M1A1TC Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Originally posted by MikeyD: Hah! here's an excerpt from GlobalSecurity.org. Note the 'passion' of the writer: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> One observer wrote that "In more than 30 years working in the defense industry, I have never, never heard anybody use the name “Gavin” for the M-113. Not in the US nor in any of the many countries that use the vehicle. Not in the military forces, not in the companies that build and equip it, not in the groups that retrofit and repair it. This usage appears not only to be “unofficial”, it is entirely fictional and I believe that you may have been the victim of a hoax or deliberate disinformation." It should be noted on that very same webpage was a link entitled "M113 Gavin vs Stryker" </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sequoia Posted March 12, 2008 Author Share Posted March 12, 2008 IIRC they sent Sheridans with the 82nd to Saudi Arabia after the Iraqis invaded Kuwait in the First Gulf War. I think it's unlikely we'll see either Sheridan's or M113's, but I like Clavicula_Nox would like to see an armored HumVee as well as some of the other vehicles on the "planned" list that were not included. M1TC your mod is nice but it doesn't have the in game stats to go with it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingknives Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I'm surprised that no-one knows, but the concept of the M113 having a name is the brainchild of one Mike Sparks, who is an irritating internet persona unable to face reality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnO Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 I want me a truck, nothing more, nothing less. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Originally posted by flamingknives: I'm surprised that no-one knows, but the concept of the M113 having a name is the brainchild of one Mike Sparks, who is an irritating internet persona unable to face reality. I never bothered to learn his name but we are talking about the same guy I believe. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Originally posted by MikeyD: This Gavin question reminds me of a similar - but much older- debate. Apparently, according to one source, No Brit tanker in WWII ever referred to his Sherman QF 17 pounder as an 'Achilles' and no 3 inch gunned M10 was ever a 'Wolverine'. These names creeped in in the early postwar period, then reinforced by Tamiya in the early 70s. Again, according to one source. It sounds like the poor old M113 had to be dragged kicking and screaming into being called a 'Gavin' but unfortunately the name's starting to stick. Quite possible that "Firefly" was never used either, and JonS and the usual gang of CW Mafia had that discussion here also. Usual terminology was "17-pounder Sherman" or "Sherman Vc" if one wanted to get technical. I have a copy of the 1944 vehicle data book for 1st Canadian Army (a reprint) and the terms Wolverine, Firefly and Achilles are absent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Sparks is an "interesting" personality according to me, unprintable name according to those in uniform who have a clue Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Originally posted by Dorosh Quite possible that "Firefly" was never used either, and JonS and the usual gang of CW Mafia had that discussion here also. Usual terminology was "17-pounder Sherman" or "Sherman Vc" if one wanted to get technical. I have a copy of the 1944 vehicle data book for 1st Canadian Army (a reprint) and the terms Wolverine, Firefly and Achilles are absent. That is because they were redacted by the reptoid aliens and Kris Kristofferson in a secret meeting under the Denver International Airport. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Originally posted by Dogface: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Originally posted by Dorosh Quite possible that "Firefly" was never used either, and JonS and the usual gang of CW Mafia had that discussion here also. Usual terminology was "17-pounder Sherman" or "Sherman Vc" if one wanted to get technical. I have a copy of the 1944 vehicle data book for 1st Canadian Army (a reprint) and the terms Wolverine, Firefly and Achilles are absent. That is because they were redacted by the reptoid aliens and Kris Kristofferson in a secret meeting under the Denver International Airport. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I have no idea what you guys are talking about. Europe was on vacation from '39 to '44. I know this is true because a German guy on TV said so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Combatintman Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Flipping heck - I opened a can of worms with the M-113 then? My take on the nomenclature is pretty much as stated by many - the 'Gavin' thing seems to have crept in. I know when I teach vehicle recognition its always going to be known as an M-113. The other beauty of having the M-113 family is that it is another vehicle for the great modding community to get their hands on and do a bit of reskinning. The possibilities then are endless - US Desert Storm, US OIF for starters. Those guys working on the REFORGER Mod will be better able to replicate the US Army of the late 80s. Then of course in combination with the LAV when it is released in the USMC module and the Leopard in the NATO module that opens up even more possibilities - two starters for ten below: ADF Mod M-1 ASLAV M-113 Canadian Mod Leopard (once the NATO Module is released) LAV M-113 (or TLAV - but not Gavin!!) All of that combined with the British Module and some extra Former Soviet vehicles will make this game something I've been waiting for for years. To be honest I'm pretty happy with the way it plays now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1A1TC Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Dont forget Vietnam mod - M113 was used extensively there, since it was created in the 1960's 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Originally posted by M1A1TankCommander: Dont forget Vietnam mod - M113 was used extensively there, since it was created in the 1960's Vietnam era ACAV (Armored Cavalry Assault Vehicle) kits were actually purchased new for the Canadians to use in the former Yugoslavia in the 1990s, believe it or not... [ March 13, 2008, 05:24 PM: Message edited by: Michael Dorosh ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogface Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Dogface: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Originally posted by Dorosh Quite possible that "Firefly" was never used either, and JonS and the usual gang of CW Mafia had that discussion here also. Usual terminology was "17-pounder Sherman" or "Sherman Vc" if one wanted to get technical. I have a copy of the 1944 vehicle data book for 1st Canadian Army (a reprint) and the terms Wolverine, Firefly and Achilles are absent. That is because they were redacted by the reptoid aliens and Kris Kristofferson in a secret meeting under the Denver International Airport. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 Originally posted by Dogface: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Dogface: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> Originally posted by Dorosh Quite possible that "Firefly" was never used either, and JonS and the usual gang of CW Mafia had that discussion here also. Usual terminology was "17-pounder Sherman" or "Sherman Vc" if one wanted to get technical. I have a copy of the 1944 vehicle data book for 1st Canadian Army (a reprint) and the terms Wolverine, Firefly and Achilles are absent. That is because they were redacted by the reptoid aliens and Kris Kristofferson in a secret meeting under the Denver International Airport. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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