MikeyD Posted July 29, 2005 Share Posted July 29, 2005 I just recalled something CM was pretty darned proud of their Australian Army CMAK release awhile ago. But I don't recall hearing any particulars about it. Anybody on this board ever actually see/touch the final product? I understand it was somewhat stripped-down for Australian use with historical Aussie scenarios. But I don't know if they altered any art or anything. I haven't seen so much as a hint of those Aussie scenarios making it into the wider world. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pzman Posted July 29, 2005 Share Posted July 29, 2005 From what I read here somewhere (there used to be a thread about it) that the only real difference was the addition of Greece. Other than that, no info about it is relased to the public IIRC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted July 29, 2005 Share Posted July 29, 2005 Originally posted by Pzman: From what I read here somewhere (there used to be a thread about it) that the only real difference was the addition of Greece. Other than that, no info about it is relased to the public IIRC. Wouldn't want New Zealand to learn about their secret plans of conquest, would we. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pzman Posted July 29, 2005 Share Posted July 29, 2005 Nope... that would be bad for Aussy moral. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mace Posted July 29, 2005 Share Posted July 29, 2005 If I recall correctly it's only available to members of the ADF. JRCar can probably confirm as he's the bloke that instigated the project from our end, IIRC. [ July 29, 2005, 04:20 PM: Message edited by: Mace ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicky Posted July 29, 2005 Share Posted July 29, 2005 Didn't it lead to the last patch AA bren tripoids - Are the scenario files compatible? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalgiris 1410 Posted July 30, 2005 Share Posted July 30, 2005 What Australia invade New Zealand, you've gotta be joking! (While that would be a walkover as they haven't got an Air Force.) I tell you the reality is that they are taking over the land of Oz. There are more than a million of Kiwis over here across the Tasman Sea and it may altimately be the case that they will take over fully Oz if we are to combine geo-politically! That said, they have got some better refugee treatment policies and real cosmopolitan friendly inclusive multi-cultural policies amoung others that are being very maligned in the land of Oz these days. It may not be a bad idea, and if things get worse here I think that I might have to seek asylum in the land of the long white cloud... Seriously though; including the Greek Campaigne sounds like a good idea to me and to actually also include the Greeks in it as well. It could even start from October 1940, beginning with the Italian invasion and continue to April 1941 with the German conquest where the Commonwealth Expedition and the Wehrmacht and the SS (Liebstandarte) as well as Italins and Greek forces are availiable to take part. (Not something that is only Aussie centric and being apparently ADF restricted.) Some very interesting things happened in that campaigne and if the Greeks are availiable they should also then be included in the Crete campaigne as well. IMHO, CMAK is perfect for depicting and simulating the events. This would be historically correct and a good opportunity to appeal to the pride of any Hellens out their in CMAK world, since I'm sure that there are quite a few. PS: BTW what does IIRC stand for? I can't bloody fingure it out! :confused: [ July 29, 2005, 08:08 PM: Message edited by: Zalgiris 1410 ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A. Miles Posted July 30, 2005 Share Posted July 30, 2005 If I Remember Correctly, it means just that! (IIRC) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalgiris 1410 Posted July 30, 2005 Share Posted July 30, 2005 Thanks K.A. Miles, got it. BTW I should say that my above suggestion of including the Greeks and the mainland Greek campaigne is a wish of mine for CMx2. I just thought it was odd to be missing from CMAK especially since the demands of the deployment of Commonwealth Forces to Greece allowed the Africa Korps to arrive in Tripoli in early 1941. I mean there is Crete for just one month only, although it does also have the East African campaign for interesting diversity early on in CMAK thankfully. On the other hand on an Australian side of things I also miss the posibility of fighting against the Vichy French in Syria. [ July 29, 2005, 09:50 PM: Message edited by: Zalgiris 1410 ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pzman Posted July 30, 2005 Share Posted July 30, 2005 BFC has already made it clear they will not be adding anything new to CMAK, 1.03 is it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeatEtr Posted July 30, 2005 Share Posted July 30, 2005 Originally posted by Zalgiris 1410: BTW what does IIRC stand for? I can't bloody fingure it out! :confused: So you'll never ever have to ask again. I give to you the very handy Acronym Finder, put it in your favorites list, you'll use it more then you think. I know i do. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 30, 2005 Share Posted July 30, 2005 Originally posted by Zalgiris 1410: BTW I should say that my above suggestion of including the Greeks and the mainland Greek campaigne is a wish of mine for CMx2. I just thought it was odd to be missing from CMAK especially since the demands of the deployment of Commonwealth Forces to Greece allowed the Africa Korps to arrive in Tripoli in early 1941. I mean there is Crete for just one month only, although it does also have the East African campaign for interesting diversity early on in CMAK thankfully. On the other hand on an Australian side of things I also miss the posibility of fighting against the Vichy French in Syria. CMAK was a bit of a rush job. BFC needed to get it out of the door quickly in order to keep us war-lusty types pacified while they turned their attention to CMx2...and also to pick up a bit of jingle into the bargain. As a result, there wasn't time to dig out the info on the Greek army, so that had to go. And the explanation for not having the Vichy French was that for some technical reason, the game couldn't have both Vichy and Free French (I guess the soldiers would get confused about which side they were on. Which come to think of it, might be pretty historical. ) Actually, in some places like Syria, there were Vichy and FF fighting each other, and the engine couldn't handle that. But yes, it would be nice, and hopefully some day... Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speedy Posted July 31, 2005 Share Posted July 31, 2005 Originally posted by Michael Emrys: Actually, in some places like Syria, there were Vichy and FF fighting each other, and the engine couldn't handle that. Michael Yeah that would be hard work for the game engine working out which side surrendered first. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalgiris 1410 Posted July 31, 2005 Share Posted July 31, 2005 Points taken thanks Michael Emrys both about the Greeks in Greece and and Crete and with the obvious complications with the FF fighting against the Vichy French in Syria. I have a little info on the Allied occupation of Syria and the fighting but it does have brief referrences in relation to the fighting for Demascus between both kinds of French forces. I can't fathom a set of CM simulations without being able to depict such an important engagement, therefore my wish to have veriety of opposition for my Diggers only, IMO doesn't justify having the campaigne theater in CMAK. It could have been managed if French Forces where availiable as the Axis protagonist during June-July 1941 and then switch to being Allied when they become availiable some time after that, just like how the Rumanians switch in CMBB. Of cause, if CMAK had the whole Greek campaigne in it then people would be demanding having the brief Yugoslavian campaigne and may be also the partisan conflict depicted as well. What a whole can of worms! [ July 30, 2005, 10:17 PM: Message edited by: Zalgiris 1410 ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 31, 2005 Share Posted July 31, 2005 Originally posted by Speedy: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Michael Emrys: Actually, in some places like Syria, there were Vichy and FF fighting each other, and the engine couldn't handle that. Michael Yeah that would be hard work for the game engine working out which side surrendered first. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted July 31, 2005 Share Posted July 31, 2005 Originally posted by Zalgiris 1410: I can't fathom a set of CM simulations without being able to depict such an important engagement...There was quite a bit of disappointment expressed at the time that AK was released (including by yours truly I might add) that Vichy forces were absent as well as mainland Greek. But that's just how it worked out. It could have been managed if French Forces where availiable as the Axis protagonist during June-July 1941 and then switch to being Allied when they become availiable some time after that, just like how the Rumanians switch in CMBB.Not that simple, because there was an even greater demand to have Vichy forces represented for the Torch landings in November, 1942. Of cause, if CMAK had the whole Greek campaigne in it then people would be demanding having the brief Yugoslavian campaigne and may be also the partisan conflict depicted as well. What a whole can of worms! The hope was expressed back even before AK that there would be a CM devoted to all the fighting in the Balkans. Now that hope is transferred to CMx2, especially as BFC is holding out some possibility that once the engine is perfected, some third parties will be allowed to do "gamettes" in specific areas that might appeal to smaller niches. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalgiris 1410 Posted July 31, 2005 Share Posted July 31, 2005 Thanks again Michael Emrys for the all the good info, not that I'm going to be buggard by too much worrying about CMx2 just yet, I'll complain after I get it! :cool: As an aside, though on the topic of this thread somewhat, I find the exclusive demands of CM by the ADF slightly funny, I mean who are they kidding, really! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan1 Posted July 31, 2005 Share Posted July 31, 2005 Originally posted by Zalgiris 1410: Seriously though; including the Greek Campaigne sounds like a good idea to me and to actually also include the Greeks in it as well. It could even start from October 1940, beginning with the Italian invasion and continue to April 1941 with the German conquest where the Commonwealth Expedition and the Wehrmacht and the SS (Liebstandarte) as well as Italins and Greek forces are availiable to take part. (Not something that is only Aussie centric and being apparently ADF restricted.) Some very interesting things happened in that campaigne and if the Greeks are availiable they should also then be included in the Crete campaigne as well. IMHO, CMAK is perfect for depicting and simulating the events. This would be historically correct and a good opportunity to appeal to the pride of any Hellens out their in CMAK world, since I'm sure that there are quite a few. PS: BTW what does IIRC stand for? I can't bloody fingure it out! :confused: Thanks for bringing the subject back on line guys. I have asked for buying this Australian version some time ago but my request it was denied from battlefront. I believe that it would be very interesting in buying the whole Greek campaing. Why not Battlefront sell it? Even on line only? It would be very interesting to play these battles for a lot of people and I do not think it would take a lot of time or cost to develop it. Lets hope... [ July 31, 2005, 05:50 PM: Message edited by: spartan1 ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted August 1, 2005 Share Posted August 1, 2005 Why can't you do that now? :confused: The editor can be quite powerful, if you let it. AIUI, none of the elements in CM:ADF are missing from CMAK1.03. If you want to play Aussies vs SS and Italians in 'Greek' terrain, that is certainly within your current capability. The only limitation is your imagination. from Emrys: for some technical reason, the game couldn't have both Vichy and Free French I've never really understood this rationale. It'd make sense if they'd said 'we ran out of room on the disk', or 'we can ony have ?6? forces on each side, and Vichy is one too many', but saying 'we can't have these two nations both in the database' is just strange. Especially given the way Rumania were handled in CMBB. I mean, it's just code. The code doesn't care which country a unit is supposed to be from. Heck - look at the mods people have done to make Pacific versions of CM. If you felt like it, you could mod all the Italian (or LW, or SS, or sumfink) units to be Vichy instead. The game won't mind. But BFC couldn't do that to their own game? Strange. Regards JonS 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozi_digger Posted August 1, 2005 Share Posted August 1, 2005 Originally posted by MikeyD: Anybody on this board ever actually see/touch the final product? I understand it was somewhat stripped-down for Australian use with historical Aussie scenarios. But I don't know if they altered any art or anything. I haven't seen so much as a hint of those Aussie scenarios making it into the wider world. Yes! I've touched it! I have a copy. You're right - it is just a stripped down version with Bren Tripods and a shed-load of Crete scenarios. Nothing fancy and no Greece. Also includes a historical interface to teach RMC cadets about 2nd AIF history. You're not missing mutch, but it it is suitable for what it is intended - to teach history & get a grasp of basic tactics. Using a great simulation as the engine I might add (do I get my free copy of CMx2 now, BFC?) BTW, I was disappointed too - about the missing Vichy French - but I got over it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozi_digger Posted August 1, 2005 Share Posted August 1, 2005 Originally posted by spartan1: Why not Battlefront sell it? Even on line only? It would be very interesting to play these battles for a lot of people and I do not think it would take a lot of time or cost to develop it. Lets hope... Simple answer - because the licence for that particular version (AAV) belongs to the Commonwealth Department of Defence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalgiris 1410 Posted August 1, 2005 Share Posted August 1, 2005 Originally posted by ozi_digger: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by MikeyD: Anybody on this board ever actually see/touch the final product? I understand it was somewhat stripped-down for Australian use with historical Aussie scenarios. But I haven't seen so much as a hint of those Aussie scenarios making it into the wider world. Yes! I've touched it! I have a copy. You're right - it is just a stripped down version with Bren Tripods and a shed-load of Crete scenarios. Nothing fancy and no Greece. Also includes an historical interface to teach RMC cadets about 2nd AIF history. You're not missing mutch, but it it is suitable for what it is intended - to teach history & get a grasp of basic tactics. Using a great simulation as the engine I might add, BTW, I was disappointed too - about the missing Vichy French - but I got over it. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted August 1, 2005 Share Posted August 1, 2005 Originally posted by JonS: from Emrys: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />for some technical reason, the game couldn't have both Vichy and Free French I've never really understood this rationale. It'd make sense if they'd said 'we ran out of room on the disk', or 'we can ony have ?6? forces on each side, and Vichy is one too many', but saying 'we can't have these two nations both in the database' is just strange.</font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted August 1, 2005 Share Posted August 1, 2005 Originally posted by JonS: Heck - look at the mods people have done to make Pacific versions of CM. If you felt like it, you could mod all the Italian (or LW, or SS, or sumfink) units to be Vichy instead.Maybe, but it wouldn't feel right...at least not to me. They'd just be Italians (or LW, or SS, or sumfink) in Vichy uniforms. And that's not a trivial objection either. The different armies had different organizations and their weapons had different performances. So what would the point be? Yes, you can do it, but so what? And as for the Pacific versions, the same thing applies. You have the same armies; all you've changed is the uniforms and added palm trees. Come to think of it, the game already had palm trees. :confused: Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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