what country do you like to play as when wargaming WW2

[marcusm]

I want to agree with VB also. Polish are very cool. I am currently studying them for scenarios.

Marcus

[Preacher]

Luxembourg

Preacher

[marcusm]

Personally I'm a little tired or reading that Monty was a failure and Arnhem was a failure etc.

First of all equipmentwise the Britts had some of the most accurate artillery in WW2 (not most but damn accurate). Both the Churchill and Cromwell were a match for Tigers.

Arnhem speeded up the conquest of Holland enormously and much thanx to the brave paras that defended Arnhem. Hollland was heavilly defended, many forget this.

Montgomery also had alot to do with the speedy conquest of Belgium.

Just some info for the not so enlightened.

Marcus

[aka_tom_w]

I guess for the record I prefer the Allies, any flavour.

Mostly I suppose because all my 2D board game wargaming friends liked the Krauts as I was growing up playing war Games. They always said "here, Tom you be the Russians again, and I'll kick the snot out off you to prove Germany should have won the war if Hitler had not be such an idiot!"

So I still prefer the Allies

Hell they won didn't they?

-tom w

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> "Have you thanked BTS by buying your SECOND copy of CM yet?" <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[mfred]

The Germans of course.Thier weapons and tactics were the best,otherwise the world would have defeated them quicker.But it took 5 years and overwhelming numbers!!!

Read this http://www.achtungpanzer.com/gen3.htm

[Trooper]

I spit on all you German players! You probably have battalions of Panthers on your gaming tables!

Although a moderns player, for the Command Decision tournament in Belfast, I bought myself an Italian armored division. If you ever want to give a British player with Matlidas a shock, have him go up against an Italian unit with a couple of 90mm guns. (Playing double-blind, of course). That said, the ratings for the Italians are usually high morale, low-ish quality, so they still don't last massively long. Very good in defense though. (And those little CV33s are dead cool against infantry!). The Solothurn A/T rifle will do nasty things to cruisers as well.

That said, the worst I've ever done was playing as Belgians defending against German armor.. My first game of CD, and after having bid away various decent units, and taking Belgians, I then asked what the integral anti-tank weapons Belgian infantry platoons had... None. Oops. Suffice to say I got hammered. The poles always do well in the tournament (High morale, and one of only two armies that have all stands with integral AT rifles).

I had a gaming buddy who would always take the best of everything he could. If we're playing a 1986 game, and he finds a reference saying "The T-80U entered service in late 1986", I'll wager he's going to have a regiment's worth of the things, even if in real life they entered service in December, and only 15 were built by year end. The amount of German WWII players who do the same thing is abominable. I recall one guy that had companies of Pershings, until we finally forked out a reference saying that they were distributed in platoons.

I go to the other extreme. My Abrams battalion has a National Guard roundout company of M60s. I've got a mixed battalion 50-50 of Chieftans and Challengers. (Even though I know that they usually were not mixed in real life). Why? To give myself a bit of a challenge. Also to have a bit of variety and to play with things nobody else does.

I always wanted to model the entire Irish Army in Command Decision scale... I just couldn't face up to painting all the individual 1/300 scale soldiers. That said, it would only have cost me about 30 quid. I might do it yet.

Later all...

Manic Moran

[mfred]

Well Trooper,

German forces are like candy at the store.YOU CAN'T HAVE ENOUGH!!!!

[Boogie]

I always play the allies. Usually I play against this Legionnaire friend of mine. We've made an agreement, that neither of us is allowed to take a look at opposite side's "arsenal". Gentlemen...

[Jochen2]

I´m German - but, i like to play the US first. At second - the germans.

Jochen

[Guest smbutler]

A'm an eh-MER-iken, son, so I PLAY as an

eh_-MER-iken. None of them ferners for me;

they do make good targets, though.

Actually, I have to admit, sometimes I do like to play with German toys, and I am a sucker for British military tradition. So I'm pretty much an equal opportunity butt kicker

(or butt kickee).

[howardb]

Dang.. when I think about it I always tend to play the bad guys. Germans, Imperial forces (Star Wars), playing like a bad guy in RPG's etc. Maybe it's because all my suppressed anger can be brought to daylight without any legal actions in games. Yeah and the bad guys usually got all the cool stuff like necromancer spells and Krupp steel.

[marcusm]

A true wargamer imo should be able to play any side at any condition. Does it really matter if you choose white or black pieces in chess?

Marcus

[Mark IV]

For diversity of weapons systems, units and tactics, there is only one choice for a real gamer: the Carthaginians.

Otherwise I like the Germans but I'll feed any nationality into the inferno with equal gusto. I am eager to try Italians, Russians, and Finns (finally saw "The Winter War", one of the best war movies I've ever seen).

I agree with the chess piece analogy (prefer White).

[Geier]

Finns, any airborne troops and any dedicated tank-hunter/AT formation. Am at the moment tired of playing US troops. Gonna set up Polish, French, Canadian and Fallschirmjäger battles first thing. And Gebirgsjägers. Nothing like stirring up memories of reading Jack Higgins (Who always included a noble fallschirmjäger called Kurt Steiner in everything he wrote) and Alistair Maclean (who had a penchant for Gebirgsjägers) during my teens.

And I'm gonna whip Ghost Dog in the CM version of ASL scenario Defiance on hill 30 whenever someone (him, me or anyone else) creates it. I must've played that scenario ten times, at least.

Geier

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Geier, formerly Kettle Black.

"The succesful execution of a well devised plan often looks like luck to saps."

Dashiell Hammett

[Papa Khann]

I prefer the Germans, but will also play as the Allies. Amongst the various Allied nations, I really don't have a favorite, though I would have to say that the Free French interest my the least. Don't know why, they just do.

Papa

[Preacher]

Re: the chess statement...

Actually, chess plays quite differently depending upon which side one "chooses." So, I must respectfully disagree and say, yes, it does matter if one chooses white or black.

FWIW,

Preacher

[Gen. Sosaboski]

Must...refrain...from...bashing...Market-Garden...

[marcusm]

Preacher.

I'm not sure it matters for guys like Karpov, Fisher etc. Maybe for some.

Gen. Sosaboski.

There's no need to bash Market Garden. Ok there was heavy losses but the overall gains were worth it. The airborne knew what they were getting into so there's no need to cry for them either.

Marcus

[This message has been edited by marcusm (edited 06-26-2000).]

[Preacher]

Actually, Marcus, I would venture to say that it matters much more for those Grandmasters. If you or i make a mistake playing black, we can often recover. Those guys, on other hand, cannot recover as easily. By default, Black begins the game behind in momentum (tempo). Any mistake increases White's advantage significantly (the opposite situation - White making a mistake - generally neutralizes the inherent advantage of playing White. Less dramatic than a Black mistake). Give a GM a tempo or 2 and the game is over. For this reason - among GMs especially - Black requires much more careful (and often subtle) play.

IMHO.

Preacher

[chris talpas]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by marcusm:

Gen. Sosaboski.

There's no need to bash Market Garden. Ok there was heavy losses but the overall gains were worth it. The airborne knew what they were getting into so there's no need to cry for them either.

Marcus

[This message has been edited by marcusm (edited 06-26-2000).]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually Marcus,

I don't think the 1st Airborne knew what they were getting into. They fully expected to be relieved long before XXX corps finally arrived. A sad waste of an exceptional division!

I think it can be argued a far better use of those resources devoted to Market Garden should have been spent on clearing Antwerp and the The Scheldt estuary. Even if Arnhem had been taken, the logistical problems facing the allies would not have disappeared. Open Antwerp and suddenly your supply lines are vastly shortened and you have one of the finest ports in Europe to unload your supplies.

Chris

[marcusm]

Well they didn't know exactly what they were going into but they sure knew that their assignment was one of the most important. Dutch witnesses quite correctly described their effort as one of the most heroic actions ever in millitary history.

Some folks also tend to analyse this particular battle in isolation which I think is wrong. One has to view what happened after also. Noone contests the fact that this very operation speeded up the race through Holland and also helped speed up the German defeat greatly.

So 1st airborne lost many men, yes but how many other soldiers and civilians were eternally gratefull for this effort (especially the Dutch people). Somewhere the killing had to occur and it happened here in Arnhem. Probably saved thousands of other Brittish and American soldiers lives. The Rhine gamble also made this operation worthwhile. Had it succeeded the war would have been over much faster.

Wilhelmina Canal, the Dommel River, the Zuid Willemsvaart canal, the great bridge over the Maas at Grave and the Dutch Rhine and lastly the Waal at Njimegen. These were by no means easy objectives and it was all made possible thanx to the galant efforts by 1st Airborne. This was the victory.

This was in itself a stunning achievement.

Marcus

[Gen. Sosaboski]

OK, I'm not going to go nuts (even though I feel like it).

A few things:

The final question on the Dutch military academy exam before the war was "Should you atack Arnhem by A). Going up the main highway, or . Going up the main highway for a small time and then taking side roads.

If you chose choice A, you failed. Choice B, you passed. Apparently, Monty flunked big time.

Monty says:"The operation was 90% successful."

Allied Officer says"Yeah, but now we have a corrdior to nowhere."

Dutch Officer says: "My country can never again afford the luxury of another Montgomery success." (need we say more?)

Yes, the 1st Abn. was a miracle, but it just shouldn't have happened.

[Big Time Software]

I like to play the Allies, as I usually find most things slanted towards the Germans.

-I

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Igotmilk (the original? Oh joy...),

Since we don't allow SPAMMING on our BBS (read the Agreement) you just made the Ban List because that is all you are here to do. And it is all I have seen you do on the CC forums as well. Your reputation preceeds you by a couple of years.

Sorry if YOU are so insecure that you can't take someone discussing CM on a public forum, even though we allow people to discuss CC here on this one. Clearly you are threatened, but that is not our problem.

Yes, we have asked that people not bother close minded folks like you, but we are not little mind controllers and therefore people can do whatever it is they want. If the moderators on the CC forum want to stop SPAMMING, they can. Just as we are stoping you.

Steve

[137th Gebirg]

Well, since Austria at this point is considered part of Greater Germany, then German, I guess

[marcusjm]

Apparently the Dutch academy didn't take the Germany army into account first.

As for the Monty "flunked", well apparently the Dutch civilians rescued thought otherwise.

Marcus