continual upgrading and enhancing of the engine also adds to the great value that SC is. There are not many things in life that gives the many hours of relaxation, exuberance and mental stimulation that SC provides, especially for the price. If you are a wargamer, SC should be in your library.

"This is a Grand Strategy game. There should be no AA units in the game whatsoever." That's a matter of personal preference and subsequently that is why there is an editor.

It doesn't cost a lot to operate your AA guns around. Keep them together when you get them to an effective level and they can provide adequate coverage to your priority offensive and defensive missions. Also another reason to make sure your(LOCs) lines of communication remain open. Sound realistic?

Come on...this strategy is only good if you catch the USSR off guard. Always a possibility, but most veterans will have at least a couple of Paras in the Caucasus vicinity for MidEast exploits, cutting communications to the eastern part of Turkey. The Bosporous strait is a choke point where supply and communications are easily cut and with a couple of Allied Strategic Bombers on the prowl, woe be to the Axis that don't take quick advantage of the situation. It can quickly become a quagmire(terrain favors the defense) and a major distraction allowing for Allied opportunities in the West, best left for a situation where the USSR is on its heels and the Axis in control of ME.

These last 3 posts pretty much sum up the SC legacy, obviously these guys "get it". I too am enjoying SC2 world version and one of the best things about it is its full of surprises. First time to play the scenario, IMO, is the best opportunity to capture the essence of the unknown that the belligerents surely felt in that historical period. You can, in hindsight, predict a general flow for the game, but the scripts (don't read them prior to)stream a constant set of dilemmas or benefits to each player. This is really the true creative genious that SC is, like TOAW had, a never ending potential to provide scenarios on different scales that can captivate its players with doubt of reality, the unknown of the future. And you can forever tweak them, modify, recreate and place them out there for your fellow SCers to enjoy. You are giving back.

I was wondering when you were going to take the leap. Sure was expensive before the air commitment. What held you back?

You know Kuni this statement has some great insight.

Well in SC3 I would like to see a breakdown or numbers attached to the graphs of the contributing MPPs from every friendly resource. This would be a good addition into the "Reports" layout screens. Let me have some numbers at the top of those bar graphs showing the resource levels of factories, mines, cities, and oilfields. I want to see the exact contribution of every MPP generating tile, like sort of how the diplomatic screen is. It names the source/tile for each country by selecting the flag and on the same line the MPPs generated for that location. Maybe for the enemy resources, the revelation could be tied to the intelligent research level.