Jump to content

Axis - CMBN Buying The Farm - Crowd-sourced DAR


Recommended Posts

MethodGamer,

 

[Lots and lots of great stuff omitted for brevity]

The Fatherland is counting on you!

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

 

Wow, that was a great post, exactly the type of stuff I was hoping for. Hopefully you'll be around when I actually try to implement this type of strategy, since, as I've mentioned, applying strategies and tactics properly is a difficult task.

 

Thanks for the information, I'll try to put it to good use.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The frivolity with which I pepper my postings is only done to spice things up. ;)  There is some serious work in there. (Thanks for the link, IanL.)

 

MG, there are some trends in your plaintive plea for players to post which can be easily remedied.

 

First, this is not a game. Seriously. If you approach it like a cardboard and hex game, you will not do well. Treat it as a simulation. Expect your men to act like men under fire. They do. (As well as can be done on a computer.)

 

You mention frustration with ATG's. How many first line armies have used them since WWII? Yeah. They don't use them because they suck. They are immobile. Anything that doesn't move, dies. (We'll come back to this.)

 

An ATG will be lucky to get a single kill before it is pinned with HMG's, then destroyed with direct fire HE or mortars.

 

The one critical element to any battle is the terrain over which it is fought. It seems like you need to better analyze the map. If defending, try to put yourself in the attacker's position. Which approach is the most covered? Which offers overwatch? Would the attacker have better long range, or better short range, firepower? How mobile do you think he'll be? Meaning, how long will he transit the various exposed parts?

 

That is the single most important element to setting up a defense.

 

(A -great- example of this is here: http://community.battlefront.com/topic/118353-free-copy-aar-c3k-vs-dms-no-dms/ 

Notice how DMS totally denied my forces the primary ground I wanted. I had to shift from long-range dominance to shoving across some ground I didn't want to. His smoke was masterful. (Smoke is often more effective for neutralizing than HE.))

 

Use your ATG's as "remote effect anti-vehicle mines". Set them back, have interleaved fields of fire, but each ATG needs to have a very narrow aperture (a keyhole location). Otherwise, you may as well "bail out" your crews and use them as riflemen.

 

One tank on defense is worth far more than a platoon of ATGs. Mis-setup? Move it! Getting surrounded? Move it! Need a quick spot of firepower? Move it! (See a trend?)

 

One more minor note: a reserve is CRITICAL for successful defense. For a company on defense, I'd keep a half-platoon (with the CO) as a mobile counterattack force. (For a platoon on defense, a minimum of a team, preferably with some good auto weapons. Minimum of a team.)

 

The "soft factors" make a huge difference in unit performance. Leadership, unit cohesion, morale, experience, are more more important (IMO) than a lot of the weapon differences. (What's better, a green US squad with Garands, or an elite British squad with bolt-action Enfields? I rest my case...)

 

I'll talk about movement and sleight of hand later. And attacking. And squad techniques. And artillery.

Edited by c3k
Link to comment
Share on other sites

kohlenklau,

 

I think his nickname is a riff of MethodMan.

 

MethodGamer,

 

Happy to oblige. You should know that, and this has been true ever since I started playing CM of any sort, and well before, I defend much better than I attack. Consequently, I know what I'm talking about. When defending, it's best to combine the traits of a spitting cobra (ranged weapons), a krait (silent but deadly, and I don't mean a fart), a mongoose (hypnotize, then strike) and a wolverine (pound for pound, perhaps the most vicious mammal on the planet). That combination ought to be enough to unhinge any attacker. I am hardly the CMBN expert when it comes to ATGs, but I've read that you can site them in grass and from some distance back fire and fire some more but not be spotted. You may not have enough distance to pull off that feat. The Russians, though, took a different approach with their Pakfronts. 76.2 mm opened up at 500 meters, and the 45 mm at 300. The idea here was to have the enemy so close it was practically impossible to miss and smother the tanks with fire. c3k is absolutely right about keyhole ATG positions, problems towed ATGs have and the value of even an eggshell with a hammer because of the flexibility it provides. It is altogether easier to locate and destroy an ATG in CM than it was in real combat, though some significant changes in onboard mortar behavior have made it much harder to take out an ATG that way. Also, if the gun can stay in the fight and the problem MG can be found, the ATG's considerable HE supply can make MGs shut up or die very quickly. The Germans still don't have smokeless-flashless powder modeled, which was a major documented advantage they enjoyed and which made the Allied tankers very unhappy. Reserves are every bit as important as c3k depicts them as being. Sometimes as little as one fresh squad in command and inserted in the right place can turn the tide, especially against a tired, ammo depleted and cut up foe. Better to hold in France than fight in Germany!

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

Edited by John Kettler
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One quick tip I learned about artillery in some bocage thread somewhere- 

First, set your Forward Observer somewhere with line of sight to the likely avenues of advance. If you can't see them all from one position, find another position nearby that can see the others, and be ready to move to it.

When you identify where you need the artillery to fall, start a single tube light mission on that position. The artillery will fall sparingly but it will still be effective.

When he tries to move his units to a safer position, or advance further, ADJUST the mission. It will take a few minutes to move to the new spot but the call time will be much shorter than just cease firing and starting a new mission. 

If you need to stop firing, you can adjust fire to a new location at the start of every turn. This will put the mortars on hold indefinitely. While you're doing this you can move around with your FO and the mission will not be cancelled. When you're ready to start again put him in line of sight and call it in.

Edited by delliejonut
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Artillery on defense...

 

It cannot destroy the enemy: it can only suppress him. Sure, some of that suppression is due to casualties. If he tries to move while under a bombardment, he will get pinned and lose men. The best action to take (as attacker) depends on the arty. If it's just starting, rush forward and get ahead of it. If you cannot do that, then hunker down and wait for it to pass. While waiting, that force is out of the fight.

 

How do you, the defender, get that to happen? TRP. Buy some TRP's instead of ATG's.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Artillery on defense...

 

It cannot destroy the enemy: it can only suppress him. Sure, some of that suppression is due to casualties. If he tries to move while under a bombardment, he will get pinned and lose men. The best action to take (as attacker) depends on the arty. If it's just starting, rush forward and get ahead of it. If you cannot do that, then hunker down and wait for it to pass. While waiting, that force is out of the fight.

 

How do you, the defender, get that to happen? TRP. Buy some TRP's instead of ATG's.

Isn't that called ... ATTACK! ;)

 

c3K has some sound advice re: Artillery on defense...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since I don't know the scenario, and therefore have no idea what you have to work with...

It's "Buying the Farm", which is a base-BN scenario, I believe. You can load it up and have a good old nose around :)

 

Which is what I've done. Started it as a "Hotseat" game so I can look at both sides. I'll mostly confine my comments to the defense (and therefore "you" is generally addressed to MethodGamer), I think, since Ian knows what he's doing and has his preferred methods. I'll try and comment on the defense setup based only on the very vague appreciation of possible enemy forces(1). So I'll assume there will be infantry, tanks (Shermans) and arty up to 105mm, potentially.

 

My first reaction when I saw the Axis setup was to chuckle... All the fortifications! (2) Then it was to wince when I saw how platoons were split between deployment areas... That's an unnecessary cruelty on the part of the designer. A saving grace is that your troops are not the dross that "OstBatallion" makes one think of. They're Green, sure, but there are good officers here and there, and they are of Standard rather then Poor motivation, so they won't run away immediately.

 

Defending is hard. The attacker has the initiative, and if you guess wrong about where he's coming at you, significant assets can be rendered useless. Reserves are all very well, but in your case your AT reserves are a single PanzerShreck and some PanzerFaust (PF, or Faust). And Ian knows enough to keep his tanks out of reach of those. Since we know he has the combined arms advantage, one axis of conflict is the denial of that advantage: strip his tanks of their infantry eyes, and your last few A teams with PanzerFaust in the hedges around the farmhouse will be able to deny the armour entry. You don't have the assets to keep the tanks out of the fight unless you get very lucky with mines; their weapons remain effective well beyond the range of your man-portable AT. Hopefully, whittling away at his infantry will also slow the attacker down; in this case his timetable is a fairly tight 30 minutes.

 

So the first key point I'll whitter about is the mine and wire defended field. This will also cover the deployment of one of your key Kompanie assets: the mortar.

 

Evidently the designer has recognised the "straightforward" nature of assault across successive hedgerows when you have plenty of armour and engineers (as the Americans might be assumed to have)! I have to confess, if it wasn't for the confounded(3) wheatfield after the first defended hedge, that would have been my preferred route as the Americans: easy to secure your right flank and overwhelm the defenders of the hedge with 37mm HE, .30-06 and some 81mm. However, the classic deployment (and it's classic for a reason) would want to have mortars or something covering that field as well, to take maximum advantage of the chaos and confusion the mines would cause. And some more MG42s... That means getting an HQ into that hedge. Unfortunately, the only sensible HQ to move is the Kompanie HQ (KHQ): 3PltHQ is not eligible to move, having been placed by the designer outside any setup zone; bringing 1 or 2 PltHQ over from the left would only make sense if you could bring their platoon and make use of them, which you probably don't want to do. Furthermore, the KHQ is the only HQ eligible to provide the C2 chain so that other HQs can call fire from the 81mm remotely, so if you move the KHQ, you have to move the mortar (and its ammo bearers, and probably its foxholes...) too, to keep it in close enough C3 with the HQ that it can receive missions. To my mind, this isn't too much of a hardship, since it doesn't have to be right at the front, where it can be got at by tanks. I'd deploy it in the far right pink setup zone, initially in the hedgerow, but undeployed so it can quickly move a few Action Spots (AS) back and deploy (probably facing SW using a short pieslice TA) (4). KHQ goes in the hedge to spot into the big, miney field, far right of the red deployment zone there, and close enough to pass on requests for fire from other elements. The mortar crew and ammo bearers get a 50m circular Target Arc (which you'll want to reinstate once they've displaced to their firing position, pointed in the right direction and set up). The KHQ gets a 10m pieslice TA pointing West through the hedge. It might seem like an exposed place, but with all those fortifications, even some light defense will hold for a fair while. You can't bring the mortar's foxholes with them, because they won't fit in the setup zone directly behind the hedge. I don't think that's too much of a problem, since the mortar will be out of sight, and in a random patch of field, so won't be drawing intentional fires. If the Amis do come down the right, it will have fired all its ammo by the time they get past the hedge, I'd think.

 

As the attacker, I have a rule: use alternatives to existing gaps in linear obstacles as much as possible. The reason for this rule is that they are obvious routes of approach to mine or set fields of fire to cover. If I pop out of a hedge at some arbitrary point, then it's pure luck (or saturation) if the defender happens to have a mine there. If we assume that the enemy has handy-dandy engineers, as we should, we have a shell-game to play with our mines, to whit: do we want to keep Ian honest? If we assume he's going to avoid existing gaps like the plague, there's little or no point distributing mines around the gaps in the left flank front hedge. He won't be going there, so won't step on them. But the embuggerance of having to blow holes in hedges only continues to apply if we make sure that if he doesn't mousehole through every bocage line, he gets blown sky-high with mines. And secondarily, we could spend a few mines on arbitrary places in front of intact hedge, just for luck. It's probably worth noting that "Mixed" mines are sometimes a bit of a gamble. They're less likely to go off on either intended target than specific AT or AP mines are. It's possible, with a thin belt, that crossing a Mixed minefield will do little or no damage. You can cover the important bits of the gaps in the left flank hedge with 7 mines: he won't come through the middle with infantry, so just mine the shoulders of the gaps, plus the centre of the gate where he might roll a tank. That leaves 10 mines in the right flank field. You could even reduce the right flank field to nothing and saturate the left flank, relying on the wire and bocage-phobia to cover that flank.

 

You also have a TRP. In a way, this should go where you don't put your mines. It gives you a 3 minute (rather than 8) call time for mortar strikes within 50m of the TRP(5), and you don't need a spotter to have eyes on the location, just some eyes to tell you when a strike will do the most good. Your Green HQs all have an 8 minute call time for the mortars or the infantry gun (IG) which is long enough to pull the "adjusting" trick to have a mission on a shorter leash. If you put the TRP in the right flank field, you don't need to shove the KHQ and mortar forward. The right flank has other HQs to call on.

 

The second major element in your defense is your ATG. And here you're faced with a dilemma of obviousness... Leave it where it is, and it has a fine FoF through the gate into the flank of anything coming out of the woods on the left. But it can't fire down the road. If he had Shermans, it wouldn't even be worth sighting down the road because all you'll see is glacis to ping off (or get a lucky 150mm HEAT, but I've never seen one of them hit...) In some ways it's not worth changing the siting to fire down the road The diagonal hedge poses some siting problems too. In the location the designer has put the gun, it apparently can't see anything. This is because it's in an AS which only touches the hedge with a corner, and you have to be careful which way you Face the gun, to make sure it's close enough to the hedge to see through it properly. This initial position also doesn't bear down the road. There's an adjacent AS, though, which is bisected by the hedge (the one where the ammo bearers start; move 'em out the way). Even there, it's potentially necessary to use a Face command to get the gun in a position where it can have the angle to fire down the road. The road is defended with Hedgehogs, so the Amis can't just trundle on down it. Even with engineers, they can't remove those obstacles, but they could bypass them by blasting a hole in a hedgerow. So, paradoxically, it might be more important to have anti-infantry defenses on the road. And the paradox on the paradox is that if you do that, he can just park a tank at standoff range and neutralise your MG (handily, the ammo bearers have an MG42) or whatever with DF HE, so you need the ATG there after all. The other option is to commit to having the gun guard only the left flank field and put it on the road facing southwest. It's a small gun, and would be in some of the best concealment available, so it might remain unspotted for a few shots, even at the knife fight range it'd be working at. Until it's spotted there's more than one AS to suppress. I'd leave the ATG and its ammo bearer where they are. Be aware that if Ian is coming down the road, he'll lead with HE. The Ammo bearers should be under a short Target Arc and Hideing to gain the most protection from the bocage until Ian stops bombarding their location. Then they should pop up and hose down any infantry trying to pass the obstacles or blow holes in the hedges. You could even have them an AS or two back, or swipe some pink-deployment foxholes for them to weather the storm in.

 

It's worth noting that even 50mm ATGs are pretty nasty infantry killers too. So it's worth considering opening up on any juicy infantry targets you see, in service of "stripping the tanks of their eyes". Generally, though, you want to have a Target Armour Arc (TAA) set, and engage any armour immediately, and manually control when you want to engage infantry.

 

Your third major asset is the lIG18. Its 75mm HEAT can KO Shermans, and its HE round will give pause to infantry while they cower, Pinned... But I'd be wary of leaving it in the defalt position. In the trenches it's going to get spotted and neutralised in double-quick time. Even if you move the trenches around, they're just so visible. I suggest setting the thing up near a gate into the road, Limbered (so not "Deployed") and have the crew push it into position(6) on the road, pointing through the Bocage onto the field you choose. It takes about 3.5 minutes to get to the left hand firing position, maybe a bit over 4 to get to the right hand side. Should be in time to stop any rushes, and it won't be in an obvious place to shell at game start.

 

Your fourth major asset is the MG. You could put it in the top floor of the farmhouse for a good field of fire, but that will attract a godawful shellacking until you don't have an MG any more(7). Whether it'll last any longer in the trenches, or fire any more rounds, I'd question. Again, like the IG, you might be better off placing it near the road and running it to a useful position behind bocage.

 

Then there's your Panzershreck. It's in a good position to guard the left flank of the farmhouse. Unless you want to get it forward to participate in a tripwire ambush (qv) you might as well leave it there.

 

Finally, to the nitty-gritty: infantry.

 

For once, the defender isn't fighting a reverse slope defense. You want to slow Ian down and bleed his infantry. He has three general axes of attack: left, right, or up the road. He's pretty much bound to concentrate one or two at the expense of the others. Given that the tactical map suggests he's confined to the left (south) of the road initially, so deploying to approach via the bocage fields would be time consuming. It would also be risky, since a TRP in the area behind his "jumping-off hedge" could chop him up nicely while he's prepping the first defended hedge for his infantry to advance upon. The road is tempting; it's relatively straightforward to secure the flanks of an advance down the road to a point, and the road permits enfilade of the front hedge on our left. Suppressing any opposition placed to defend the road looks eminently doable. On our left, he has a covered approach to the first hedge, and an open field to sweep clean with HE and HMG fire from the cover of that hedge. Even without having read Ian's posts ( :) ) I'd mostly expect a centre and left combination. Scouting the right would reveal the wire, as an additional disincentive.

 

The infantry are unfortunately handicapped by having elements from the same platoon assigned to different deployment zones. There's red, pink and orange, as far as my deficient colour vision is concerned. I would be inclined to lift at least one of the mines in the right hand field, and deploy a "Pink zone" A team(8) (probably 3/1/A) there to get into the hedgerow and harrass the flank of the road/stick a Faust in any tank coming through the gate by the field building.

 

Did I say the defenders don't have a reverse slope? Well, strictly, they don't. But the Americans will come upon that first hedge at very close range, exiting the woods. I suggest that a strong piquet there will slow Ian down considerably. I'd grab all of 1/1, 1/2A and 3/2A and all the pink foxholes, along with one red one and put them in position against that hedge. They won't have other opportunities to employ their fausts. Bringing a few mines over from the right flank field to provide a surprise on their flanks and leaving the TRP where it is to cover the last 100m of hedge completes the forward defense. All the remaining A teams from that flank will be put in the orange deployment zone at the back. Maybe with some trench sections for cover against bombardment. Them and the Shreck are the reserve. Not having a TRP on the right flank means moving the KHQ and mortar up to provide cover in case Ian tries his left. That leaves the HQs and the MG42 teams in the trench complex. The HQs should try and survive to fall back into the Farmhouse and bolster their A teams there.

 

That's my suggestion. I think you're up against it. The IG and the MG on the road give you some additional flexibility to respond if Ian comes down your right. The forward defenses are all pretty much "Forlorn hope" units. If any survive after the first minute, you might be able to bug them out, but hopefully they'll've done some damage and slowed Ian down some.

  1. We can metagame the approximate size of the attacking force: if it's just an infantry company with no support, it'll bounce, so that's no good. If it's a full Battalion, we'd be steamrollered, so it's unlikely to be that sort of odds. We know there are probably some tanks, so it won't be two companies plus tanks. So it'll be a reinforced company. "How reinforced?" is the question, but we'll only be able to answer that once the fight gets under way. Given that he has tanks, though, you're at a distinct disadvantage. The "Combined Arms" bonus in CM is much bigger than the "Dug in" bonus (to put it in olde-skool wargame terms). With one ATG, 3 rounds of IG HEAT and a Shreck, you'd better hope the metagame has persuaded the designer to not give the attacker a short Sherman platoon... (which we obviously know is the case here in this "face up" game - I'm just illustrating that it could be otherwise).
  2. One thing I've noticed on my version of the map is that there is a misaligned wire section in the barrier. This is obviously a game artefact; even OstBattalions can't mess up wire laying that badly... If you've not gotten too far into the setup, it might be worth agreeing to edit the scenario and turning that sucker round, if it's borked that way in your game start (it could be a mistake in the way the engine set the thing up; it might even be corrected at the first BRB push...) and resending the intital password-setting-up turns.
  3. Wheatfields are forever confounded because they stop you area targeting the next hedgerow, but leave any upright troops exposed to vision and sight from that same hedgerow. They have become doubly-confounded since the reduction in spotting capabilit of AFVs, because there is only a slender chance of your overwatching tanks spotting the unsuppressed defenders who are picking off your advancing dogfaces and being able to return fire. Sometimes, the extra height of the tank will mean they can apply the suppression, if you can be sure the hedge they're targetting doesn't have any effective AT assets in it.
  4. When you're setting up a heavy weapon, it's a good idea to give the Deploy order at the waypoint, rather than waiting til they arrive, then telling them to deploy in the following orders phase. You can waste a lot of time, as they inevitably arrive at their destination 5s into a turn and sit there having a smoke til you tell them to set their weapon up. While you've got the waypoint selected, you can give a Face or TA order to set what direction they'll be pointing. Face doesn't apply any fire discipline, whereas TA will point them the way the midpoint of the TA is facing and tell them not to fire on spotted targets outside that arc.
  5. I find it useful during setup to put a waypoint on the TRP's location and draw a 50m circular arc from that waypoint to see exactly what the TRP's advantages cover. If you've got an element you're not planning to move (a mortar say, or an FO), you can use that as the element that has the Waypoint and leave it there as a reminder of your asset once the game starts. Don't forget to give that element a "permanent" Pause order, or they'll go scampering off to meet their maker on an orange cross in a circle...
  6. I haven't suggested you move the ATG to a better position than is available at setup because they get a bonus to concealment so long as they don't move which is absolutely essential for surviving long enough to take more than one or two shots.
  7. The Farmhouse is the only structure worth beans in terms of protection. All the other buildings are "barn" type, and offer no cover (protection from incoming fire) and little concealment. Don't place troops in the barns, shelter behind them (Ian's troops can't shoot at what they don't know is there) and ambush the Amis as they come round the corner or enter the building.
  8. Split your teams. There are some in the backfield that aren't (and one of them is in a barn). Short range weapons like MP40 are useless in trenches that will be pounded with HE. At least the MG42 (B) teams will be able to reach out and touch some dogfaces before the US armour drives them out of the trenches. Splitting this organisation using "Split Teams" gets you all the Fausts, the MP40 and the grenade launcher in the A team. Ideal for the last-ditch defense of the farmhouse.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Womble's analysis of this specific defense is quite good.

I'll emphasize a point he made: any forward defenders will die...quickly. It may be worth giving Ian a bloody nose. If he skirts around them (biasing the opposite flank), then they are in a good position. (Just a hope...not a plan.)

I would use fake entrenchments (empty ones) to soak off suppressive firepower. NEVER have engaged defenders stay stationary for more than a couple of turns. Attacker's motto: Find, Fix, Flank, eff'em the eff up.

If you are firing at him, he's found you. If you stay there, you're fixed. We know what happens next...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is always the hardest part for me on defence.  I say to myself "that was a successful turn, I'll let them shoot at the attackers for one more turn, yeah that will be safe" it never is :)

 

@womble love the detailed description.  Once you read my thread you will see you pretty much called my plan.  Nice.  Also good advice about placement of guns etc.  I did not fire up the game by my reconnoitre with the camera made me thing the second floor of the farm house was not that great a location.  I'll have to check with the targeting tool I guess.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I did have the advantage of having read your thread, Ian. I think I came up with another couple of reasons why to not come via the big, open bocage field as well, though. The third floor of the farmhouse has decent lateral LOS to the "boundary" hedge on the left and the ground to the east of that, IIRC. No LOS directly to the front, but a bit of cover way over on the right at the level of the hedge that borders the farm.

 

It's really difficult trying to think what you'd do if you didn't know something when you actually do know that thing. We call it "firewalling" in Roleplaying circles, and I'm rubbish at it :) Trying to see further, by standing on the shoulders of the giant who'd gone before seems like a good route onward.

 

I still think I'd come via the narrow north flank, plus the road, personally. I'm most comfortable with the defined parameters of a hedgerow fight. I think the defenses as they are would probably ruin my day though. Mines. I hates 'em. I'd probably run out of time. I might give it an acutal shot... Having dissected this one for the purposes of the experiment, I won't be fighting it against anyone with FoW now!

 

As to displacing the defenders, the only time I ever see that work is when I have a bocage line to withdraw from behind. And even then, you have to leave a rearguard (who will not survive) to slow him down, unless the field you're fleeing across is small enough that you can be in cover before your opponent gets snug in the other side of your former firing position and shoots you in your tactically withdrawing back... Trying to move once they're shooting at you in other situations generally ends badly, IME. So for anyone to survive, they have to win the first turn of firefight and then fade. Not many covered routes for withdrawal on the south flank of the map, though.

 

I did mean to mention that I think that achieving the Axis "casualty" bonus would be an indication of a miracle having occurred, or the Allies having snuck through a big, undermanned (and therefore low-Axis-casualty-percentage) hole in the defenses, grabbed the VL and offered a ceasefire...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This thread has certainly delivered a lot of knowledge and wisdom. And I haven't even posted my plan yet! This is amazing, and I'm glad we started this experiment.

 

I have a lot of follow up questions on everything that's been said so far, but I think I'll wait until I post my strategic plan later today. That way, I think everyone participating will get a really good idea of what I mean by "understanding the strategy, but not being able to execute". I will go over every suggestion put into this thread so far, and apply it as best I can.

 

Again, thanks a million to everyone who's taken the time to share their experience, it's much appreciated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mobility on Defense:  This does not mean (necessarily) to withdraw to switch positions. Rather, each unit on the firing line needs to displace. A linear bocage line would give a good example...

 

Defending a bocage line should be done on-line. (Kind of hard to do it any other way.) However, break those squads up! After a turn, move 1/3 of your teams over a few action spots. (Pull back, shift laterally, move forward...with a covered arc.) Sure, it'll reduce your outgoing fire, but you're not doing much. No unit stays and "takes" accurate fire. Your guys are more effective as a threat and suppressing. So, a few teams off the firing line really don't make a difference. (Don't let my men know I just said that.)

 

In exchange, you're keeping the enemy from calling in accurate direct fire. He shoots here...you're there.

 

Likewise, fire one team from the upper floor, then time a lower floor team to take up the fight while the upper floor guys go somewhere else.

 

Leave the attacker looking at a field of "?" markers. No matter how good he is at suppressing, he'll run out of ammo before he hits your MLR. At least, that's the theory.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, I saw you returned the turn yesterday.  I should be able to do my initial real turn tomorrow morning unles....  Did you want to start again due to that issue with wire placement that @womble mentioned back a few posts?

I think that was the CMRT game we're playing. I haven't looked at Buying the Farm yet (it was still showing as yellow (1d+) in WTII this morning when I checked).

 

If you want to restart to correct the wire placement, I'm ok with that. But I'm also pretty sure the wire won't make a huge difference for this fight, so I'm also fine if we keep going. Whatever's easiest.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gotcha, Ken. I was thinking narrowly of the troops in the south field in the current game. Dropping "marked men" back off a bocage line and pushing others previously "rested" back onto the firing step is a good example of mobility. Also lets you change out which half of the squad is doing the shooting, to match target range to effective range of weapon, and keep short range stuff offline and out of danger until the enemy get close enough to actually hurt (with for example a PanzerFaust); no point getting your A teams shot to bits at long range when they can only return fire with bolt-action rifles, and not their SMG or HE.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that was the CMRT game we're playing. I haven't looked at Buying the Farm yet (it was still showing as yellow (1d+) in WTII this morning when I checked).

 

If you want to restart to correct the wire placement, I'm ok with that. But I'm also pretty sure the wire won't make a huge difference for this fight, so I'm also fine if we keep going. Whatever's easiest.

 

Oh my bad. If you are not bothered lets just keep going.  The point of this game and thread will be unaffected by some wire out of place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mobility on Defense:  This does not mean (necessarily) to withdraw to switch positions. Rather, each unit on the firing line needs to displace. A linear bocage line would give a good example...

...

Leave the attacker looking at a field of "?" markers. No matter how good he is at suppressing, he'll run out of ammo before he hits your MLR. At least, that's the theory.

 

Great advice Ken.  I have done that when things go hot for a team but I like the idea of doing it as a matter of SOP.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry for the delay folks, Ian and I were sorting a few things out. Now we're ready to roll.

 

Before I get into the details of my plan, here's how I created it:

  1. Read through everyone's posts to get an idea of what to do.
  2. Launched CM, and then put my plan together as though I was on my own, and we WEREN'T running this experiment, just to give myself a baseline to compare my strategic thinking vs more experienced thinking
  3. Compared my initial plan to what everyone suggested in this thread
  4. Made a adjustments

Given this, here's what I came up with.

 

The Objectives for this mission are:

  • Hold up the Allies as long as possible (I took this to mean keep them away from the farmhouse for 30 minutes
  • Protect the Heavy Weapons (ATG, INFG, HMG, Mortar)
  • Kill Armor

Assets

  • Infantry Company
  • 50mm AT Gun
  • 75mm Infantry Gun
  • 81mm Mortar
  • Heavy MG
  • Panzershrek
  • Loads of fixed defensive equipment (mines, wire, trenches)
  • Target Reference Point

Expected Enemy: Infantry and Armor. Numbers unknown

 

post-71934-0-93725800-1429230622.jpg

I've had to deal with Ian on the attack a few times, and everytime, he's followed the same basic strategy: focus the bulk of his force on one side of the map (usually the one with most cover), push that force to the edge of my flank, then roll my line all the way to the objective. That way, most of his firepower is concentrated on a small number of defenders the whole time. He'll usually have a smaller force take an alternate approach, I think to harass and occupy units in reserve (I've never asked about this, and now I kinda regret it). I don't expect anything different this time around.

 

That means he'll be coming down either the left or the right side, so my big decision is which. As a few have mentioned, the tactical map suggests he'll be starting at the south-west corner of the map (top left in the image above). He could move his force to the north west sector (top right of the map), but that means he'd have to come down a flat and long open field. That's not Ian's style. So I believe he's coming straight down from his launch position (indicated by "1" in the image above).

 

Given that, I've left the bulk of my infantry on my left flank. I moved a few teams up right against the hedges. They'll provide the initial eyes on the enemy, and harass them with fire. I've given them foxholes so they can hold for more than one turn. If they idea is to hold the Allies up, then one or two extra turns could do the trick. The plan is to move them back if they come under heavy fire; their purpose is to (1) spot the enemy early to confirm my plan and (2) hold them up for a turn or two. If they can fall back, then they can help hold the Allies back a bit longer later in the game (live to fight another day sort of thing. I've put a team on that hedgerow near the road as well, just in case Ian decides to move his secondary force down the road (indicated by "3").

 

In the offchance that Ian does decide to come down the north side of the farm, I've put two teams on the hedge row behind the wire. They can also provide a bit of fire two slow things down. If Ian decides to dislodge them before coming in, it'll take him a turn or two to setup. Once fire starts coming in, those teams will displace back to the farm, if they're able to (indicated by "5"). I've also put the mortar team and the company HQ on the north side of the farm. They'll provide harassing mortar fire. If it turns out that this sector is not under attack, they'll simply displace back to the farm and setup defenses there.

 

At first, the AT Gun was a bit of a puzzle for me. But after reading some of the threads, I decided to be a bit less protective of it. I put it in the road, but against the hedgerow, facing towards what I think will be the main line of advance (indicated by "4"). From that position, it has almost a perfect view of the entire field behind the middle hedge row. If something should come down the road, it can turn and face that area. It'll be very close to whatever pops out there (about 50m), but if it gets the first shot, whatever is there dies. If Ian does head for the edge of my flank, that means he'll cross the road between the trenches and the farmhouse, I can face the gun east and take a few shots as he crosses the road. And finally, if he does come through the right side, I can redeploy the gun in the hedgerow beside the wheat field. The gun is currently limbered, so I'll need to remember to deploy it.

 

I figure the Heavy Machine Gun team is fairly mobile, so it's on stand by in the road, undeployed (indicated by "6"). I'll rush them into position once I know for sure where the attack is coming from.

 

I've setup the bulk of my infantry teams in the trenches. I've split the teams, so that I can get AT teams into position to take shots at the armor, with the MG teams ready to provide covering fire. They're also fairly close to the road, in case they need to fall back to the farmhouse for their last stand (indicated by "7"). The INF gun is also in this position. I've pulled it back a bit from it's original position. I find it had a better field of view, and given Ian's general artillery tactic of hitting the front of my line first, it should avoid the first shells that come in, and hopefully that will be enough for it to fire some shots into his line before he adjusts his fire.

 

I've left the Panzerschreck team in their starting point (indicated by "8"). They're quite mobile, so I thinking I can get them into place wherever they're needed.

 

The rest of the infantry is in the farmhouse. They'll move to reinforce as needed.

 

I think I have two weaknesses in my plan, both exposed if Ian attacks to the center or the right. First, the Infantry gun is completely out of place. That means I'd have to rely on indirect fire to make it useful. Second, my trenches will be in the wrong position. My infantry may be a bit far from the fight, but hopefully, the infantry on the line and the Mortar will be able to hold Ian up long enough for me to reinforce my right flank.

 

So that my plan. It's not been sent yet, so I'm able to make any changes you suggest, so have at it. Are there any major problems in my defense? Are there any tweaks I can make to mitigate weaknesses? Is there any additional information I should have provided? Do you have any general comments on my thinking?

 

(Small note: I'm off to read Ian's plan, so I won't be making major changes to my strategy in the event that Ian is coming from the center or the right side. I'll just take it as a lesson on recovering from a bad plan, which I'm assuming happens often :) ).

post-71934-0-93725800-1429230622_thumb.j

Link to comment
Share on other sites

General comments? Yeah. All your arrows are running backwards! Dammit, man, where is your counterattack plan?!?!?

 

If Ian always picks a flank, pushes, then rolls you, you should anchor a flank with enough force to make him dilute his attack. Behind area 2 is an orange setup zone. Why not put some entrenchments and some units over there??? Ian would have to take them out before he could flank your farmhouse.

 

Any units withdrawing into the farmhouse are volunteering to enter the kill sack. Fight! Don't run...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That means he'll be coming down either the left or the right side, so my big decision is which. As a few have mentioned, the tactical map suggests he'll be starting at the south-west corner of the map (top left in the image above). He could move his force to the north west sector (top right of the map), but that means he'd have to come down a flat and long open field. That's not Ian's style. So I believe he's coming straight down from his launch position (indicated by "1" in the image above).

Well you know me so well. :)

 

(Small note: I'm off to read Ian's plan, so I won't be making major changes to my strategy in the event that Ian is coming from the center or the right side. I'll just take it as a lesson on recovering from a bad plan, which I'm assuming happens often :) ).

This is the first I am seeing of your actual plan too. This should be interesting. Stuff should start happening real soon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

More detail.

 

The left flank idea: the orange zone behind the marsh is tank-proof. Ish. The marsh will slow Ian down. The men in the zone behind the marsh can slaughter them. If Ian ignores them, then they will be on his rear (oh, the comments I could make ;)  ), should he try to ignore them and attack the farm.

 

Take the units around 7 and split half of them over to the left.

 

If he doesn't attack that way? Then the mines should give you time to reposition. Speaking of which...minefields should ALWAYS be covered with fire. His men should stumble upon them, go "boom", then they'll wait as an engineer comes up. Okay...NOW is when you kill his engineers. He'll hate you for that.

 

- light covering forces fire on the units which are maneuvering after hitting the minefield. A heavy covering unit then nails the rescue unit. So, some bolt-action teams put out TARGET against any moving units after the first minefield. (And they can also shoot the guys who triggered the minefield.) The attacker's drill will be to either push through (and take the hits), or pull back, lay down covering fire, then create gaps in the minefield. The suppression fire will cause you to displace your teams. Do so (as I suggested above). Fire for a turn or two, then laterally shift.

 

What can you use for heavy cover fire? Well, you're wasting your HMG way back in point 6. If it's mobile (and it is), use it from the start! Get it up to cover the minefield (but have it hold fire) until after the Ian has committed himself to crossing the minefield. Place it on the right. That will seal off that flank. Funnel Ian into the middle of the map where everyone can join in the fun. (Pink zone behind the minefield for the HMG.)

 

What if his first unit passes through without triggering a mine? Perfect. Let 'em come. (Tight cover arcs.) Choose to either nail the advance guys when you can't stand how close they are, or as soon as a followup unit triggers a mine.

 

Will you lose the minefield fight? Of course. But Ian will have lost time, men, and cohesion. Pull your HMG back when the pressure gets too great. (Do NOT let Ian have time to mortar it. Fire for about 3-4 turns. Maybe 5 if there are juicy targets.)

 

If Ian moves down the road, shift the HMG. If he takes the other flank, shift the HMG.

 

Get that HMG into the fight at the start. By the time it fires at the endgame, well, it's the end of the game.

 

Great job placing the 'schreck where it can't be shot at. They'll survive to surrender after you've lost. Sheesh. ;)  What good will a short range anti-tank weapon do at the back of the map? Same critique as your HMG: get 'em up so they can fight when it matters. Where? The mines and wire help make your right "tank proof". Or, at least, you should be able to strip infantry away from tanks on that flank. The ATG has good LOS on the left. (And the marsh also pins Ian's tanks.) That leaves a zone from the road to the edge of the marsh where his tanks can roam.

 

I'd place it in the zone ahead of the farmhouse, next to the road. Their job will be to move across the road and use the bocage as cover. They'll shoot to the left, or up the road (and backup your ATG) if Ian tries a road dash. There's a line of pink, next to a gap in the bocage where a lane enters the field. Put it there. Across the road, on your left, is a similar gap. At game start, move them onto the road, AHEAD of the gap on the left. FACE them towards the left. That should be a nice spot. Plus, the gaps allow him to easily shift left or right as needed. (If it cannot setup in pink, then put it in the orange near the left gap. Then move it to the place I indicated above. (I've advised elsewhere to put some entrenchments in that orange zone. Use it if your need it for the 'schreck setup.)

 

 

IG looks like a good spot. Your goal is to pin Ian in the open. The IG should do it. If your are clustered, you are easily neutralized. Get some men away from that weapon. (My spread out comment above achieves that.) If Ian comes down blue route 1, then your HMG on the far right of the minefield bocage can easily reposition and flank him (near the ATG) from the road. (Not too near the ATG: once that thing is spotted, it will die.) Similarly with the 'schreck. (Not the reposition, but the flank effect.) Hold fire (if you can) until his tanks pass abeam the 'scheck position. Then nail one and displace. If you're already in the back, you cannot displace. ;)

 

You correctly identify your heavy weapons, then take them out of the initial fight. A bloody nose, then step back. When Ian comes closer, pop him in the nose again. You should not plan to create a defense which stops him. Instead, make him pay for each advance. When he finally gets near the farmhouse, he'll have lost too much combat strength.

 

That's when your counterattack force (about a squad) should have an effect.

 

Ken

 

PS: Why is your ATG limbered? Set it up to fire to the left. If it needs to pivot, then so be it. But a fast mover will get past you if you're sitting there limbered.

 

PPS: units at 2 and 3 are good, but not many will survive to pull back. My advice would be to put an entrench or two at the orange zone back at the end of arrow 2. Have units at 2 initiate the firefight. Keep 3 with a tight cover arc. When Ian moves against 2, then, while they pull back, 3 opens up surprise fire. After 2 are repositioned in the entrenchment, then have 3 pull back. (Split them into teams so one shell won't kill them all.)

 

PPPS: I've advise you to create 2 more entrenchment zones. That will force Ian to think about where to fire his suppressive support. If you have guys all over, then his suppression won't affect some of them. A single stonk of smoke will neuter your entire group 7.

 

PPPPS: Minefields don't need to be totally linear. I'd advise taking 2 or 3 and sticking them over your left. The gap near group 2 looks nice for 1 or 2. Drop another somewhere else. Make him fear the mine. Another idea would be to put some in the pink line between the marsh and the road. (I've looked at the battle (never played it), but I don't remember if you have the freedom to move the mines as I've indicated.) The big linear field will be about as effective if it only has 75% of the mines there. Use the extras to bleed Ian in unexpected places.

Edited by c3k
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Couple of things:

 

I didn't mention the trenches much in my megapost, because I don't believe they'll make a blind bit of difference to wherever Ian decides to push his tanks: whatever is in them will be rapidly neutralised, and probably "routed" out of the trenches, regardless of how well they're protected from casualties, but in case you had missed it, they can be moved to the other orange deployment zones if you want to.

 

I wouldn't leave the ATG "Limbered" at the point you press that first BRB. I don't know whether the "hasn't moved" concealment bonus would be applied to an undeployed ATG, for the first thing, but the advantage of leaving it undeployed is small anyway: if he comes from another direction, you'll have enough warning to redeploy including a takedown count (in the case of the right flank) or you won't be able to redeploy at all even if the gun is ready to roll (in the case of a road rush).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...