Michael Dorosh Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Slapdragon: Luckily, being a computer game, those arguments are in the past.<hr></blockquote> You forgot the {/sarcasm] after your post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danbob Posted January 14, 2002 Author Share Posted January 14, 2002 Whoops....yes, there's some stuff missing from my pile there. We do have Code of Bushido, Gung Ho, and Red Barricades....wonder where they went to??? Still in the closet I bet. I better go look! I would like to see a Pacific Theatre CM game, but the Eastern Front should keep me occupied for at least a year or two....and agree witht he previous comment regarding Pegasus Bridge...ASL has rules for EVERYTHING, and I do miss gliders, starshells and such in CMBO. Oh yes, and gunflashes! Danbob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfamily33 Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 LOS Check! I nearly fell off my chair laughing. I'm still worried about the floor loading in my upstair closet! Someday my SL/ASL stuff will fall through the ceiling. At that point, I figure it'll be time to teach my boys. However, BTS will have completed CMVW - "Virtual Warfare" by then and my boys will put me out to pasture with as an old grog geezer! You know, ASL still has CM beat in two respects - Goliaths and Anti-tank Dogs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASL Veteran Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: Ok, so who used the Incremental Infantry Fire Table that was released as "optional" in the first ASL Annual?<hr></blockquote> We've been using the incremental IFT for as long as I can remember. It really makes a huge difference - especially with US Airborne squads since their firepower was a seven. It is pretty big when you have a German squad carrying an LMG too. Soviet 5-2-7s benefit as well. Unfortunately firelanes, residual fire, and assault fire, and I think spraying fire must be rounded to the regular firepower numbers on the IFT rather than the incremental ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew H. Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 What I really miss about SL/ASL is the role-playing aspect. The "okay, I fire my bmg. Now I fire my cmg. Now I fire my aamg." I really did identify with my units. The same was true with morale checks -- when I had units that just had to hold a position and were bearing the brunt of an attack, it was very exciting to make those die rolls. CC was also pretty cool. If CC wasn't resolved during the CC phase and I had higher morale units in the fight, I would sometimes fire on the CC hex, on the theory that the other guy's lower morale units would be more likely to break and be eliminated. It usually didn't work; once I caused three of my own squads to break and be killed in CC. And it seemed like there were a lot of scenarios where victory came down to controlling a single building, and control of that building was determined in the CC phase of the last turn. Explanation of terms/concepts for non SL/ASL ppl: bmg=bow machine gun; cmg = coax. mg; aamg = anti-aircraft mg; CC = the close combat phase, where troops are fighting hand to hand within the same hex. If you fire at units in CC, you affect all units within the hex equally, including your own. All broken units in CC are eliminated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr> You know, ASL still has CM beat in two respects - Goliaths and Anti-tank Dogs! <hr></blockquote> Don't forget horses and M16 Quad .50's And cliff climbing, nationality modifiers, motorcycles etc etc. Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: Oh my God, I was at a hobby store today. The latest ASL modules are 90 dollars Canadian - no mounted maps, just paper, and a dozen scenarios. That's it. Perhaps 100 or so counters. What on earth are they charging all the money for?<hr></blockquote> ...what ASL modules are these? I'm unaware of any official (AH/MMP) modules fitting this description. I think they're charging the money for "profit for the shopkeeper." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by L.Tankersley: ...what ASL modules are these? I'm unaware of any official (AH/MMP) modules fitting this description. I think they're charging the money for "profit for the shopkeeper."<hr></blockquote> AH is no more; MMC now does their stuff. They just released a "historical study" or whatever they called it, about Guadalcanal (maybe not "just" but I never saw it before). paper map and a dozen scenarios, nearly 100 bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shep Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 I sold my nearly complete set about a year ago... I got several hundred bucks for it. Every once in a while I miss Hero Creation or some such bit of chrome, but it definitely got to be an exercise in rules memory instead of a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Pilot Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 I really shouldn't date myself, but is anyone here a fan of Squad Leader, but not ASL? I got into SL many years ago, and tried keeping up with the rules (from Cross of Iron to Crescendo of Doom and finally Anvil of Victory). I thought about switching over to ASL, but felt that it was just TOO detailed. For example, I thought SL did a good job of simulating the role of a platoon commander (direct your men here, tell them to fire on this target - don't care how, just get it done). ASL, on the other hand, seemed to be a true squad leader simulation. You determined if your troops double timed, moved, assaulted, advanced, or human-waved across the street. Anyone else miss the relative simplicity of SL? Ace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 SL was the only one of those two I actually ever played. Bought ASL from a flea market (that guy had no idea what it was) in Germany for $5 (still have it), but never actually managed to get through the setup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: AH is no more; MMC now does their stuff. They just released a "historical study" or whatever they called it, about Guadalcanal (maybe not "just" but I never saw it before). paper map and a dozen scenarios, nearly 100 bucks.<hr></blockquote> MMC = multi-man counter, a counter representing more than one man (duh) MMP = Multi-Man Publishing, the new ASL developers for H*sbr*. I had forgotten about the HASL Guadalcanal module. The "Historical" modules do typically come on paper maps. They're usually based on actual maps/aerial photos of the battle area and as such are not geomorphic (and not the standard 10x40-odd hex size). They also usually have somewhat larger hexes IIRC. There is also a lot of research (no comment here one way or another on its quality) and specific rules covering the battle, TO&Es, special terrain features and so forth. I see the historical modules as a bit of an aberration - if you're very interested in the particular subject matter, then it's probably worth plunking down the $$. Otherwise, not so much. I haven't got Guadalcanal, but I have the A Bridge Too Far module that I believe was released at about the same time. It had two unmounted mapsheets and 4 (?) countersheets IIRC. I think the price was roughly $50 US. I don't feel it was particularly out of line with other board wargame prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 Does anyone know if the box art of some of the ASL modules/manuals ever got put in poster form? I always wanted to get a large size poster of that painting/art on the BEYOND VALOR box. It's just way cool with German troops going through a smashed Russian town with the Tiger 1 as support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr> I really shouldn't date myself, but is anyone here a fan of Squad Leader, but not ASL? I got into SL many years ago, and tried keeping up with the rules (from Cross of Iron to Crescendo of Doom and finally Anvil of Victory). I thought about switching over to ASL, but felt that it was just TOO detailed. For example, I thought SL did a good job of simulating the role of a platoon commander (direct your men here, tell them to fire on this target - don't care how, just get it done). ASL, on the other hand, seemed to be a true squad leader simulation. You determined if your troops double timed, moved, assaulted, advanced, or human-waved across the street. Anyone else miss the relative simplicity of SL? Ace <hr></blockquote> I remember reading on the box for the ASL rules that the new system "Greatly increased the playability and enjoyment of the game", I really liked SL, so I bought them. I bit of false advertizing there, I think... Then I bought "Beyond Valor", because I needed some counters, of course. Then I bought "Paratrooper" because it had the tutorial and was supposed to be the easiest way in. After that I bought "West of Alamein" and "Yanks" because I needed (Or thought I needed) all the extra rules that came with those sets, along with all the maps that all the cool looking scenarios in the mags needed, but I didn't have. Then I bought "Gung Ho" because, well, look at my forum nickname. I was never able to find "Code of Bushido", which was very disappointing, but saved me about $50. I finally kicked the habit in frustration and with the dim prospect of ever finding anyone to play against, before I got suckered into buying "Hollow Legions" or anything else. I did end up buying a lot of extras like Annuals, General mags and the counter Plano boxes. Curse the lawyer they let write those rules! Can you imagine if popular games like Monopoly or Clue had the same guy writing the rules? Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASL Veteran Posted January 14, 2002 Share Posted January 14, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Commissar: Does anyone know if the box art of some of the ASL modules/manuals ever got put in poster form? I always wanted to get a large size poster of that painting/art on the BEYOND VALOR box. It's just way cool with German troops going through a smashed Russian town with the Tiger 1 as support.<hr></blockquote> I have to say that the artwork on the boxes really declined as the series went on. We used to think that the Partisan box cover was the worst, but then they came out with Pegasus Bridge and that box cover looks like somebody let their five year old draw something with crayons!! CEO of AH: "Hey honey, I need a picture for the cover of 'Pegasus Bridge'. Do you think you could draw one up for me?" Daughter of CEO: "sure daddy - I have over 35 different colors in my crayon box so I'm sure I can come up with something" Another real bad cover was the one for Kampfgruppe Peiper II. Critical Hit came out with a really bad map for "Ruweiswat Ridge" that bordered on the ridiculous. You couldn't even tell the terrain types apart. My friend was outraged and wrote CH - mentioning the thought that a child with crayons could have done better. :eek: The Stonne map was quality work though - but how could one expect anything less since the Mayor of Stonne assisted in the creation of that historical module. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by ASL Veteran: I have to say that the artwork on the boxes really declined as the series went on. We used to think that the Partisan box cover was the worst, but then they came out with Pegasus Bridge and that box cover looks like somebody let their five year old draw something with crayons!! CEO of AH: "Hey honey, I need a picture for the cover of 'Pegasus Bridge'. Do you think you could draw one up for me?" Daughter of CEO: "sure daddy - I have over 35 different colors in my crayon box so I'm sure I can come up with something" Another real bad cover was the one for Kampfgruppe Peiper II. Critical Hit came out with a really bad map for "Ruweiswat Ridge" that bordered on the ridiculous. You couldn't even tell the terrain types apart. My friend was outraged and wrote CH - mentioning the thought that a child with crayons could have done better. :eek: The Stonne map was quality work though - but how could one expect anything less since the Mayor of Stonne assisted in the creation of that historical module. <hr></blockquote> Granted, I still like that art from BEYOND VALOR. It's nothing like those war prints but still nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 I still have a desire to play ASL every now and again, but the time limitations are just not really surmountable. Is the ASLML still up and running? Haven't gotten into a good IFT/IIFT debate lately... Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Shep: I sold my nearly complete set about a year ago... I got several hundred bucks for it. Every once in a while I miss Hero Creation or some such bit of chrome, but it definitely got to be an exercise in rules memory instead of a game.<hr></blockquote> Shep- Your email address pooped out on me, so I'll take a long shot here: You're not Dave Shepherd, formerly of Shelton, CT by any chance, are you? -dale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 George Parrish, who did the artwork for many of the ASL boxes, passed away several years ago. The artwork on some was better than the others - WOA was the best; Beyond Valor was not great, with the Germans in their parade ground early 1940 era uniforms, with a Tiger tank thrown in for the kitty fans. Never heard of posters or t-shirts being made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryddle Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 I don't know how you guys could manage the time with ASL... I had time for SL in the mid 80's while in high school. In post-secondary I moved around a bit and was only able to play it once sine '85. One year, someone mentioned that they were interested in trying it out... so I passed them a rule book saying "read this a few times... just the beginning... infantry only". Yea right. When we got together and he brushed if off thinking I could teach it to him as we played, like Risk. "What's morale" he asked? Then I got married, "good by Squad Leader", *sniff* The good thing is, however, that I have a bunch of unmarried friends and we have been playing "empires in arms" over the last couple of years, so I'm still getting my cardboard chit & rules lawyering fix. Now 7 guys getting together and trying to out diplo each other is certainly a fun show. -R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shep Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 Shep is indeed short for Shepherd... But my name is Mark Perkins, and I am a Pastor by profession. A number of misguided members of my flock call me Shep for short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berlichtingen Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Ace Pilot: I really shouldn't date myself, but is anyone here a fan of Squad Leader, but not ASL? <hr></blockquote> I invested in everything up to KGP1... then rebought SL so I could actually play the game. ASL added so many rules for doing everything that the game became unplayable. SL was a much better game. COI was a nice addition... everything after that was a waste of money (except for the counters and maps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgii2222 Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by redeker: CM also lacks the arcane "insider" acronym usage of ASL... "This CX HS will make a PF dr then take a PAATC..." <hr></blockquote> HA! Any "in the know" ASL player would know that you only need to take a PAATC (pronounced "patsy") when advancing into close combat with an AFV or when participating in reaction fire! NOT when firing a PF! MUAHAHAHAHA! Georgii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKCowboy Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 I had heard of ASL but never believed it existed. I thought it was something made up to scare kids at night, like the boogie-man or Michael Jackson. :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalem Posted January 15, 2002 Share Posted January 15, 2002 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Shep: Shep is indeed short for Shepherd... But my name is Mark Perkins, and I am a Pastor by profession. A number of misguided members of my flock call me Shep for short.<hr></blockquote> Ahh, a different kind of Shepherd indeed! I guess the world isn't quite that small yet. Thanks! -dale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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