Not using Panzersfausts

[Bertram]

In a current game the enemy (Americans) drove their tanks (one M5A1, the other I don't remember) straight to the wood edge where 3 of my veteran squads were waiting, with 2 'fausts' a piece. A bit over to the side a M8 recon verhicle parked about 40 meters away, in view of a veteran engineer squad (also armed with 2 fausts and a satchel charge).

I ordered my squads to target the verhicles, and sat back to enjoy.

One of the three squad used a faust when the tanks were at 40 meters(a miss), the others just opened up with small arms fire. The tanks buttoned up of course (and fired back).

Then all my men stopped firing. One squad was spotted, and drew all the fire (alternating between pinned and alerted). The others were not shot upon (rested and ok state).

Next turn I gave all my men orders to target the tanks again. They kept the tanks targetted, but still didn't fire (kind of logical, small arms fire won't hurt those tanks), and didn't use their fausts. This while the tanks were sitting 40 meters away, not moving, an firing on just one squad.

The fausts were the 100 meters range model, the weather clear, what is wrong with my men? And no, they were not even SS Hamsters!

Bertram

[jshandorf]

I have noticed sometimes that infantry will not fire P-faust unless they have a really "good" shot. Regardless of the range.

My advice to you is to just keep them hidin. If they want to fire thier P-Faust they will get up and fire it. Then you can avoid exposing your position and taking DF tank fire.

Jeff

[Monty]

I had some good results with CLOSE assaults.

( only do this when no other enemy units are nearby )

Give a RUN command close to the enemy tank ( buttoned preferred)at about 5 meters distance.

Then the unit will use their fausts.

In most cases, other enemy units are closeby so you cant use this method ( or you have to risk a (half)squad for the chance taking out a tank.

[Madmatt]

How deep were your troops in the woods? I had noticed similar occurances during my beta testing last year but my troops were always rather deep in the woods. When I moved them closer to the treeline edge they would fire their panzerfausts as planned.

Has to do something with not wanting the faust to hit trees and branches so there is a built in delay or hesitantcy to fire when deep in woods as I recall.

Madmatt

[Gen-x87H]

I have found that the best results for a unit to use thier fausts is to just have them hide and let them shoot it on thier own.

For me I have yet to target an Armored vehicle and have them shoot fausts. But if I just let them sit and pick thier own targets they will open up with the deadly weapon with great results.

Gen

[Chad Harrison]

in reality, firing a panzerfaust took a lot of guts to do. because of the backblast that it generated, you did not want to be in front of anybody (unless you wanted BBQ german). this would require you to reposition yourself (unless they were already clear to fire), and then the worst part was the fact that you had to stand completely erect to fire the weapon. while standing you had to aim.

standing erect doesnt exactly keep you hidden and any tank commander who is unbuttoend and has access to anything that shoots is going to do everything in their power to kill that man. so it was quite a process to fire one, ESPECIALLY for someone who has not done it before in combat.(im sure you all knew all that, but just for those who dont)

so IMO, BTS did a good job of representing this. our little regular virtual soldiers might not be that willing to expose themselves to that fire.

in other cases i have had a single tank drive by an my entire platoon fire every one that they have at it!

[MikeyD]

I remember hearing someone describe being taught as a teenage girl to fire a Pfaust in defense of the fatherland. Her first shot she bull's-eyed the target, but the rocket backblast was such an unpleasant shock that every shot after that she flinched and missed.

[Chad Harrison]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MikeyD:

I remember hearing someone describe being taught as a teenage girl to fire a Pfaust in defense of the fatherland. Her first shot she bull's-eyed the target, but the rocket backblast was such an unpleasant shock that every shot after that she flinched and missed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

ive read stories of green american or german troops firing zooks/fausts/schreks in woods/buildings/or in front of their buddies and they forgot about the backblast in the intensity of combat. many a people died as a result from the burns and blast. you also hear stories of a bazooka crew hiding in building and having to run outside to fire the weapon. thats not modelled in CM, but who cares about that little of a detail.

[Vergeltungswaffe]

Not to mention that the 'faust was inherently somewhat unstable, not unlike the T-stoff and Z-stoff that cost the lives of quite a few Me 163 Komet pilots. It occasionally went ka-blooey when you depressed the firing lever.

[jshandorf]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>{snip}and then the worst part was the fact that you had to stand completely erect to fire the weapon. while standing you had to aim.

[/QB]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not true. The weapon can and was fired from a kneeling position.

I have seen numerous footage clips of P-Fausts fired from a kneeling position.

Jeff

[Runyan99]

I find that squads will generally only use their fausts when they are VERY close to the enemy tank, are not being fired upon by that tank (and preferably no one else either), and they have a side or rear shot.

In general, it is pretty tough to get them to use the things, but sometimes they will. It takes some skill...and luck.

[Chad Harrison]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jshandorf:

Not true. The weapon can and was fired from a kneeling position.

I have seen numerous footage clips of P-Fausts fired from a kneeling position.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

now let me remember, if you fire it at an angle such that the backblast is aimed towards the ground (kneeling and firing the weapon at a 45degree angle), wouldnt the blast then expand on the ground making a mess of him also? that is why i thought they would mostly stand up. but, you are right, the closer the target is, the lower of trajectory you would need; ie a lower angle. so if it was close, you could knee; if it was far, you would have to stand up due to the backblast. is anyone for sure? are there any lucker suckers out there who have fired one or a similar weapon?

[PiggDogg]

I have found that germans only fire pzfausts when the allied vehicle is very close (20-40 meters). After many, many games, I do not think that I have ever seen a pzfaust fired at any allied tank at any reange including close or very close. However, I have frequently seen pzfausts fired at close & very close 1/2tracks & armored cars with frequent successful effect.

Basically, I feel that the AI just does not have pzfausts fired at tanks. At least, this is the way that I play the game.

Hey, last night, I had one of my cool, in forest, Brit 2 inch mortars destroy a german armored car at about 25 meters. That was really, really cool. :cool: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Cheers, Richard

[Buckeye]

Fausts will definitely kill tanks. Heck, I had one kill a Pershing in a PBEM game recently. Helps to have your units hidden. Targeting will just give them away from small arms fire. They will tend to wait until the tank is very close.

[GAZ NZ]

Yea ive found the German squads carring fausts to be fussing about firing them.

The target usually has to be in 10-40 yards alot of the time.

Sometimes u have to make them specifically target the target otehr times they can do it on there own.

This has already been stated but ive seen them do amazingly long shots as well.

I think it just varies with luck a bit as well.

Although what was the tanks range when it charged ya troops?

What was the fausts range? was it a 30?

[eba]

Just finished a QB, veteran American Airborne, night-time. My guys were firing their rifle grenades right and left. Killed three German halftracks before my bazooka teams could even get in position. The targets were very close, my guys were in good cover (but on the outer edge) and I let them pick their own targets. In fact, I've found that it's generally better to let your guys pick their own targets rather than plotting them yourself.

[The Commissar]

Dont forget experience levels. Anyone remember that Fionn vs. Someone else AAR where Fionn made an example of using all infantry against a combined armed attack? His Germans killed the enemy Shermans from what must have been at least 60 metres, and they did it when ordered to. More then once! They were Elite, I believe.

[lcm1947]

In the army we were trained to shoot the bazooka. We fired 3 shots apiece. One time one of the training personel took a boxen box and placed it behind the guy fixin to fire. Well, it was impressive to say the least. It blow that box all to hell. I mean blow it up and made it disappear. Only splinters left. Now true it was only a pine box but it should made everybody realize you didn't want to get behind a bazooka when it fired. We were taught to fire in a kneeling

position to be more sable. But yeah you probably wouldn't want to aim it real high where the back blast could hit the ground close to you but I think you'd have to be shooting pretty straight up to have that happen as the thing protruded out behind you a foot or foot and a half. Anyway, you wouldn't believe how accurate they were. We got to shoot at already destroyed tanks. It was cool.

[WineCape]

There is a interesting discussion on the capabilities of the panzerfaust to be found here...

Regards,

Charl Theron

[Tripps]

had some tanks bothering me in a city, mind you so did i, it was one of those fights... but anyways, here is one way to force your guys to fire:

as you can see from the screenshots, ran some guys up (others ran into the building to the right of the sherman to assualt/suppress the inf) and plonked them right in front of the sherman, they sure as hell fired then!! they actually then realised 'hey, damn commander, we're in the open!' and bugged out to the nearest cover, which was the same building as mentioned above, and helped turn the tide of the assualt

but yeah, in your situation, i would have targeted, but stayed hidden, or if there were no enemy inf around, run some out

[The Commissar]

Hey Tripps, what was the experience level of those troops?

[The Commissar]

This faust-talk got me all fired up, so I went and installed CC2. One of its most memorable features for me was how an Allied tank in close quarters had a snowball's chance in hell of getting through the mission alive if there was even a single German Hamstertruppen within a 10 city block area!

All I had to do was run a puny 3 man Scout team inside a building next to which a Sherm76 was parked. Second later, the Sherm goes up. I tried the same thing in CMBO, and my men fired once out of the 5 times I ran the test.

Probably the only thing I miss about CC, unrealistic as it probably was, lol...

[lcm1947]

Hey, that wasn't Monty's granddad in that picture was it?

[Tripps]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Commissar:

Hey Tripps, what was the experience level of those troops?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

vet, all i can say is my opponent wasnt the happiest

but i must say, its a laugh to watch, from the time they round the corner, and after run to the building, is like 1-2 seconds, we both had to watch a couple times cos we kept missing it!