sburke Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 Yes, technically someone can keep two copies of a game on their drive. On the other hand it isn't really a solution to the constant fragmentation of a already small playerbase. This is a very real issue for CM that presents itself in the patches and modules. patches are free, I don't see that being an issue, modules have content you don't get for free, don't see that as an issue either. If you want to play someone who hasn't ponied up for the additional module content you can. It isn't particularly difficult. It is hardly "blackmail". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daroc Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 You go girl! Send me a setup for CMANO! Let's do this! Oops single player only... Thanks for posting in the right thread! Bobo They will give multiplayer for free. I would play single player but again the AI is still kinda dumb. I post the real arguments in the real threads like the no tank riders thread. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobo Posted August 31, 2014 Author Share Posted August 31, 2014 They will give multiplayer for free. I would play single player but again the AI is still kinda dumb. I post the real arguments in the real threads like the no tank riders thread. So they released a "dumb" game a year ago and and because they "will" give multiplayer for free (allegedly) after charging $80 for a "broken" game you are whining about a $10 update to a 3+ year old game that originally cost $55? Huh? "real thread?" This isn't a real thread? I am offended sir! No tank riders on the western front? OMG I will never play again! Bobo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daroc Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 So they released a "dumb" game a year ago and and because they "will" give multiplayer for free (allegedly) after charging $80 for a "broken" game you are whining about a $10 update to a 3+ year old game that originally cost $55? Huh? "real thread?" This isn't a real thread? I am offended sir! No tank riders on the western front? OMG I will never play again! Bobo I am just wanting battlefront to cop to just nickel and dime us with the upgrade costs. The 3 packs after the core should be enough. I have been a battlefront supporter since CMBO. I think the real whine is trying say how hard it was and how many man hours pffft. I was a IT consultant I know about how much work it really is. I felt I was robbing them the whole time all the way to the bank. I worked for credit card companies so I didn't mind taking their money. I said what I wanted - look it's a niche market but don't pee on me and try to sell me its a hurricane. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I am just wanting battlefront to cop to just nickel and dime us with the upgrade costs. The 3 packs after the core should be enough. I have been a battlefront supporter since CMBO. I think the real whine is trying say how hard it was and how many man hours pffft. I was a IT consultant I know about how much work it really is. I felt I was robbing them the whole time all the way to the bank. I worked for credit card companies so I didn't mind taking their money. I said what I wanted - look it's a niche market but don't pee on me and try to sell me its a hurricane. Just cause you were an over paid slouch (consultant LOL friggin consultants never do work, they just tell others what to do and are usually wrong. I know, I deal with em alllll the time ) is no indicator of how hard BF works and if you were laughing all the way to the bank why are you whining over $10? And no the three packs aren't enough if you also want them to keep the engine up to date, geez at least keep on track of what the upgrade program is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelican Pal Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 patches are free, I don't see that being an issue, modules have content you don't get for free, don't see that as an issue either. If you want to play someone who hasn't ponied up for the additional module content you can. It isn't particularly difficult. It is hardly "blackmail". The patches you pay for. I never said it was blackmail, but I would expect BFC to find some solution to the current PBEM problem. While I can play someone with more modules than I it is quite possible for a player to choose a unit that the other player doesn't own. Which results in the other player being unable to play the match. The only way around this is to keep a fully detailed list of units and what module they show up in. Which isn't something a player should have to do. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 The patches you pay for. Nope. Patches are free. If you're paying for patches; ur doin it rong. (oh, and don't bother trying to redefine 'patches' to be 'whatever I say they are and want them to be today so that I don't have to pay for content.' We've been around that maypole may times before, and that dog don't hunt no more.) While I can play someone with more modules than I it is quite possible for a player to choose a unit that the other player doesn't own. Which results in the other player being unable to play the match.No. That won't work. It is incumbent upon the person with the higher game level (more modules, more upgrades, whatever) to maintain an install at the same level as the person who doesn't-want-to/isn't-able-to upgrade. That way there will be NO compatibility problems. The only way around this is to keep a fully detailed list of units and what module they show up in. Which isn't something a player should have to do.That's one way, I guess, but it isn't the only way. It's also strikes me as the dumbest possible way to do it imaginable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelican Pal Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Nope. Patches are free. If you're paying for patches; ur doin it rong. Yea, whatever you want to call them. There are ones we pay for and ones we do not. Lets not get into a semantic argument. No. That won't work. It is incumbent upon the person with the higher game level (more modules, more upgrades, whatever) to maintain an install at the same level as the person who doesn't-want-to/isn't-able-to upgrade. That way there will be NO compatibility problems. Which is an absurd system. If I want to be capable with playing any other owner of a CM game I would need (using CM:BN as an example) nine different installs of the bloody game. This would be over 100 GB of data. With nine different executables and game folders to send turns to. Not to mention the need for multiplze Z folders. At this point is it even possible to get a 1.0 game? What if I find someone with just CM:BN and CW. Do I now have to do an entire reinstall of the game if I have all the modules? Start throwing in CM:FI, CM:SF, and CM:RT and we are reaching the possibility of 100s of GBs of data. Lets take an example that doesn't use all possible combination. We will say that you own CM:BN and 1 module, CM:FI and 1 module, and CM:RT. All of these games are fully updated. To play with all possible other players you would need nine different installs of the games. Totaling over 100 GBs of data. Reducing it to just the base games you are hitting 50 some GBs. That is assuming you don't keep a 1.0 version around. Although you totally should because it won't be possible to go back and get those version anymore. That's one way, I guess, but it isn't the only way. It's also strikes me as the dumbest possible way to do it imaginable. So the smart way is to use increasingly large amounts of my hard drive for same game. When does that become dumb? When I get to 30 GB? 60GB? 120GB? When it comes down to it this should be something that BFC should have coded the game to handle. If I pay $120+ I should not have to dick around with multiple game installs to play with multiple people. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daroc Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Just cause you were an over paid slouch (consultant LOL friggin consultants never do work, they just tell others what to do and are usually wrong. I know, I deal with em alllll the time ) is no indicator of how hard BF works and if you were laughing all the way to the bank why are you whining over $10? And no the three packs aren't enough if you also want them to keep the engine up to date, geez at least keep on track of what the upgrade program is. You are getting the wrong firm if you have that problem. I am on their site to do work they cannot and then to tell them how to use it after I leave. If the people that are employed could do it why bring in the consultants. If the code was tight to begin with I wouldn't have a job. The principle that you get what you pay for is not being applied here. We paying for stuff that should be free (patches). Applied to battlefront the game was released with the thought in mind it wasn't complete - hence patches then why should we pay. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Oh, you want to double down on teh stupid? Well, ok ... Yea, whatever you want to call them. There are ones we pay for and ones we do not. Lets not get into a semantic argument. No, let's. Patches are free. Not-patches are not free. The difference is important to both you and I. What you want to be free is not free, but what you want to be free isn't a patch. That difference is important too. Which is an absurd system. If I want to be capable with playing any other owner of a CM game I would need (using CM:BN as an example) nine different installs of the bloody game. This would be over 100 GB of data. With nine different executables and game folders to send turns to. Not to mention the need for multiple Z folders.Says the guy with 450+ steam games At this point is it even possible to get a 1.0 game?To buy? Probably not. I imagine that the minimum and minimal version of CMBN you can buy is the base game patched up to the current or previous patch level. And you really should encourage your opponents to patch up to that level, because, you know, patches fix bugs. And they're free. Start throwing in CM:FI, CM:SF, and CM:RT and we are reaching the possibility of 100s of GBs of data.a) says the guy with 450+ steam games down to hyperbole to try and make a point, huh? Let us know how that works for ya. Lets take an example that doesn't use all possible combination. We will say that you own CM:BN and 1 module, CM:FI and 1 module, and CM:RT. All of these games are fully updated. To play with all possible other players you would need nine different installs of the games. Totaling over 100 GBs of data.says the guy with 450+ steam games I just had a look on Amazon. An external 1TB drive will set you back the princely sum of $64. But have I got a deal for you: I can save you $54 dollars! Go buy your opponent the upgrade! He'll have a better gaming experience, and you'll save 100 GBs of data AND over $50! Even if you try and go cheap and just buy a 100GB drive, you'll still save $15 by buying your opponent the upgrade! So the smart way is to use increasingly large amounts of my hard drive for same game. When does that become dumb? When I get to 30 GB? 60GB? 120GB?says the guy with 450+ steam games When it comes down to it this should be something that BFC should have coded the game to handle.They've tried that. It was called obsolescence. It struck CMBO and CMBB, hard, and it sucked. If I pay $120+ I should not have to dick around with multiple game installs to play with multiple people.Why not? It's not BFCs fault your opponents won't upgrade. They provided a way for you to still be able to play them, and they provided it for FREE! You should be thanking them for that, not berating them! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 bobo, BFC does not have FB implemented on the Forums/Fora! Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Yea, whatever you want to call them. No, it's what BFC calls them, and that makes it the official nomenclature. Lets not get into a semantic argument. But semantics are important and so is diction. If we are not clear and consistent in the way we discuss a subject, then we are just babbling and not having a conversation at all. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 True, but that is if you are referring to actual tank riding into combat as a practiced tactic. I don't think anyone on this forum would say ... that infantry grabbing a ride on a tank never happened. True, but after all the game is called Combat Mission, not Logistics Mission 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobo Posted August 31, 2014 Author Share Posted August 31, 2014 bobo, BFC does not have FB implemented on the Forums/Fora! Regards, John Kettler Fighter Bombers? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 True, but after all the game is called Combat Mission, not Logistics Mission Damn, I wanted Combat Mission:Car Service. And then the module combat Mission:Bus Service. Then I realized when looking for opponents they might not have Combat Mission Bus Service upgrade to 52.01 so I may need 52 installs for all the possible opponents I have... who amount to one person, my grandmother. She is a kick a** bus driver you know. Damn BF and their complicated system. I can't play against people with buses if they don't have Combat Mission Bus service. What a rip off that they can't play something they didn't pay for. and why should I pay for the upgrade to get double decker buses. That should have been included from the start. it is after all Combat Mission Bus Service and the double decker is a bus. And where is the Greyhound?!! Grumble grumble grumble wheeez grumble grumble grumble 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daroc Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I give up it is a major PIA to think of trying to keep several versions of this game to really PBEM. No matter what you say I still believe that it just is charging for something that you should be providing but the lines get blurred (patch - upgrade). Either way the game is the best of its type out there or why would I even want it. The closet thing to it is of no comparison atm. I will not rant anymore about this in negative - you have made your decision but I will not buy everything you're putting out anymore the east front is the most exciting. West front to me not so much. I look forward to playing any of you CMx2 vets in H2H. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hister Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Daroc, I bet many will want to play with you now that you got quite a reoutation for yourself here. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daroc Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Daroc, I bet many will want to play with you now that you got quite a reoutation for yourself here. Dammit now have to create a whole new avatar and act all noobish... I do that already hehe. I have no idea about gameyness don't usually look for such. I know that real world tactics finally work in a game. I have been playing computer wargames since C64 when the first one was Kampfgruppe. I like the 4 F's Find, Fix, Flank, & I forget the last one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelican Pal Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 No, let's. Patches are free. Not-patches are not free. The difference is important to both you and I. What you want to be free is not free, but what you want to be free isn't a patch. That difference is important too. I'm fine with paying for patches. I think a lot of the business model surrounding the payment for patches is stupid. Like if I buy a CM:BN right now I will not have the most up to date version. Which is stupid and confusing. I also don't care to follow BFCs personal dictionary of what words mean. Says the guy with 450+ steam games Now lets all be accurate. I have 453 games on Steam. Actually I've been lying to y'all. I have 454! To buy? Probably not. I imagine that the minimum and minimal version of CMBN you can buy is the base game patched up to the current or previous patch level. And you really should encourage your opponents to patch up to that level, because, you know, patches fix bugs. And they're free. I meant the engine version. So 1.11 I think? Like if someone is at 1.11 I would have no way of playing with them. Now this is kinda neither here nor there. The real issue is with modules. down to hyperbole to try and make a point, huh? Let us know how that works for ya. There is the actual maximum amount of space that CM could take up to play easily with all other players. Which would be something like 300 GBs of data. Now most people will never actual reach that because most people do not play all the CM games concurrently and most don't own all of the CM games and modules. A slightly more reasonable answer would be 60 GBs. So CM:BN + 1 module and CM:FI. If you wanted to easily play with all other players the minimum space would be 60GB (probably slightly more). That is for a 3.0 and 2.0 version of each game (which isn't unreasonable as from what i've seen 3.0 has made a smaller splash than 2.0) and a CM:BN with and without the module. I just had a look on Amazon. An external 1TB drive will set you back the princely sum of $64. But have I got a deal for you: I can save you $54 dollars! Go buy your opponent the upgrade! He'll have a better gaming experience, and you'll save 100 GBs of data AND over $50! So the reasonable answer is to buy $35 modules for other people and purchase a terabyte hard drive for just CM. Okay... They've tried that. It was called obsolescence. It struck CMBO and CMBB, hard, and it sucked. What? I think you missed something. Okay, simple solution for PBEMs. When starting a match there is an initial pass where you only assign passwords and that is it. During that pass the two games could "talk" to each other and determine what the minimum is. Then during unit selection only units available to both players would be selectable. Although a system where I could use module units against a base game opponent would be even better. Why not? It's not BFCs fault your opponents won't upgrade. They provided a way for you to still be able to play them, and they provided it for FREE! You should be thanking them for that, not berating them! It is their fault for designing a module system that divides up a small community and relies on an antiquated system of multiple installs to maintain compatibility. If I pay $100+ for a CM and all the modules I shouldn't have to jump through hoops to play with someone who hasn't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Let's face it, you are just throwing stuff out there now that is irrelevant to make a point that frankly doesn't have much to stand on. Would you really want to pbem someone who is at 1.11? I mean come on you have invested a fair amount to keep current, get to use FJ and the cool armored vehicles, have triggers, infantry firing AT weapons from indoors and along comes someone who is still at 1.11 cause they can't figure out if they like the game enough or not to even get to 2.0.... really you are gonna bother? I know I wouldn't. They can play against the AI to figure out if they like the game enough to get current. And yes I could load it at 1.11 if I wanted, not sure why you think that isn't possible. As to modules, yes that is a slight bit more difficult but we are only talking two modules. It isn't like there are 15 out there. What might be nice is if in the editor/force selection it marked which units are with which module. That seems to be a reasonably straightforward way of handling without trying to create some kind of system handshake. However you'd think from all the clamoring that it required an encyclopedia. I mean geez, if it occurs in august 1944 it could only be CW and the base game options, you don't even have to worry about MG so now we are only talking 1 module. Really is it that hard to know what came with CW? Honestly it sounds more like you guys just feel a NEED to complain. It isn't like if you give it more than a few moments thought that most of the complaint is fluff with no real meat. Isn't it about time you got tired of this game and moved onto your next Steam purchase? It has been over a week now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronCat60 Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Hello Daroc, I do not want to offend anyone on this forum and after taking those cheap shots in a attempt at humor it has been nagging me that I might have done just that. So this is my public apology to try and rectify this situation. Best Regards, Mech.Gato 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelican Pal Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 As to modules, yes that is a slight bit more difficult but we are only talking two modules. It isn't like there are 15 out there. What might be nice is if in the editor/force selection it marked which units are with which module. That seems to be a reasonably straightforward way of handling without trying to create some kind of system handshake. No there aren't 15, but there are 6 and will be more. Another two for CM:FI, two for CM:RT, not to mention battlepacks. Then CM:BS and the Bulge game with it's modules. Maybe another module for CM:BN? The series is getting bigger. However you'd think from all the clamoring that it required an encyclopedia. I mean geez, if it occurs in august 1944 it could only be CW and the base game options So while I don't need an encyclopedia I do need a calendar which states the major operational dates throughout the war and when TO&E for formations was changed? Honestly it sounds more like you guys just feel a NEED to complain. It isn't like if you give it more than a few moments thought that most of the complaint is fluff with no real meat. Isn't it about time you got tired of this game and moved onto your next Steam purchase? It has been over a week now. Is someone getting grumpy? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 No there aren't 15, but there are 6 and will be more. Another two for CM:FI, two for CM:RT, not to mention battlepacks. Then CM:BS and the Bulge game with it's modules. Maybe another module for CM:BN? The series is getting bigger. Okay here is a clear example of what I was referring to earlier that you characterized as grumpy. Yes there are other games and modules, but how is that at all relevant to a pbem? If you select CMBN, there is no possible way CMFI, CMFI-GL or CMRT have anything at all to do with your force selection... again you are just tossing BS in there and hoping when it lands you somehow won't be covered in s**t. It isn't even remotely logical or germaine. No there aren't 6, there are only two and one is precluded by date. Spin it any way you like. In CMFI there is only one and again precluded by date. CMRT who knows yet, but again precluded by date. So while I don't need an encyclopedia I do need a calendar which states the major operational dates throughout the war and when TO&E for formations was changed? Nope you only need to know CMBN and CMBN/CW solo can only go to august and CW has wait for it - commonwealth troops... and the SS. wtf would you need a calender for? It is a drop down selection. Is someone getting grumpy? Annoyed is more like it as you seem to just keep hunting for possible reasons to complain and yet in the time you spent typing it you should have figured out your argument was completely false. The only conclusion I can reach is you just want it to be true, you WANT or need a reason to complain. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Hello Daroc, I do not want to offend anyone on this forum and after taking those cheap shots in a attempt at humor it has been nagging me that I might have done just that. So this is my public apology to try and rectify this situation. Best Regards, Mech.Gato Commendable, but I started that little bit. I don't feel particularly guilty however as it was Daroc who insisted he was being blackmailed. It seems however that despite all his expressed frustrations his last few posts have taken a slightly different tack with CM. Either he is just getting hooked and has decided to take the blue pill. . . or has just gotten tired of listening to us. I think it was the blue pill. I appreciate you recommending civility. Still, there has to be some room for ribbing one another in this community. Be nice to be able to buy someone a beer afterwards though. Hmm new internet business- buyabuddyabeer.com........ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelican Pal Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Okay here is a clear example of what I was referring to earlier that you characterized as grumpy. Yes there are other games and modules, but how is that at all relevant to a pbem? If you select CMBN, there is no possible way CMFI, CMFI-GL or CMRT have anything at all to do with your force selection... again you are just tossing BS in there and hoping when it lands you somehow won't be covered in s**t. It isn't even remotely logical or germaine. No there aren't 6, there are only two and one is precluded by date. Spin it any way you like. In CMFI there is only one and again precluded by date. CMRT who knows yet, but again precluded by date. Yes there are six. Unless Combat Mission: Shock Force doesn't exist in your universe. I suspect it does. When I mention the number of modules I am talking about the amount of harddrive space required to support multiple installs so we can play with people the "easy" way. Nope you only need to know CMBN and CMBN/CW solo can only go to august and CW has wait for it - commonwealth troops... and the SS. wtf would you need a calender for? It is a drop down selection. CW and MG or any othe Eastern Front expansions which will include Germans and Russians until the end of time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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