JoMac Posted May 28, 2017 Share Posted May 28, 2017 Decided to play a CMBN Campaign called; 'Task Force Raff' (played it about a dozen times using the different versions...currently Game engine 4). About half way through the Battle I decided to 'Quick' my U.S. Inf Platoon down the Stream Bed towards the Bridge ( I figured to use this route instead of Open Terrain). There might be a German 50mm AT Gun that I felt could be behind a Hedgerow next to that Bridge (there is usually a 50/50 chance that it's there per game). When I got close to the Bridge (about 40 meters) the hidden AT opened up and the shell hit close to the top of the Stream Bed (half my troops where close to top of bed, and other half close at bottom next to water) where my Troops where located...and caused 7 casualties. Now, with the small 50 HE round, new 'Inf Spacing', and Inf supposed to avoid Direct HE fire, I can only see losing about 2 men (3 if I'm unlucky)...At first, I thought the new Game Engine 4 probably updated the 50mm AT into a 88mm or most likely a 150mm Field Piece since it caused so many casualties...But, No, after the game it turned out to be little Ole 50mm AT that caused all that damage. I Just wanted to rant about the 50mm AT with it's morphed 150mm Shell...Obviously a Bug, but anyways. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thewood1 Posted May 28, 2017 Share Posted May 28, 2017 I believe its a spigot-type ammunition for the gun to give it better HE capabilities. Before declaring it a bug, a simple google search of "50mm pak 38 150mm shell" provides a BFC forum answer... So feel free to rant away. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoMac Posted May 30, 2017 Author Share Posted May 30, 2017 Wow, that's a Coincidence...I never knew of that Post, and it only came to mind that that 50mm AT HE seemed to have as much damage as a 150mm HE... I decided to run the Game several times (Surrendering each game) and the 50mm AT had the exact standard HE & AP ammo each game, and no special 150mm Spigot ammo...I'll just chalk it up to the way BF handles unrealistic Damage results. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 I vaguely recall they had given 50mm AT the Stielgranate round in the Beta stage but I thought they had deleted the round before release or in an early patch. Either I'm misremembering or perhaps it snuck back in during the big upgrade 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xorg_Xalargsky Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 2 hours ago, MikeyD said: I vaguely recall they had given 50mm AT the Stielgranate round in the Beta stage but I thought they had deleted the round before release or in an early patch. Either I'm misremembering or perhaps it snuck back in during the big upgrade I just checked, Heer and Luftwaffe, Sept '44, Excellent equipment quality. Both have 2 such projectiles (both the gun crew and the ammo bearers have 1 each). It's not something you're going to see often and apparently it's only accurate at short ranges so even then, whatever the outcome, the fight won't last long 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 You can see an example of this round in the "Carentan" episode of Band of Brothers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 However, would a 150mm hollow charge shell cause the same damage as a 150mm artillery shell? My guess would be no, since a lot of the space inside a hollow charge round is, well, hollow. Also it's not designed for fragmentation.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 It's a dedicated anti-tank weapon, it probably shouldn't be fired at infantry at all, unless they're in a house or similar. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: It's a dedicated anti-tank weapon, it probably shouldn't be fired at infantry at all, unless they're in a house or similar. Unfortunately the game doesn't seem to restrict HE-type AT weapons against infantry in the open. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 (edited) Well, the West has spent the last 20 years tagging snipers - and "snipers" - at 2km with javelins costing $75,000 each. I don't think the Germans firing a honking great wad of HE at infantry 200m away is particularly implausible. Also; hollow charge warheads are not "mostly hollow", especially in WWII They still contain a large quantity of HE, otherwise they wouldn't work. Edited May 31, 2017 by JonS 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said: It's a dedicated anti-tank weapon, it probably shouldn't be fired at infantry at all, unless they're in a house or similar. Yes but those snipers are usually in hardened structures, what I am saying is that it wouldn't be a very good choice against infantry in the open.....Would it even detonate in such circumstances? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 What? Why wouldn't it? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xorg_Xalargsky Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 Actually, this post was never about a PaK38's precious 150mm HEAT grenade being used against infantry, OP was simply puzzled that a mere 50mm HE shell was able to cause as much damage as a 150mm Infantry Gun's HE shell (according to OP). In truth, Combat Mission's handling of explosions/shrapnel integrates a lot of randomness (in my experience), but I think it's a good thing as it generally reduces the lethality of the battlefield. Although it sure feels like it, the game is not exactly WYSIWYG. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 2 hours ago, JonS said: What? Why wouldn't it? I thought they might be a bit too squishy to set it off TBH. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletpoint Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 12 hours ago, JonS said: Well, the West has spent the last 20 years tagging snipers - and "snipers" - at 2km with javelins costing $75,000 each. I don't think the Germans firing a honking great wad of HE at infantry 200m away is particularly implausible. But infantry taking time to put aside their rifles to prime, aim and fire a panzerfaust at enemy infantry 10 metres away on open ground is. 12 hours ago, JonS said: Also; hollow charge warheads are not "mostly hollow", especially in WWII They still contain a large quantity of HE, otherwise they wouldn't work. Gee, I thought it was their sheer hollowness that made them work. Thanks. Not sure who said they were "mostly hollow" though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slysniper Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 one shot, one time and you manage to start a thread like there is a issue. Show me that 50mm doing that many times, then take the time to discuss it. One very unlucky squad, live with it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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