Blazing 88's Posted June 12 Share Posted June 12 (edited) Good watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFzNtqJ7tpY&t=55s This channel actually has a bunch of good videos: FactBytes: https://www.youtube.com/@FactBytes/videos Edited June 12 by Blazing 88's 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 If there was any German superiority in tank optics in WW2, it's not modelled in the game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vacillator Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 6 hours ago, Bulletpoint said: If there was any German superiority in tank optics in WW2, it's not modelled in the game. . I suspect you might be right though, perhaps because of the small maps? Happy to learn otherwise of course, as some maps ain't that small... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PEB14 Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 7 hours ago, Bulletpoint said: If there was any German superiority in tank optics in WW2, it's not modelled in the game. Sorry but I strongly disagree. I made a test a few months ago, and in open terrain, with all parameters equald (experience, motivation), it appears clearly that the German tanks spot fasters and hit sooner than the Soviet ones. I've not made the comparison with US tanks though, but were German optics significantly superior to the US ones at the end of the war? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoMac Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) I also think that when engagement ranges are short (500 meters) or less many Tank/AT Units rely more on 'Situational Awareness' in hopes to spot and fire quicker, compared to units who rely mostly on narrow optics...As range/cover increases, then Optics come more into play. Edited June 13 by JoMac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 (edited) 1 hour ago, PEB14 said: Sorry but I strongly disagree. I made a test a few months ago, and in open terrain, with all parameters equald (experience, motivation), it appears clearly that the German tanks spot fasters and hit sooner than the Soviet ones. I've not made the comparison with US tanks though, but were German optics significantly superior to the US ones at the end of the war? It's been tested out very thoroughly by Drifter Man. There are small differences between most tanks, for example a T34 76mm spots a little bit worse than a Panzer IV, but a T34 85 spots better than the German tank. Comparing to the Americans, the best German tanks (Tiger II) spot about as well as a Sherman. Edited June 13 by Bulletpoint 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted June 13 Share Posted June 13 Yeah, I'm fairly sure there is no modeling of optics quality based on national origin. German optics were universally praised, but there is more to spotting and shooting than just optics quality. __________ Aside from his periscope gun sight ( which is excellent), the gunner has no other type of observation device. He is therefore practically blind, one of the greatest shortcomings of the Panther. The gunsight with two magnification stages is remarkably clear and has its field of view clear in the center. The gunsight enables observation of a target and shells out to over 3000 meters. Once the commander has located a target, it takes between 20 and 30 seconds until the gunner can open fire. This data, which is significantly greater than that of the Sherman, stems from the absence of a periscope for the gunner. The French have identified a key aspect that is missing from American comparisons and criticisms of the gunsights in Sherman tanks as compared to Panther (and other German) tanks. Yes the German optics were good. Clarity was excellent, and ranging reticles were more effective. Yet it was observed in combat reports that US gunners were able to find and get their sights on target faster. https://worldoftanks.com/en/news/history/chieftains-hatch-french-panthers/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted June 14 Share Posted June 14 Really good points. (You in the "Red Desert?") 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fireship4 Posted June 27 Share Posted June 27 (edited) Peter Samsonov author of Panzer III vs T-34 Eastern Front 1941, recent reddit AMA in which this topic comes up a little: https://old.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/1dlx8ee/i_am_peter_samsonov_author_of_panzer_iii_vs_t34/ Quote There are two kinds of optics in a tank, observation devices and gun sights. The T-34's gun sights were fantastic from the very beginning. This is remarked on by American and British testers and while I haven't seen any commentary from the German side, they do complain that the T-34 lays down very accurate fire at 1500+ meters, which you would need a good gun sight for. I have a collection of pre-WW2 and wartime cameras and Soviet glass from that era is perfectly fine. They are still desirable lenses today, although most of the current demand is for post-war types (particularly the Jupiter series). On the other hand, the tank's observation devices were lacking. In order to make them more resilient to fire, they used polished metal plates rather than glass prisms, which as you can imagine did not go well. These were replaced with prisms later on. The prisms on the sides above the pistol port were also replaced with vision slits covered by bulletproof glass, a simpler and more effective setup (although the prisms could be easily swapped out if damaged and the glass could not). You hit the nail on the head with the T-34-85 upgrade, where the biggest boon to the tank's vision was introducing a crewman whose full time job it was to just look around. This was attempted with the T-34S but while it was possible to fit a third man into the tank's turret, it was a very uncomfortable position. The T-34 with the commander's cupola was a sort of compromise. The commander's unmagnified vision improved and he could still use his periscope to observe the battlefield, but once the battle began he would be glued to his gun sight. ... ...I have yet to find any complaints about sights in Soviet period sources, even in reports complaining about the observation devices. Edited June 27 by fireship4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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