Off-Topic: TMA Soviet Infantry

[LukeFF]

It's probably worth reminding that sniper-school trained snipers are, as BFC have said, not represented in the game.

I don't entirely agree with that. A soldier within a rifle squad that has a scoped rifle - sure, that would be a marksman. A separate two-man team, however, can and does function quite well as what would be referred to as a formally-trained sniper. I've had Regular and higher-skilled sniper teams make shots at 500+ yards without any issues (including one who took out a tank commander from 600 yards away).

That said, call them what you want, but from my experience the two-man sniper teams in CMBN function quite well as, well...sniper teams, so I will continue to call them snipers.

[LukeFF]

Ah yes, and here's a post from Steve about the matter: http://www.battlefront.com/community/showpost.php?p=1297066&postcount=5

[Seedorf81]

1) Yes it is enough I think.

2) You not right, for many people communist party give a ticket to new life, not all Russians live good before 1917.

P.S. Personally, I think the world would be better off if it had happened this :-) -

Your P.S. worries me slightly. Do you really mean that Stalin's USSR and Hitler's 1000 year Reich should have teamed up?

[Waffen_PL]

yeah... it has happened once. It was called Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. After this my great-grandmother has won a ticket for a holidays in Siberia... thnx

[Seedorf81]

Yeah, Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, loyal artyoffficer in the Red Army in WW2 until arrested, wrote a book called "The Gulag Archipel" in which he describes who and why one (Ehm, millions that is) would win such a "holiday". And sometimes those holidays could last years and years..

Just two tiny examples: Just the fact that a Red Armysoldier had been in Germany in 1945, and witnessed "Western decadence", could earn him a "workholiday". Even if he had been loyal to Stalin and the Party.

And any Sovietsoldier or civilian who had worked for the Germans, even if -like for instance in the city of Charkov and in practically all the POWcamps filled with captured Sovietsoldiers -the ONLY alternative was death by starvation, got one of those "horrorholidays". That is, if they weren't shot first.

I believe/hope that Baron Jacquinot ment that he believes that peace between Hitler and Stalin couldn't have been worse than the massacre that the war between them turned out to be, but personally I think that things would have been much, much, worse.

[baron Jacquinot]

In fact, I believe that capitalism is far inferior to national socialism and socialism in a single country (the ideology of Stalin), today we can already see that capitalism leads to the degradation of European race, and it will disappear and civilization. I am 30 years old and I distinctly understand that, and more young people in Europe, Russia and the United States is aware of.

[Vanir Ausf B]

Well of course. That is why virtually every industrialized nation on Earth today is governed via "the ideology of Stalin" or by national socialism (sometimes referred to as "the ideology of Hitler"), while capitalism has been relegated to the dustbin of history.

Oh, wait...

[womble]

In fact, I believe that capitalism is far inferior to national socialism and socialism in a single country (the ideology of Stalin), today we can already see that capitalism leads to the degradation of European race, and it will disappear and civilization. I am 30 years old and I distinctly understand that, and more young people in Europe, Russia and the United States is aware of.

You do understand that such an opinion, if what you said truly reflects what you think makes you a laughing stock? Lumping national socialism and stalinism in with socialism demonstrates (to take a charitable view) that your grasp of the language we're using here to communicate needs some work before you'll be able to make yourself understood in such a subtle and nuanced field. You do far better, I humbly and freely admit, than I would in a Russian forum, but then I wouldn't have the gall to attempt such a discussion in any of my second languages.

[agusto]

In fact, I believe that capitalism is far inferior to national socialism and socialism in a single country (the ideology of Stalin), today we can already see that capitalism leads to the degradation of European race, and it will disappear and civilization. I am 30 years old and I distinctly understand that, and more young people in Europe, Russia and the United States is aware of.

Oh my god .

[Vanir Ausf B]

That does seem to settle the issue: the Soviets really did need those watches.

[Seedorf81]

In fact, I believe that capitalism is far inferior to national socialism and socialism in a single country (the ideology of Stalin), today we can already see that capitalism leads to the degradation of European race, and it will disappear and civilization. I am 30 years old and I distinctly understand that, and more young people in Europe, Russia and the United States is aware of.

Well, the single country that you mention would at least after a while be easy to govern since there wouldn't be too many people left.

National Socialism wanted to silence, enslave and/or exterminate Jews, Gypsies, gays, the mentally and physically handicapt, political dissidents (read: anyone who dares to have any criticism), intellectuals (see Poland after '39 invasion) and artists and writers and comedians, and every other "useless mouth to feed". And offcourse, all the (rest of the)Untermenschen. (In short; pretty much everyone east of Germany).

I'm not gonna list the people Stalin wanted to silence/use as forced labour/exterminate, because that includes about everybody that did something that he didn't like.

And everybody that he SUSPECTED of doing something that he didn't like.

And everybody that he THOUGHT POSSIBLE of being able of doing something he didn't like IN THE FUTURE.

And everybody who did nothing that he didn't like, because the fact that they weren't suspicious, made Stalin think they were the most dangerous of all.

Hitler's National Socialism and Stalin's socialism together would make a country where hardly anyone could stay alive.

I do not disagree with you that capitalism and democracy have huge flaws, but I still agree with Winston Churchill: "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time."

[silverstars]

.....aaaaand thread close in 3....2....

[Barkhorn1x]

In fact, I believe that capitalism is far inferior to national socialism and socialism in a single country (the ideology of Stalin), today we can already see that capitalism leads to the degradation of European race, and it will disappear and civilization. I am 30 years old and I distinctly understand that, and more young people in Europe, Russia and the United States is aware of.

Really? Capitalism inferior to national socialism and socialism? Where does one get these crack-brained ideas.

Socialism HAS NEVER WORKED on a scale larger than a small co-op. That's history. That's a fact.

[poesel]

Please don't close this thread. No yelling and insulting (yet) and this is such an interesting topic!

[agusto]

Hitler's National Socialism and Stalin's socialism together would make a country where hardly anyone could stay alive.

Couldnt North Korea be considered a country of Nazi-Stalinist ideology?

NK combines the worst of both worlds:

- concetration camps

- purges

- secret police

- famines

- the dear leader

- "total war" like economy

[agusto]

EDIT: accidential doubleposting

[Sublime]

That does seem to settle the issue: the Soviets really did need those watches.

hahaha your funny.

Baron seriously for someone who tosses around comments on fake Hollywood nonsense and propaganda you seem to have bought into the party line pretty seriously. And what would you know about it anyway? Yeah, you live in Russia, but you're around my age, (Im 27) and I barely remember the Cold War. And for your information, I lived where the war if it had gone bad would have been worst - West Germany. My father was an Air Force officer and we lived there until '91. I vaguely remember how happy everyone was when the Berlin Wall fell. The fact is Communism harmed your country quite a bit, and the Russian people managed to survive two world wars and bring the country to a world power in spite of communism, not because of it. As far as National Socialism - look what it did to Germany. It wiped out a generation Germany desperately needed after WW1, and decimated it's civilian population and landscape. Germany was divided and occupied, with one of the world's greatest standing military face offs for decades. To this day US troops operate on Germany soil. That Germany recovered and is a prosperous nation today is another fact in spite of, not because of National Socialism. Germany today is successful because of it's people, the generosity of it's European neighbors and the US, in spite of National Socialism, and Communism for that matter.

[Broadsword56]

If this is the kind of political shouting match we descend to in a thread that's about a game that's about a war that ended almost 70 years ago, I can only imagine what it would be like in game forums about, say, Vietnam! (which is one reason I stick to games about WWII and earlier)

[Seedorf81]

Couldnt North Korea be considered a country of Nazi-Stalinist ideology?

NK combines the worst of both worlds:

- concetration camps

- purges

- secret police

- famines

- the dear leader

- "total war" like economy

Partially. Not completely because of two arguments.

First: I do not know of groups of people, (except those who protest or do not conform enough), that are being pursecuted by the North-Koreans with the murderous vengeance and/or magnitude that the Nazi-Stalinists deployed. (But I could be proven wrong when this North-Korean dictatorship will - inevitably - end, and we discover how horrible things really were.)

Secondly: I do not know of any attempt of the North-Koreans of wanting to conquer (a large part of) the world. Yes, in the early fifties they tried to

re-unite North- and South-Korea through war, but, besides the fact that it could be considered as a civil war thingy, since then there hasn't been any expansionism. Nor has there been some kind of "we're gonna change the world to our view" ideology, as far as I know.

[baron Jacquinot]

You can here laugh at me but you have not much choice or national socialism or Islamic Europe, you'll soon feel like you become strangers in your own country. Russia is already teeming with illegal immigrants and all tainted with corruption, it is necessary to stop. If you remember the Hitler was ridiculed, and the Bolsheviks is not taken seriously, but then was not funny.

I National-Socialist according to my beliefs and I will not hide it.

But I think we have strayed from the subject and better to revert to infantry of the Red Army.

[agusto]

I National-Socialist according to my beliefs and I will not hide it.

National Socialism is proven to be an irrational ideology. If one would consider national-socialist germany a social experiment, conducted to prove the theory of national socialism beeing a meaningful way to organize a state, it was failure. It even was a failure if measured by its own misconception of the survival of the strongest. The national socialist state did not survive. The racial theorys on wich the national socialist ideology was wholly based upon are today scientifically proven to incorrect. They even were doubtable back in the 30s.

[Sublime]

You can here laugh at me but you have not much choice or national socialism or Islamic Europe, you'll soon feel like you become strangers in your own country. Russia is already teeming with illegal immigrants and all tainted with corruption, it is necessary to stop. If you remember the Hitler was ridiculed, and the Bolsheviks is not taken seriously, but then was not funny.

I National-Socialist according to my beliefs and I will not hide it.

But I think we have strayed from the subject and better to revert to infantry of the Red Army.

You know the German national socialists would have thought you subhuman and a waste of oxygen and space, since you're Russian?

[womble]

Oo! Look pa! A real life Nazi! Kin ah shoot him, pa, kin ah?

[poesel]

It even was a failure if measured by its own misconception of the survival of the strongest. The national socialist state did not survive.

You do not apply enough double-think to your logic. Not NS theory is (or was) at fault - it was the fault of Germany and the Germans not to have won the war. The theory was right - the people were wrong.

See?

[womble]

You do not apply enough double-think to your logic. Not NS theory is (or was) at fault - it was the fault of Germany and the Germans not to have won the war. The theory was right - the people were wrong.

See?

Doubleplus good thinking there, Mr 71.