Ts4EVER

This is not only an early war phenomenon. I will post excerpts from monthly weapon reports as examples. Note that MG34s or 42s do not show up in this, since they are listed in a different part of the document. It is divided in Deutsche Waffen (German weapons) and Beutewaffen (Captured weapons). Sometimes they only list mortars and MGs under captured weapons. The brackets designate the country of origin, so a "leichtes Maschinengewehr (n)" is a norwegian light machine gun (Madsen?). (t) means Czech, (h) Holland, (r) Russian, (j) Yugoslavian etc. 210. Infanterie-Division (01.05.1944) Deutsche Waffen 5.149 x Karabiner 218 x Gewehrgranatgeräte 183 x Pistolen 425 x Maschinenpistolen Beutewaffen (nur Gr.W. , M.G.) 15 x leichte Maschinengewehre (n) 25 x leichte Maschinengewehre (t) 6 x leichte Maschinengewehre (h) 9 x leichte Maschinengewehre (f) 6 x leichte Maschinengewehre (d) 25 x schwere Maschinengewehre (n) 3 x schwere Maschinengewehre (p) 30 x mittlere Granatwerfer (f) 48 x leichte Granatwerfer (f) 122. Infanterie-Division (01.04.1944) I. Deutsche Waffen (in der Kriegsgliederung nicht enthaltene deutsche Waffen) 1.103 x Pistolen 08 430 x Maschinenpistolen 38/40 613 x Maschinenpistolen 43/1 7.836 x Karabiner 98K 71 x Karabiner 98 mit Zielfernrohr 108 x Gewehre 41 237 x Gewehr-Granat-Geräte 63 x Raketen-Panzerbüchsen 54 70 x Maschinengewehr 15 II. Beutewaffen 54 x leichtes Maschinengewehr (r) 10 x leichtes Maschinengewehr (p) 1 x leichtes Maschinengewehr (t) 14 x Gewehre (r) 14 x Gewehre (t) 17 x Maschinenpistolen (r) 343. Infanterie-Division (01.05.1944) (Note: stationed in Britanny, so within the scope of CM:BN) I. Deutsche Waffen (in der Kriegsgliederung nicht enthaltene deutsche Waffen) 6.242 x Karabiner 98K 66 x Gewehre 98 9 x Gewehre 98a 65 x Gewehre 41 130 x Karabiner 98 mit Zielfernrohr 528 x Gewehr-Granat-Geräte 725 x Maschinenpistolen 1.959 x Pistolen 08/38 1.060 x Pistolen 7,65mm II. Beutewaffen (nur Granatwerfer, Maschinengewehre und Gewehre) 754 x Gewehre (j) 311 x Gewehre (f) 815 x Gewehre (r) 710 x Gewehre 24(t) 41 x selbstladende Gewehre (r) 10 x Karabiner 454 (r) 27 x Pistolen (r) 29 x Maschinenpistolen (r) 256. Infanteriedivision (01.06.1944) (Note: Destroyed one month later at Vitebsk, so in scope of CM:RT.) I. Deutsche Waffen (in Kriegsgliederung nicht eingezeichnet) 7.106 x Karabiner 81 x Zielfernrohrgewehre 162 x Gewehr 41 360 x Gewehr-Granat-Gerät 702 x Maschinenpistolen (davon 38 = MPi 43) 1.679 x Pistolen 65 x Panzerschreck 1 x Nebelwerfer 35 21 x leichte Maschinengewehre 08/15 8 x leichte Maschinengewehr 13 2 x leichte Maschinengewehr 15 1 x schwere Maschinengewehre 08 (zur Instandsetzung und Waffenreserve) 11 x leichte Maschinengewehre 6 x schwere Maschinengewehre 7 x mittlere Granatwerfer 1 x 7,62cm Feldkanone 288 (r) II. Beutewaffen 499 x Gewehre (r) 83 x leichte Maschinengewehre (r) 3 x schwere Maschinengewehre (r) 50 x leichte Maschinengewehre (f) 19 x leichte Maschinengewehre (t) 1 x leichtes Maschinengewehre (e) 1 x leichter Granatwerfer (r) 3 x mittlere Granatwerfer (r) 9 x mittlere Granatwerfer (f) 9 x 4,5cm Pak (r) Note how the G43 does not show up in these yet (mid 1944). It only arrives in force in later months, until then mostly the G41 seems to have been in use. 363. Volksgrenadier-Division (01.12.1944) I. Deutsche Waffen 6.196 x Karabiner 25 x Zielfernrohrgewehre 481 x Gewehre 43 313 x Gewehrgranat-Gerät 910 x Maschinenpistole 44 138 x Maschinenpistole 38/40 13 x Maschinenpistolen (i) 1.538 x Pistolen 08/38 Note that the Beretta (Maschinenpistole (i)) is listed under "German weapons" here, since they kept them officially in production for their own forces. Anyway, hope I didn't bore anyone to death with it... personally I find it interesting, but then again, I am German, so maybe bureaucracy is in my blood.

Actually, at least for the Germans, usually the opposite is the case. Lots of randomization in terms of how many Fausts they have, as well as if and/or how many G43s, StG44s show up.

True, but note that in the FI christmas bone thread, he mentions some kind of Italian "special forces" expansion being planned. In that case it would be a very likely inclusion.

About the bridge: I just let them "move" across in one go and got no glitches.

Well good to see I am probably not the only one running out of infantry.

I'm also playing through the Stoumont mission right now, and while I am fairly certain I can win it, I'm not sure my force will be in any shape to continue afterwards. Especially infantry losses are hard to avoid, tanks not so much.

I tried that one in one of the earlier games and found it a bit too cluttered with all the text... this one looks a lot better, in my opinion. (Part of it might also be that I know most of the ammo by heart anyway).

Well, as somebody who actually has experience in level design (not for CM) I can tell you that the CM editor is relatively simple to use, but lacks advanced features you would expect from professional level editing software. Examples: - the ability to easily import heightdata (could be as simple as converting a black and white png into elevation data, considering the simplistic height system) - the ability to create or import custom texture brushes to easily create detailed textures without undue micromanagement - a more robust scripting system - the ability to change or create new gameplay elements or materials, like new map specific textures or 3d objects I could go on. The CM editor to me is about on par with the kind of consumer grade editors they used to have in old games like Age of Empires. It is kind of baffling that stock campaigns and scenarios are created with it, to be honest.

Well, since the post seems to have been well received, I though I'd do a small "Italian special" (in light of the upcoming FI latewar module). Late war RSI forces were surprisingly heavy in submachineguns (in part because they were involved mainly in anti-partisan operations). Most of these were the late model Beretta M38/42 I already posted, but two other smgs are also worth mentioning. FNAB-43 This very high quality smg was produced in limited, but not insignificant, numbers in 1943 and 1944 and issued to RSI and German units. Compared to the more common Berettas, it appears to have been given to more "elite" units, like Decima Mas or the San Marco marine division. The magazine could be pivoted forwards for a more compact weapon. TZ-45 This weapon was introduced near the end of 1944 and was a lot cheaper to produce than earlier models. It seems to have been used in anti-partisan operations, but also issued to standard infantry.

Hi, this is more of a "long term" request/suggestion and it applies to all WW2 titles, although I post it in here, since it is the latest installment. CM has a huge variety in different vehicles, with different production versions, often with their own skins as well. Personally, I am more of an infantry guy, so I would like to see some more variety there, especially for the Germans, who devolved into a very rag-tag outfit, starting in 1943. Now you might argue that on the level of CM some of the weapons I am proposing will have no appreciable gameplay impact and that maybe the resources would be better spent elsewhere. You would not be wrong about this, necessarily, but on the other hand one could also say that the difference between a Sherman M4 and M4A1 on the actual battlefield is not that decisive. However, in my opinion for a realistic and detailed game like this, the added variety is its own reward. So here are my suggestions. Note that these are not exotic prototype or "tacticool" silenced weapons, but actual weapons in use on the frontline. I also left out pistols. Machine guns: The MG26(t) (ZB26) This Czech progenitor of the Bren gun was common in German use right until the end of the war. In the beginning it equipped (alongside other Czech arms) certain SS troops, but the weapon was also adopted by the army as a substitute standard weapon. If you look at the monthly status reports of Infantry divisions, you will often find several of them in the roster, presumably to be held in reserve. In my opinion these could be used to replace some MG34s/42s for infantry units when the equipment status is set to below average. Luftwaffe MGs: MG15 and MG81 These were obsolete board weapons converted to ground use. Mostly associated with Luftwaffe field divisions, but also Volkssturm units. In the last months of the war, with automatic weapon shortages in mind, these were becoming more common, even in the normal armed forces. Note that the MG81 actually had a faster rate of fire than an MG42. Vickers K Same story: this extremely fast firing mg was used in place of Vickers Tripods by Royal Marine Commandos and other special forces in Normandy and probably later as well (maybe something for a Rhine river themed expansion pack?) Johnson LMG This was famously used in place of BARs by the First Special Service Force (US/Canadian) in Italy, 1944. Might already be planned for one of the announced packs, but I thought I'd mention it. Rifles: K98k ZF41 Presently, the icon of the scoped K98k seems to show a 4x or 6x scope: However, the ingame model is of the more common 1,5x ZF41: This flaw could be made into an advantage by having both types ingame, with the small scope used as a (in modern terms) "DMR" embedded in squads, and the larger scope issued to specialized sniper teams. Gewehr 41 (W) This was the original German semi automatic rifle. As I mentioned in passing earlier, I have been reading a lot of German monthly status reports, many of which have been compiled (in German) over at the Lexikon der Wehrmacht forum. From these I have concluded that the G43 rifle is severely overrepresented in every game except Final Blitzkrieg. You will be hard pressed to find many of these in mid 1944 or earlier. In fact, to me it seems that during the battle of Normandy, the G41 was still more common than the G43. Only by autumn 1944 do they suddenly appear in considerable numbers. Because of this, from a historical perspective, I would replace the G43s in the Italy games completely with this earlier type and also have it in use alongside it in Normandy still. For instance, the 352nd infantry division (of Omaha Beach fame) reported 395 of them in their inventory in February 1944, but no G43s. (For scale, they reported 591 MP40s). Submachineguns: Beretta MPs I was very happy to see the Beretta M38 in German hands in Gustav Line: Note that this weapon was also used outside of Italy. Fallschirmjägers in Normandy, who had been involved in disarming the Royal Italian Army, still fielded them and there are also pictures of Luftwaffe Feld Division forces in France with this weapon. In fact, I know more pictures of Berettas in Normandy than of G43s or MP43s! In addition to this, the Germans kept the follow up version of this weapon in production in Northern Italy and issued it to their own troops as a substitute standard: With MP40 production scaled back in favour of the StG44, these weapons became increasingly common near the end of 1944. In fact, I saw one in the museum at Malmedy and another one in bad condition (found rusted in the mud) in the Vossenack museum. I wouldn't be surprised if these especially turned up as StG44 substitutes in Volksgrenadier divisions. the famed German author Günther Grass also recalls being issued one in 1945, when he was part of an SS division on the Eastern front. Sten MKIII This weapon could be used alongside the Sten MKII, since it was very common. Especially towards the end of the war they appear in pictures a lot. Anyway, those would be my suggestions. Maybe it's unrealistic to expect this, but in that case at least I hope some of you might find the thread interesting.

I have used these for all CM titles so far, since I think the more "analog" look fits better for WW2. Two minor gripes though: The icon for the Walther P38 seems to show a Luger and the K98k ZF makes the same mistake as the vanilla one by showing a 4x or 6x scope while the 3d model uses the 1.5x ZF41 scope.

Playing the Peiper campaign and so far it is fun (first two scenarios). This is kind of special to me because a few years back I visited all those places with some fellow WW2 enthusiasts, so it is nice to see them ingame as well.

Could it be because late war FJG wore standard helmets a lot?

I actually have been in Monschau and from my limited experience with the CM map editor I would say it is really hard, bordering on impossible, to pull it off.

-Spoiler- The missing platoon is placed a bit unfairly. I spawns directly in front of that armored car and you can't spot it until the round starts. In my game, it actually proved completely impossible to spot for my bazooka guys, while every movement drew immediate fire from it like it had thermals or something. Dunno if that is because it is behind hedges, but to me that whole platoon was all but useless.

By the bulge timeframe the StG44 was issued very commonly.

I don't think it will be rare actually.

Well in the interest of realism and properly simulating the kind of terrain on the eastern front probably the terrain itself shouldn't be changed, but maybe ways need to be found to aid the player in interpreting it. Something to make crests more apparent or maybe an overhaul of how forests function. For instance, I could see having a material for "forest edges" that works much like hedgerows (meaning troops line up against it etc). Often forests have thick bushes along the edges, but not so much inside, where less light hits the ground. Anyway, that is just from the top of my head.

Dunno if the AI spotting plays into it, but yeah, the landscape make predicting los and cover very hard for the player. In Normandy usually I take one look at the map and I see: Ah, here I can put an mg in overwatch, here I can move my first platoon to hedgeline one, then leapfrog platoon 2 to a hedge 50m further etc. It's a step by step process. In RT I often can't even tell what my guys will be able to shoot from any given position. Does that dip in the ground give cover to my troops? Will they be able to shoot from it? I recently played the little "Dawn Patrol" scenario and it had me cursing at the screen simply because it felt like there was no proper overwatch position to be had for my Maxims. I mean they are hills, but the effect seemed to be not different from just sitting in the open. Edit: And just so we are clear, I am not talking about "difficulty levels". There are pretty difficult missions in BN or FI, that is not the point. The point is that in those games you usually have the feeling that your success depends on your decisions, whereas in RT I often feel at the mercy of either the los mechanics or chance.

I think the problem lies not so much in weird los occurences (even though these of course happen from time to time), but with the terrain in Red Thunder. One thing I noticed it that the Normandy (and to a lesser extent the Italy) game just plays a whole lot better. In mainstream game design, which is not governed by considerations of modelling reality quite as much, developers usually strive for a certain "clarity" when designing maps, meaning it is important that maps are easy to navigate and that players are always aware of their choices and have at least a basic understanding of the possible effects of these choices. This allows them to make tactical decisions. In Normandy and Italy, this is actually kinda the case, because the maps are structured by Bocage hedgerows or, in the case of Italy, hilly terrain and stone walls. If you put an infantry unit near a hedge, you can see at one glance from where they are protected and where they are vulnerable, you know that they will line up against the hedge to concentrate their firepower to one side and from the gaps you have a set of limited movement options that govern your tactical approach. This basically turns the game into a weirdly compelling geometry puzzle of always trying to get into the back of that next line. In RT this simply doesn't work. The terrain is not that extreme, so it is hard to judge contour lines from high up. There are no hedges, instead infantry cover is usually forests, which do not function very well ingame. Basically it is almost impossible to easily judge: - How save is my infantry how deep in what kind of forest? - How effectively can they still shoot out? - Are they safer from fire coming from direction x than from direction y? - If I send my guys into this treeline, will they all be able to look out? How will they position themselves? This together with occasional flaws in the complex spotting system leads to infantry combat that feels "random" or "murky", because it is hard to judge what effect your orders have. This in turn leads to frustration, when the player receives casualties that he feels he couldn't have predicted or prevented. In that mindset of course, los bugs stand out more and seem more annoying as well.

Maybe this is caused by the MGs being manned despite the buttoned up status? I remember reading about that.

Hmm that sounds like maybe some equipment settings from the bulge game made their way to Normandy. Probably fine for the BARs, but more StG44s sound somewhat worrisome, considering there were very few in Normandy.

I would also be willing to do it (for a free copy ). German is my mother tongue, I have a university degree in English and History and I have translated texts into German for a video game modification before. edit: Also if you give me the psds I could also translate the picture files and tactical maps from the briefings.

According to BF the delay is not so much caused by development problems of the new content, but by the new store front.

If you are new to the series I would recommend Normandy tbh, because the hedgerow terrain makes learning the basics of the game a lot easier in my experience. Italian terrain is much less "clear cut" by comparison and the whole southern Campaign feels more unforgiving in general. Can't comment on the Russian front, but I would suspect it is at least somewhat similar.