Tab+1 View Changed

[oddball]

Gents,

Having had CMBB for several days now, and having had the pleasure of obsessing on CM1 since its initial release, I find that my old favorite view, the "Tab+1" has changed slightly. While this may seem at first read to be a rather piddling complaint, it has made a very big difference in the "immersion" factor one feels as you watch your tank or truppen bound about from that perspective.

This is something that was changed in the original (denied at first by one of the BTS

folks), but then later checked and found to have been the case, whereupon the "good" F1 view was reinstated.

The current view from the TC commander's view; ie: Tab+1 has changed ever so slightly in CM2, and for the worse.

I'm not sure if the view has been pulled back some and/or angled down ever so slightly, but

IMHO it needs a "tweaking" to put it back to the

"CM1" standard.

Be advised this is NOT a problem with my utilization of the new camera interface, so

keep overzealous/jingoistic lambastings to a minimum. I am and remain a fanatical lover of Battlefront and Combat Mission.

Regards, Oddball

Cactus Air Force

[russellmz]

Originally posted by oddball:

Gents,

Having had CMBB for several days now, and having had the pleasure of obsessing on CM1 since its initial release, I find that my old favorite view, the "Tab+1" has changed slightly. While this may seem at first read to be a rather piddling complaint, it has made a very big difference in the "immersion" factor one feels as you watch your tank or truppen bound about from that perspective.

This is something that was changed in the original (denied at first by one of the BTS

folks), but then later checked and found to have been the case, whereupon the "good" F1 view was reinstated.

The current view from the TC commander's view; ie: Tab+1 has changed ever so slightly in CM2, and for the worse.

I'm not sure if the view has been pulled back some and/or angled down ever so slightly, but

IMHO it needs a "tweaking" to put it back to the

"CM1" standard.

Be advised this is NOT a problem with my utilization of the new camera interface, so

keep overzealous/jingoistic lambastings to a minimum. I am and remain a fanatical lover of Battlefront and Combat Mission.

Regards, Oddball

Cactus Air Force

do a shift-z or two and it should look like normal (when locked to view a tank you can see the back of the crewman's head, unlike the default)

[M. Bates]

Even if Shift-Z did work (unfortunately it doesn't), any changes the player makes to the view are not remembered.

[oddball]

Originally posted by russellmz:

do a shift-z or two and it should look like normal (when locked to view a tank you can see the back of the crewman's head, unlike the default)[/qb]

[Soddball]

Hey, we just play the game, we don't know what makes it work.

[oddball]

Soddball, was there a point to your reply or were you just trying to extend the post count?

Originally posted by Soddball:

Hey, we just play the game, we don't know what makes it work.

[oddball]

Okay, the proof's in the pudding. Now bear with me on this as I've never tried uploading any pictures to the forum before:

Above (I hope) is a shot of a PzVG(late) taken from the ORIGINAL "Combat Mission" or "CM1" using the Tab/1 view. Note that the barrel of the main gun is showing (perhaps half the length and that

one has a good view of the horizon relative to the local terrain.

Now here (again, I -hope-) is a shot from "CM2"

or "CM:BB" using the same tank model and "Tab/1" view. Note that the camera angle has changed as well as the -position- of the "camera".

There is less of the horizon showing, the barrel of the gun is no longer visible and the

result is a degradation of the player's ability to view the terrain as well as he was in "CM1" and a less than impressive viewpoint as far as watching the main gun fire off towards the enemy.

This has GOT to be fixed. It's an issue that I brought up in the first incarnation of the game when it was changed and BTS concurred and subsequently "fixed" it. While this may seem at first to some as petty, it is not.

BTS give us back the original view and the magic

it brought. :eek:

Regards, Oddball

Cactus Air Force

Originally posted by oddball:

Gents,

Having had CMBB for several days now, and having had the pleasure of obsessing on CM1 since its initial release, I find that my old favorite view, the "Tab+1" has changed slightly. While this may seem at first read to be a rather piddling complaint, it has made a very big difference in the "immersion" factor one feels as you watch your tank or truppen bound about from that perspective.

This is something that was changed in the original (denied at first by one of the BTS

folks), but then later checked and found to have been the case, whereupon the "good" F1 view was reinstated.

The current view from the TC commander's view; ie: Tab+1 has changed ever so slightly in CM2, and for the worse.

I'm not sure if the view has been pulled back some and/or angled down ever so slightly, but

IMHO it needs a "tweaking" to put it back to the

"CM1" standard.

Be advised this is NOT a problem with my utilization of the new camera interface, so

keep overzealous/jingoistic lambastings to a minimum. I am and remain a fanatical lover of Battlefront and Combat Mission.

Regards, Oddball

Cactus Air Force

[ September 25, 2002, 04:32 PM: Message edited by: oddball ]

[Dogtoes]

Hmmmm...I'm gonna have to jump on Oddballs bandwagon on this one.

I agree. Bring back the old view! (As if they don't have bigger fish to fry.)

That's it...back to your conversation.

[Sabrewolf]

Yup they should make the camera higher so we can see the target more, I had many instances where I cannot see my target when im in hull down position

[oddball]

Yeah Dogtoes. While it may seem a trivial matter, it's made a tremendous difference in how much I'm enjoying this in comparison to CM1.

Originally posted by Dogtoes:

Hmmmm...I'm gonna have to jump on Oddballs bandwagon on this one.

I agree. Bring back the old view! (As if they don't have bigger fish to fry.)

That's it...back to your conversation.

[Treeburst155]

Hmmmm....I noticed this right away and thought it was an improvement. The CMBB view is more of a commander's eye level view, rather than above him. I always wanted to get down lower in CMBO when I wanted to get low at all.

I can see your point however. For watching the action, the CMBO view is better. Makes no difference to me really. I fight from view four almost exclusively anyway (3-4 in CMBB). Unless of course, some big arty is coming down. I love those barrages, even when they're coming down on me.

Treeburst155 out.

[Bruce70]

I believe that in the new "1" position you can now look around without losing the vehicle "lock" (someone will now tell me you could do that in CM1 as well). It could be that the new view works better with this feature.

[CKibler]

Here's another vote for Oddball. I prefer the CMBO tab-1 view, too. Even so, it's still great. Super job.

[Treeburst155]

Good point, Bruce70.

Treeburst155 out.

[ianc]

Yes, I prefer the CMBO view as well. You're up closer to the unit in question and it doesn't obstruct your view as much. More useable all around,

ianc

[Louie the Toad]

Yes, I noticed this too. This is one of several annoying facets that I am ready to complain about after playing for about 4 hours. Together they make the game less enjoyable.

I too enjoyed following the fly and fall of shot.

Two things aggravate this in BB. One is the camera location as shown so well above. The second is the irritating volume of smoke from the gun blast. It blocks MY sight of the fly and fall.

Lets go back to the 'puff' of CMBO. In this instance BB may depict reality but to what end? It interferes with enjoyment and adds nothing to the game. And no I do not want to shut off smoke.

The second is the rotate vs slide problem. Why was this done? It doesnt add anything to the game and will be even more annoying when you want to go back to playing CMBO and have to unlearn and relearn the system.

A third playability defect is somehow related to game scale and camera angle. In BO I could go to level 3 or 4 and see enough of the battlefield to make informed decisions and at the same time STILL see enough detail in my forces to distinguish a squad from a machine gun. Now in BB I sometimes can't even locate units visually and never will be able to unless the unit bases are on.

So this is my impression in only the first 4 hours of game play. I wonder what else I will find. There are a lot of 'nice' improvements in BB but what's the use if they can't be enjoyed because of changes that have been made to some of the basics of the game. So far BB is a step backward in enjoyability.

One has to wonder why things that worked were fixed until they didn't.

Disgruntled ... Toad

[ianc]

The second is the rotate vs slide problem. Why was this done? It doesnt add anything to the game and will be even more annoying when you want to go back to playing CMBO and have to unlearn and relearn the system

All this would be moot if BFC would give us the ability to custom configure our own controls instead of being forced to use the hard-coded ones...

ianc

[Treeburst155]

I agree about the level 3-4 view. It seems like we need a 3.5 view. This has been mentioned recently on the forum.

As for the camera "slide" being triggered by banging the mouse on the lower portion of the screen, I love it. Bang high for the usual rotate, and bang low to slide. Once one adjusts to it, it's really convenient.

Treeburst155 out.

[M. Bates]

Originally posted by Louie the Toad:

YI too enjoyed following the fly and fall of shot.

Two things aggravate this in BB. One is the camera location as shown so well above. The second is the irritating volume of smoke from the gun blast. It blocks MY sight of the fly and fall.

Lets go back to the 'puff' of CMBO. In this instance BB may depict reality but to what end? It interferes with enjoyment and adds nothing to the game. And no I do not want to shut off smoke.

I'm glad someone else is mentioning the smoke discharge when a gun fires. It does seem a bit excessive... Especially given the contradiction of shockwaves getting culled for being cheesy.

A third playability defect is somehow related to game scale and camera angle. In BO I could go to level 3 or 4 and see enough of the battlefield to make informed decisions and at the same time STILL see enough detail in my forces to distinguish a squad from a machine gun. Now in BB I sometimes can't even locate units visually and never will be able to unless the unit bases are on.

I agree completely. View 3 is too low-slung to be of much use for plotting movement orders.

Click the button to go to View 4, and the camera swings far out making the units smaller than they need to be. CMBB badly needs a "View 3.5" or user-definable camera views which actually "stick" and are remembered by the game.

Incidentally, it is impossible to emulate CMBO's good views using Shift-A or Shift-B.

So far BB is a step backward in enjoyability.

One has to wonder why things that worked were fixed until they didn't.

Disgruntled ... Toad

If it ain't broke, break it.

[Louie the Toad]

These concerns are serious. Therefore this Bump.

[Rookie]

I agree! BTS Do Somefink!

p.s. Jesus Odd, I registered here before you????

[ September 27, 2002, 01:12 AM: Message edited by: Rookie ]

[Clinton]

I'll add my puny voice to the crowd. Old view=good

[mchlstrt]

Yep.

Strt

[Abbott]

Originally posted by Louie the Toad:

The second is the irritating volume of smoke from the gun blast. It blocks MY sight of the fly and fall.

Lets go back to the 'puff' of CMBO. In this instance BB may depict reality but to what end? It interferes with enjoyment and adds nothing to the game. And no I do not want to shut off smoke.

Disgruntled ... Toad

The new firing smoke is one of the features I like about CMBB. It does add to the game in my opinion.

[BDW]

One vote for old view.