Andreas Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 There appears to be a series of both Nvidia and ATI chipsets out there that operate by sharing the main RAM. Is that correct? The description I have is: Chipset nVidia nForce 4 C51G Graphics Processor/Memory: nVidia GeForce 6100 / Up to 128 Mo If so, how do these chipsets perform with CMx1, how are they likely to perform with CMx2, and how do they perform with e.g. Il-2? Also, in a computer so equipped, would it be possible to install a proper graphics card at a later stage? Thanks a lot for any advice. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Is the video onboard? Then yes it will share RAM with the rest of your system. What kind of mother board is it? If you have an AGP or PCI-x slot then you can add a video card. Dunno about IL2 (maybe on low settings) or CMx2 but it should run CMx1 ok. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 29, 2006 Author Share Posted August 29, 2006 The machine I am thinking about is this one: http://www.bizrate.co.uk/desktopcomputers/pid426013843/information.html No idea what the motherboard is, but there is a PCI-x slot, so I guess expandability is okay. Thanks a lot! Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Are you sure that there is a PCI-x slot? The intigrated could be PCI-x but still not have a slot. I couldnt see anything on the system at that page that said PCI-x Slot. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Never mind I saw it on another page. So yes you should be able to add a video card. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 29, 2006 Author Share Posted August 29, 2006 Well, if it is expandable, that should be good enough for me. Just need to remember to get a TFT screen that can do both, VGA and DVI. Thanks a lot! All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 It certain doesn't have PCI-X, if anything PCIe. I don't see any indication on that page that it does, though. It has 4 RAM slots so it must be semi-decent but I advice caution. And although it has DVI it might not be able to output more than 1600x1200 on the DVI, only on the VGA. The shared memory basically means that you are limited at high resolutions and that you won't be able to use high, if any, AA/AF settings, because those filters swipe over the video memory multiple times extra per frame. %% A video card with a fast processor and slow RAM is generally good to play halfway new games at low quality settings. For CM you want the opposite, you want high quality for an old game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 A different webpage says it has PCI Express x16 x 1 + PCI x 3. It is highly questionable whether the power supply and the heat management allow you to add a decent card, though. I would take the same money to build something on my own, reuse whatever old Windows I have (a majority of that sales prices for such a low end machine goes into the Windoze license, and you have a right to re-use previous licenses) but use a nice well-ventilated case, a good PSU and a quiet CPU fan. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 29, 2006 Author Share Posted August 29, 2006 I'd like that. The problem with that solution for me though is that I have never done something like that, and would not have the first clue if the seller of an item (who would speak a language I am not entirely comfortable in) is fleecing me. I also don't have an old copy of windows, so would have to buy that in any case. A high-end machine from the shop is not in the budget, and once I start spending real money, I'd get an iMac. Other than that it's a much better idea. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 It looks like this does have the capacity to use a PCI Express x16 videocard as an upgrade. The power supply is only 300W, so that may cut back on how much of a video upgrade could be done without upgrading the power supply at the same time. The GeForce 6100 would probably do fine with CMx1. It will probably slow down a bit with the larger maps, but it should be playable. I'm not so sure about IL-2's playability. Possibly a few planes and details, but probably not many (so some online battles or lots of 'bots may be a bit too much). For CMx2 you'd probably want to upgrade to a full PCI Express card, which you probably could get for a little less than £100. Cards such as the 7300GT or better yet a 7600GS could be had for definitely under that price with VAT. The 7600GT is a bit over £100 with VAT though (and it would be quite a bit nicer). Otherwise the system seems to be a decent deal for those who wouldn't want to build their own. The integrated video does a pretty decent job, but it will typically falter with higher quality rendering/shading effects that are becoming much more common today (and CMx2 should use a few of these). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 30, 2006 Author Share Posted August 30, 2006 Thanks Schrulli. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 30, 2006 Author Share Posted August 30, 2006 Finally found something that I think is better in terms of price and video performance, at a place selling end of the line models. HP Pavilion m7329.fr Processor: Athlon 64 3400+ Memory : 512 Mo HDD: 200 GB 7,200 RPM Drives : DVD+RW DL Video: PCI-x 16 NVIDIA GeForce 6200SE TurboCache (256Mo dedicated) Extra: TV Tuner (analogue and Digital) Just another memory stick, and it would be alright, I guess. Cost is €439, comes with manufacturer's warranty. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted August 30, 2006 Share Posted August 30, 2006 The 6200SE TurboCache cards are probably a little faster than the 6100/6150 integrated video since they have some dedicated memory. However it actually has 64Mb of dedicated video memory according to these HP specs on the Pavilion 7329.fr with access up to 256Mb of system memory via the PCI Express interface for its "turbo cache" feature. Customer comments I've seen on Newegg's site suggest that this card can play Half-Life 2, Call of Duty 2, Unreal Tournament 2004, etc. on low-to-mid quality settings (for around 30 fps). Even Battlefield 2 with low-to-medium settings has worked for one person (and this may be a good example of the horse-power necessary for CMx2, though that should still be a bit different). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 30, 2006 Author Share Posted August 30, 2006 Remember you are talking to someone who still has a Radeon 7500 with 32MB. So all this will probably an improvement in speed, even though I shall lose fog. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schrullenhaft Posted August 30, 2006 Share Posted August 30, 2006 Actually it is the ATI Radeons under Windows that lose fog for CMx1. The Nvidias all support fog tables under Windows. Interestingly the chipset on your latest computer candidate is ATI and, from what I can tell, even offers built-in ATI video (which won't be active with the GeForce 6200SE TC installed). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted August 30, 2006 Share Posted August 30, 2006 No, I like the Acer better. No ATI chipset (sorry I don't trust ATI) and Acer certainly has the better quality record than HP. You have a better chance to find a decent power supply in the Acer. Also, the Acer documented that it has 4 RAM slots, that's an advantage in itself when you want to upgrade, but more importantly the presense of 4 RAM slots means it is not a toy motherboard. The HP has a much better chance to have custom parts that don't play well with exchanges. You see an Athlon 64 3400+ is still one of the fastest single-core CPUs ever built, in particular if it is one of the 2.4 GHz variants. You can probably overclock it if that is your thing (new PSU required). Given that you have such a fast CPU and that games, wargames in particular, won't do too much with multithreading in the near future that is very future-proof it is entirely realistic that you stuff in a high-end NVidia 8800 or whatever in 2 years, requiring only a new PSU. If the whole thing is a junk computer where e.g. you can't put in a new PSU and/or have half-height graphics cards then you can't. And you want the 4 RAM slots. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted August 30, 2006 Share Posted August 30, 2006 ATI 7500 in a mac 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted August 30, 2006 Author Share Posted August 30, 2006 Unfortunately that Mac has copped it due to powercuts, and I am awaiting the verdict of my captice Mac techy as to whether it is just the power supply (toss-up on whether to repair it or not) or also the motherboard (total write off) that got fried. Used G4s of that type still sell for about Euro 200, and I find it hard to justify that expense, when compared to a brandnew PC - Euro 700 including an LG 19" screen, which would be bigger than the one I currently have. Thanks again Schrulli and Redwolf! Such is life. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holien Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Don't forget to get a power surge protector. You don't want anymore problems. Dead cheap and if you get one you can run a fourway socket of it thereby protecting four devices. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted August 31, 2006 Share Posted August 31, 2006 Actually if you value your computer a UPS is a valuable investment. When city power goes up and down you can cause down and up alternating within a few seconds. That causes harddrives to not completely spin down before they go back up and vice versa. Of course, a bad UPS is worse than city power... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted September 4, 2006 Author Share Posted September 4, 2006 Turns out it was false alarm. Yesterday I tried to start the G4 in the forlorn hope that maybe something would happen. It did - the light on the on/off button came on, but nothing more. So I pressed the reset-button. I got treated to a look at the firmware interface (never had that happen before) inviting me to type mac-boot to start or shutdown to, well, shut down. So I typed mac-boot, and it booted up fine in OS9 (which was the last selected start-up disk). Then I switched the start-up disk to OSX, and ordered a restart. Nothing happened - so I press reset again. It starts up normally. Once the date and time are corrected, everything is back to normal. Weird, but there we are. Thanks again for all the tips! When the time comes to replace the G4 (hopefully not for a while yet), this thread and what I learned looking into the matter will come in handy. BTW - any recommendations for a good yet affordable UPS? All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted September 5, 2006 Share Posted September 5, 2006 Any APC unit worked well for me. I had some Cyberpower unit which shot my computer more often than city power and leads to the demise of two Maxtor 200 Gb drives. It now is on my coffeemaker. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TufenHuden Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 The only thing I don't like about preparatory PC's that usually the Mobo hampers the rest of the system. AMD64 3400 is good-can you upgrade to a AMD64X2 Dual core later-if it's socket 939-also on the Vid-you can get a EVGA 7800GT OC for about the same as that 6200 at NewEgg.com-need a better power suppy at least 450PSU to power that card-I've heard of Acer-but having heard either way on how there PC's are... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TufenHuden Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Well did a little digging-the Mobo is a Nvidia N-force-4-not a bad Mobo"motherboard" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted September 8, 2006 Author Share Posted September 8, 2006 Thanks a lot Redwolf for the tip, and TufenHuden for further digging. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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