gunnergoz

For the Allies, try one of the several books written by Ian Hogg, a prolific documenter of artillery history. You might try a search of Amazon.com with his name. He will probably give some idea of production figures, but he primarily does overviews of guns, descriptions, useage, etc.

Given that the 37mm turret was a casting and never up-armored as was the M4 turret, I'm sort of surprised that it would be given some sort of magical ability to thwart 88 rounds. I suspect it was thinner than the M4 turret, though I don't have the specs in front of me.

Mussolini was an inveterate womanizer who probably had thousands of gals during his heyday...no exaggeration. I doubt, however, that his perfume had much to do with it. He was said to be charismatic and celebrity has its own erotic pull for some people, so the combination likely worked for him. His affairs were well known to fascist insiders but were kept from his wife and family. When he hooked up with Claretta Petacci, he supposedly settled down a lot, but in part it may have been due to the fact that she knew him very well and wouldn't let him out of her sight if she could help it. I hear he'd sneak out on occasion and thwart his lover's efforts to keep him from all those waiting and as-yet-unsampled ladies. I'll pass on the perfume, thank you, but it goes to show that almost anything will sell...

I thoroughly enjoyed playing Russian in that scenario (against the computer AI at least). SPOILER********* I lined up the 45mm AT guns on one side of the battlefield along the long edge. I gave them all "hide" orders. I placed the AT rifles a bit closer in to the middle. I used the tank hunters as spotters in the brush and left the KV1 in the ditch as a mop-up force. The German tanks never knew what hit them. I held off fire until they drew well abreast of the AT gun batteries and I had clear flank and even rear shots. I selected targets for each and every AT gun, ganging up 3 or 4 on one tank so as to ensure a speedy kill. I had the AT rifles hit the other tanks to force them to button up. When it was all over, I'd lost about half the AT guns, but every German tank was Kaput. The KV1 just ran around killing dismounted crews. Very satisfying! I think that would work with a human opponent maybe...once!

Welcome to you both! There's a treasure trove of info and interesting dialogue here in the CM forums, so dive on in. Ask lots of questions if you like, us crusty old grogs just love sharing our (not very) humble opinions. Don't be as shy as I was about starting PBM, I'm just on my first match against a real human (at least I think he is.) 'Scuse me, I have to go now and scrub some of that there crust off in the shower or else I won't get any tonight...

Doubtless the 88 crew firing at the M3 at 400 meters was laughing their cojones off, probably causing that result.

This thread is a treasure! Very moving. My mother, then a teenager, survived American and British bombing of her Italian home town, Ancona, but she did get shrapnel wounds from it and when she died some 14 years ago, she still had the shrapnel in her feet and ankles. She and my dad (a GI after the war) used to joke that she got even by marrying an American! My mom lost her family before and during the war to natural causes. One strange thing - she had no recollection of the years 1943-1944. Her friends told her she was moving around the country a lot but she couldn't remember any of it. She suspected she was traumatized in some fashion and probably was... My mom recalled the German soldiers as very proper and very well uniformed all the time. She told me that when Italy changed sides, she joined others waving goodbye to the Germans leaving town: "Auf Weidersen (sp?) Fritz" and the Germans replied (as if they knew better) "Ja, Ja, Auf Weidersen." She said it was a shock when they came back very promptly and occupied the country. She was raised in a fascist environment, participated in all the Young Fascist activities and said she mainly did it to flirt with the boys. Her first fiancee was an Italian youth killed on the Andrea Doria (not the passenger ship, silly!) and of course if they'd married, I'd not be here now! Thanks to you all for posting this fascinating thread and my regards to your loved ones for giving so much. Ohmygosh, how could I leave this out... My Ukrainian mother in law was a forced laborer in Germany during the war. She lives with us today and, because she speaks no English, we get by in part on pidgin-German! Her immediate family lost all but 2 of 7 male members during the war. [ January 12, 2004, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: gunnergoz ]

This thread is a treasure! Very moving. My mother, then a teenager, survived American and British bombing of her Italian home town, Ancona, but she did get shrapnel wounds from it and when she died some 14 years ago, she still had the shrapnel in her feet and ankles. She and my dad (a GI after the war) used to joke that she got even by marrying an American! My mom lost her family before and during the war to natural causes. One strange thing - she had no recollection of the years 1943-1944. Her friends told her she was moving around the country a lot but she couldn't remember any of it. She suspected she was traumatized in some fashion and probably was... My mom recalled the German soldiers as very proper and very well uniformed all the time. She told me that when Italy changed sides, she joined others waving goodbye to the Germans leaving town: "Auf Weidersen (sp?) Fritz" and the Germans replied (as if they knew better) "Ja, Ja, Auf Weidersen." She said it was a shock when they came back very promptly and occupied the country. She was raised in a fascist environment, participated in all the Young Fascist activities and said she mainly did it to flirt with the boys. Her first fiancee was an Italian youth killed on the Andrea Doria (not the passenger ship, silly!) and of course if they'd married, I'd not be here now! Thanks to you all for posting this fascinating thread and my regards to your loved ones for giving so much. Ohmygosh, how could I leave this out... My Ukrainian mother in law was a forced laborer in Germany during the war. She lives with us today and, because she speaks no English, we get by in part on pidgin-German! Her immediate family lost all but 2 of 7 male members during the war. [ January 12, 2004, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: gunnergoz ]

This thread is a treasure! Very moving. My mother, then a teenager, survived American and British bombing of her Italian home town, Ancona, but she did get shrapnel wounds from it and when she died some 14 years ago, she still had the shrapnel in her feet and ankles. She and my dad (a GI after the war) used to joke that she got even by marrying an American! My mom lost her family before and during the war to natural causes. One strange thing - she had no recollection of the years 1943-1944. Her friends told her she was moving around the country a lot but she couldn't remember any of it. She suspected she was traumatized in some fashion and probably was... My mom recalled the German soldiers as very proper and very well uniformed all the time. She told me that when Italy changed sides, she joined others waving goodbye to the Germans leaving town: "Auf Weidersen (sp?) Fritz" and the Germans replied (as if they knew better) "Ja, Ja, Auf Weidersen." She said it was a shock when they came back very promptly and occupied the country. She was raised in a fascist environment, participated in all the Young Fascist activities and said she mainly did it to flirt with the boys. Her first fiancee was an Italian youth killed on the Andrea Doria (not the passenger ship, silly!) and of course if they'd married, I'd not be here now! Thanks to you all for posting this fascinating thread and my regards to your loved ones for giving so much. Ohmygosh, how could I leave this out... My Ukrainian mother in law was a forced laborer in Germany during the war. She lives with us today and, because she speaks no English, we get by in part on pidgin-German! Her immediate family lost all but 2 of 7 male members during the war. [ January 12, 2004, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: gunnergoz ]

So...how did you like your stint in the Iraqi army? (later) AAAAhhhnevermind. Teaches me to only read through half the postings...got beaten to the punch line. [ January 12, 2004, 06:54 PM: Message edited by: gunnergoz ]

IIRC the 37mm turret ring diameter was the same, but the British designed turret had a built-in radio sponson in the rear and of course no m.g. cupola. The radio sponson's external overhang probably makes it look larger, and it a "bulk" sense, it is. I suspect the weight was about equal, given the loss of the cupola was traded off with additional armor mass for the sponson.

Michael- I think your sig line needs an addition: Operations is keeping her interest up while you're groping and fumbling around.

Ops, you nearly fell of your high horse there mr (sir) Grog . //Salkin </font>

No, you got it right the first time...the M3 medium's bow guns (there were 2) were NOT flexible and were to be aimed by pointing the tank. Some sort of WW1 holdover trench-clearing fantasy, I guess. Atually, the M3 light had similar sponson guns. All these were found to be unworkable and in practice the ports were welded shut or excluded on late production vehicles. The flexible bow gun appeared on the M3 light (in addition to the 2 fixed sponson guns) and later on the M4 medium and of course the M5 light.

Well, BARman, welcome indeed; if you like talking military, you'll feel right at home around here. This is as about a "militarized" bunch of civilians (mostly) as you'll ever meet. Actually, its a pretty well balanced bunch who I find to be well-read, well-traveled and very curious about nearly everything. And some are just plain curious. Keeps me coming back, anyway.

They're making semi auto BAR's now and I'd love to buy one were it not for the $2500 price tag...ouch! But whatta plinker!

Grants sent to Russia were mainly the diesel version IIRC, M3A4's. Their preference was and remains, diesel. The UK received a lot of the multibank engine M4's (M4A2? IIRC). They found it horribly complex an engine but very reliable in operation. Imagine 5(?) Chrysler in-line 6 cylinder engines all circularly arranged around a common crankshaft. A marvel of engineering adaptability that arose out of the restricted availability of the radial and Ford V8 engines used on most US tanks. Most of this is off the top of my head, BTW, I may be a bit off on details (like I'm pretty sure they were Chrysler 6's and not 4's).

While the M3 chassis was indeed used for the early Priests, it's not like the old M3 tanks were stripped of their superstructure or anything like that...the plants making the M3 chassis simply made some on the production line into Priests. Many M3's wound up as prime movers for heavy artillery, as OP vehicles, Canal lights, and indeed most were used as tank retrievers. It was not until very late in the war that a pure M4 based tank retriever was produced...most of the US tank battalions in Europe had the old M3 versions throughout the war. They were also found in heavy equipment repair companies run by the Ordnance Corps, and some also were used by engineer outfits as prime movers and utility vehicles. This also happened to war-weary M10 TD's a lot. Oddly enough, you hardly ever see Shermans used that way...the M4A3 was too valuable to the Army in Europe and it and the other M4 versions were recycled until they were destroyed or wore out.

I think a search of the forum will find that others have posted a translation list in the past. It may also be in a text file on one of the fan sites.

Two greatly overlooked reasons for tank cookoffs: 1. Hydraulic fluid (typically for power traverse): the Sherman's hydraulics were notoriously likely to burn. Later fluid formulas may have had an improved resistance to flash and heat. 2. Ordinary grease, fuel and trash buildup in the turret, fighting compartment and engine bay. These things get FILTHY really quick. Once a fire starts on the gunk and crud underfoot, it is not likely to be easily put out. It's not just the fuel and ammo that goes up, boys and girls...and diesel powered tanks can get just as gunky as the rest.

Kinda makes you really want to see the next CM engine, doesn't it? I'm sure the guys will "fix it or somefink" in the upcoming version. Hopefully, we'll start seeing some threads...if not an entire forum...dedicated to ideas and suggestions formally put forward for the next engine.

True, they were in part Fireflies, but recall that a few measley Shermans put old Michael Wittmann to rest, along with the rest of his Tiger I crew. Truth is often stranger than fiction. And, for all our obsession with the statistics, formulas, tables and charts used to depict our little digital battles, in reality it often turns out that plain old luck plays a big role in the life - or death - of a soldier.

It's strange, but I only ever see posts like this coming from complete idiots.

The Bren w/tripod would still be a light m.g. for the simple reason that it was only magazine fed...what? 30 rounds or so? Not enough for sustained fire. It was an assault (offensive) weapon primarily and the Commonwealth forces depended upon the heavy old Vickers for defensive use. Each approach had its good and bad points and there were situations in which any of these (mg42 heavy/light vs Bren/Vickers) could shine or do very poorly...all depended upon the context, doctrine and training. **** Oh. Just re-read your post...Ya got me! Doh!

I'm greatly pleased to see the balanced, thoughtful replies to this thread. It's one of the oldest cliches, but the Myth Of Italian Cowardice keeps cropping up in these forums as new generations of "military buffs" begin their education, draw the wrong initial conclusions and go on to learn that history, like an onion, has layers one has to peel through...