Joachim

Nope, it is just the reverse. His AT teams hit. Lucky bastard. Gruß Joachim [ March 30, 2004, 03:58 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

After this rather lengthy discussion of mounted troops on halftracks, could we focus on the use of truck-mounted troops on huge damp maps? It would be nice if we could derive a feasible method involving neither tanks nor Finnish trucks(they arrive in turn 119 with 2% probability, I can't build my plan around them). Is it safe to use my trucks to drop my glorious troops directly onto Andreas's troops cowering in their trenches? Or is it necessary to keep them behind the last patch of cover before enemy positions? Gruß Joachim

Well the last time I checked, Italians, Rumanians and Germans spoke different languages . Your point about the SS though does suggest that special cases can be made, perhaps SS fanbois outnumber Commonwealth fanbois. </font>

Mike, during most of my games I note spotting rounds, as I usually target suspiciuous areas and readjust if the area is no threat or the flank protection with arty is unneccessary. Arty above 150mm (except the German 2 sIGs -spotter) usually have the 60 secs countdown. Arty below 105mm have a 30sec countdown. I never noticed a difference regarding spotter experience. If I am unable to determine the correct time of the barrage, I often end with wasted spotting rounds (BTW a nice idea for scattering Gebirgsjäger plts) using responsive arty with delay in the 2-3 minutes range, so there is lots of data. Gruß Joachim BTW: Computation of our current move will exceed 1 hour. Did not find appropriate time to start computation due to RL priorities. Have to check if overnight works...

They are force type based. Italians or Romanians have other ranks than Wehrmacht. But IIRC even SS has different ranks than Wehrmacht. [rant stations, rant stations, all hands man your rant stations!] I want to have huge officer and NCO losses for the Germans in the engine. If the guy with the pistol dies, I want a correct modelling that his 2i/c takes over - with appropriate change in name and rank. Same goes for TCs of tank plts. The TC is killed by a sniper but the command structure stays intact. Great. The commander is always the last man standing in his group, but the guy with the SMG in German squads usually dies first. Forces with pre-battle losses should reflect that the officers and NCOs are absent, too.... Which effect has a different rank at the beginning of the battle for the command structure? Less radius of command? Other leadership ratings? Will a NCO be better or worse than an officer? There is nothing you can't model with the current engine - except for the rank name. If you want the correct rank in a carefully reseeached scen - put it in the name like many scens already do. Changes in command caused by the loss of commanders during the battle should have a much higher priority than adjusting the initial rank. [rant mode off] Gruß Joachim

Im sorry, but have you ever played this game, or just modded it? From the top of my head (so dont trust me) Probe is + 25 %, Attack is + 50 % and Assualt is + 100%. </font>

IIRC you can save a QB after it is over. Then you can use it to start another QB. Just start a QB, load the save as the map for the QB and "import troops = yes". Saves from QBs only work for QBs. End-Saves from scens do not work. But you can turn a scen into a QB by just starting a QB and loading the map importing the troops with it. That are the mechanisms. Maybe you need to experiment a bit. Gruß Joachim

IIRC any unmanned fortifications qualitfy. So add TRPs to your list. Gruß Joachim

From what I read here, do we have Spotting round has fallen => strike will hit target as intended (what would surprise me, as I'd guess more to "observed spotting round has fallen =>...) or is it only No spotter round => no correct targetting (except on TRPs) If at least the latter holds, we have an indicator to cancel the strike if it is due in the first 29 seconds of a turn (as the spotting round fell 30 secs earlier). Gruß Joachim

Just uploaded a big scenario to The Proving Grounds. A fictional exploit of an Axis breakthru is met by Allied reinforcements. An initial Axis attack has to consolidate its positions before Allied reinforcements arrive. The Allied player has to hold his positions to turn the tide of battle once his reinforcements arrive. 70+ turns The huge map and regimental sized task forces will test your computers limits. My 1.6GHz 256 MB took 2 hours to process some turns (the small blue indicator might hang for a few minutes). Lots of units across open ground equals lots of CPU time to calculate LOS. The scrolling on the map was smooth, however. This is the price I had to pay to get a "very realistic looking" desert map where you are able to maneuver your forces. Comments welcome. Playtesters wanted. Comments from TB155 and intro below. Gruß Joachim ------------------------------------------------- Comment from Treeburst 155 upon receiving the scenario to playtest in PBEM: "Wow! Now THIS is a scenario. I loved the briefing, and the map is very realistic looking. It looks as though you did a lot of work with the elevations, rather than just generate some "gentle slopes". It must have taken you quite a while to do that on a huge map like this. I don't think I've ever seen more realistic looking terrain." ----Scenario text---------------------------- Dezember 1942 Fictitional Axis Exploit. An Axis attack is met by Allied reinforcements. Map: Huge (3.6km * 3.52km) Forces: Huge, regiment-sized The open map and the amount of forces might result in up to 2 hours to compute a move. (1.6 GHz, 256MB) File size might be an issue in PBEM. Best played as 2-player. Due to force structure, the AI can not handle the Axis forces. Read: Definitely not playable as Allies vs AI. Due to force structure, the AI will not be able to use some Allied forces. A bonus (+1 exp) for the Allied AI might correct this. Better use +2 exp or +1 exp and +25% forces. Read: Axis vs AI not recommended, but it might work. Situational overview: While the Allied forces prepared a major attack, Axis forces broke thru a weakly defended area further west and are now attacking a vital hill in the Allied rear. The hill is important for several reasons: The hill is the dominant terrain feature overlooking the surrounding terrain. The surrounding terrain restricts trucks to roads and thus the crossroads beneath the hill is a choke point for allied supply lines. The village at the base has the biggest water supply in the area. Taking it will ease Axis water supply and thus free trucks for other tasks. The main problem for the Axis player is to bring in his forces before Allied reinforcements show up and shift the force ratio. Flank security towards the east is a must. The Allied player needs to buy time with his initial forces and deny the Axis the high ground. Infantry probably can't hold the rather bald hill, but infantry holding the village will prevent German trucks towing guns onto the hill and gather valuable intelligence on the Axis deployment. [ March 22, 2004, 10:33 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

Pretty easy - if there are only a few VLs, then casualties are what matters. I fear the main problem is that those players that understand the game mechanics are either a league of their own - ie they only play themselves in a non-ladder environment where the "social element" in the mail or testing scenarios is more important than the result. Only a few good desginers cater to this group. This group values casualties over ground seized and thus VLs are less important. If you look at several of Cory Runyan's scen at the kessel, you will note that in several scenarios he uses bonus points or has only a few VLs to make casualties the top priority. The other group is what I call "mainstream": Small QBs with picked forces. Small QBs mean important VLs. Almost any loss is justified to take or hold a VL. And your theory is not important anymore. A current scen I am doing tries another approach. There are lots of VLs. The axis attacker needs to press his advance but still conserve his forces to meet the counterattack. Time and casualties count. For the Allied defender, ground, time and casualties are important as if his initial forces hold out long enough the Axis will not be able to deploy to meet the reinforcements. Plus the general setting stresses the importance of the ground. The axis attacker needs to buy time in the operational scale. The allied defender must prevent parts of his (off map) forces getting cut off. 15 big VLs are met by regimental sized KGs. 70+ turns on 3.6x3.52 km of desert sand. Time to compute turns: up to 2 hours. You asked for it, you get it... Gruß Joachim

CMBB v1.03: I had a Pak 3,7cm on a hill firing at a MG in scattered trees. Guess it was 4 levels higher at 300m distance. No crater, but a treeburst! Looked twice but it remained a treeburst. The only problem is you can't target trees.... 2-story buildings are a perfect target to get airbursts, especially if the gun has only LOS to the upper floor. Gruß Joachim

Theory: Trucks are safe 3km beyond the front line, for (armored) halftracks that distance is only 800m. Both are the shuttle service to start positions - which are usually way beyond CM maps. There is some thread somewhere search for "hotrodders" or sumfink. If you absolutely have to use halftracks, move fast and try to remain hidden. Try to dash from cover to cover. It may pay off to drop a plt of grunts immediately on the enemy. But it might as well cost you the full plt. It is a gamble. If you do it, try to disembark in cover (trees) or concealed from long range fire upon panicked troops For fire support - keyholing. In a current CMBB PBEM game, I have to advance across 800m of no mans land. Little LOS from my startup zones to the enemy positions. Several guns got pushed forward (at 22m/turn...). After careful scouting of approach lanes without LOS to possible enemy positions I now move trucks forward to speed up things (there are less than 100 turns left now, so I'm a bit in a hurry ). If they cross potential LOS of the enemy, they do it on roads and only for a few meters. HTs might risk a bit more, but I would not risk valuable freight. In the desert, trucks can advance behind the dust trail of several tanks. Make sure they stay in the open or brush. Stones slow them down. If it works for trucks, HTs will do, too. Remember that you need a hiding place at the end of their tour or dust clouds to cover their way back. Gruß Joachim [ March 12, 2004, 06:02 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

Well, obviously you aren't an idiot. If you were, you could you use the colours. Idiots like me can use them. Sorry if I hit a mine there or hurt anyone. Usually you only recognize the value of your abilities once they are lacking. Gruß Joachim

It is a convenient approximation and it might work. Anything more complex will probably be just as bad, so I can live with that. Don't think we need to discuss the morale effects. Those are pretty obvious. Gruß Joachim

CM isn't using ratings, but the actual real-world data like thickness, slope etc (as good as can be researched at least) and a full-blown 3D ballistics engine. That's quite a bit more than "just like" Steel Panthers. beady, unfortunately due to the complexity of the matter and the sheer amount of units included in CM, we've dropped the idea of including something like this in CM very early on. Even a most basic guideline of half a page per unit would have meant a game manual of 1000 pages or so... Plus there are WAY better guides out there already than anything we could come up with. Basically your best "Idot's Guide to CM" will be any "Guide to WW2 Vehicles and Weapons" book you can find in your local bookstore. Martin </font>

Better optics are only modelled regardin spotting abilities. Hit prob is not affected by optics. :mad: Both tanks can kill each other at long ranges as the PzIV turret is pretty weak. Playing "Tank warning" currently and I am desparately trying not to get killed at 1200m... If you face unfavorable odds, it is impossible. Local odds are in my favor so I have a kill ratio of 45:8 (including 4 gun damaged tanks)

It's a road in scattered trees. The fire is probably abstracted like inf squads - the graphic represents a small fire somewhere in the tile. Gruß Joachim

Steel Panthers had armor ratings just like CM. The bigger the armor, the better. The bigger the blast value (usually the most important factor is the barrel diameter) and the more MGs plus MG ammo, the better the effect vs infantry. If the tank has "C"anister ammo, it has devastating short range (<200m) effects vs infantry. A tank is good vs armor if it has good penetration ratings. These ratings are colored. Blue = great, dark green = good, light green = ok, yellow = weak, red = weakest. The armor uses the same color code. Click a vehicle. In the panel you can see several colored bars around the vehicle. If it has a turret, there are three bars to the front, three to the rear, one above and two below. front = frontal armor for turret, upper hull and lower hull. Rear... guess what... above=turret side, below = upper and lower hull. Gruß Joachim

I'd say the effect of more bullets should be a lower effect per bullet. Reason 1: If ten shooters target ten targets, it is likely that several shooters target a single man. If that men is hit, it does not matter how much of the others hit him. So I'd expect less killed by 3 squads shooting at one squad than by 3 squads shooting at 3 different squads. The easiest example is if you take a hit prob of 100%. Every shooter hits its target. Case one sees 5.5 kills on average. Case 2 sees 15.5 kills. A more convenient example is 3 shooters shooting on 3 targets or shooting at one target... each with a hit prob of 100%. Case 1 sees one target hit three times = 1 causalty. Case 3 sees an average of 2 kills. Decreasing the hit prob will decrease that effect, but it will always be there to some extent. Reason 2: Imagine a squad in a trench. It gets a little incoming. They shoot back - ie they are heads up. Now it gets an awful lot of incoming. They will cease firing and take cover, presenting no target. Which case sees more casualties? BTW: I assume that the shooters do not coordinate "I hit that one, you hit the next one etc." - this is a battle. So shots/hit probs are independently distributed. Gruß Joachim

??? I thought bunkers give kill points... I had a river crossing once where I reached 40% victory level before I even set a foot on the bridges. I just killed any bunker on the other side that opened up. Used 20mm so I don't expect lots of crew casualties. IIRC only wire, mines and road blocks etc. are buggy. Dead stuff that is dead in the end. Intact bunkers are intact. Example: Axis 1000 pts (kills+VL) + 100 pts (bonus) Allies 1000 pts + 100 pts from fortifications bug Draw. Ok. Axis 500 pts (kills+VL) + 500 pts (bonus) Allies 2500 pts (kills + VL) + 500 pts (from fortifications bug) 3:1, 75%:25% Major victory... but it should read Axis 500 pts (kills+VL) Allies 2500 pts (kills + VL) 83%:17% Total victory! Am I wrong here? But it does work for allied fortifications! ... just can't resist: Guess who wrote "Give the Germans a points bonus to correct the points for "dead" fortifications bug." on Chir river scenario thread and when... Gruß Joachim [ March 10, 2004, 12:06 PM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

Even with the HC ammo the guns are not very impressive. HC won't hit if more than 200m away from a gun. That's what I wanted the TRPs for - to ensure first round hits at 200m if the tanks get too close. Having 3 guns with an effective range of 200m vs T34 will not make them very potent. Not if you compare it with having 2 Pak40. If there was no 105mm spotter, I'd be much happier with setting the TRPs. IMHO the gullies should be TRPd for the mortars and the Pak/IG should have some, too. The 105mm FO should have none. An alternative might be too have the mortars cover 2 of 3 gullies and one TRP for the third. But this still leaves the ATGs. Bonus HQs might help to achieve the overall effect. What I want to achieve is an effect on gameplay: The Soviet player must consider a threat to his tanks, the German player has at least a chance to hurt them... if they enter certain small areas. Feeling helpless and unable to do something for several turns might result in disappointed players: A current PBEM at btn level leaves the Soviet player with probably little reserves, and little chance to react. He is not very happy with it... not with 96 turns left... but he will still fight it out! BTW: Applying some info re company advance, advancing across the open etc from the forum on btn level... from some obscure author from Chicago... with lots of time, it might work... if there is no nasty surprise. Made a samll QB with 4 big flags set on the same line. All units moved toward the center without spotting any Germans. Tanks assembled on roads (random map...). Was very pleased with the AI behavior - except that I'd prefer less bunching up of the infantry. 80% headed thru the lone patch of trees... Gruß Joachim [ March 10, 2004, 07:22 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

Trenches are the thing to have on open maps... foxholes are still 44% exposure in the open. No place to stay when lots ot T34 are around - especially when they bunch up. Just considering another idea to avoid AI bunching up: Exchanging 2 of the 3 different setup zones as reinforcements (AI scen only!)

Not gonna start another thread on this... Do a search for recent PzIV/Pz IV or Pz-IV threads. The basics are: a) A hull down tank is harder to hit The probability to hit the turret of a hull down tank increases, as there is less hull to hit. outweighs a) in the CM model and thus the overall probability to hit the turret of a hull down PzIV increases. If a gun can't penetrate the 80mm frontal hull, but the 50mm frontal turret, its chance to kill the PzIv is higher. Gruß Joachim

FTs are slow, fragile and have a short range. The trick ist to let the FT draw fire and thus relieve your other units. Of course you gotta make sure it survives as long as possible while your other units whack the enemy busy killing your FT. If the enemy has to decide: Do I kill the FT and get punished by those others or do I shoot at the others and risk the FT getting close, your FT is worth something. Remember "all is quiet on the western front"? The FT is the thing that makes the 3 Germans shudder. One targets the FT. A rifleman with the FT kills the shooter. The remaining two Germans retreat. Scorer point for the rifle, assist point to the FT. Gruß Joachim [ March 09, 2004, 09:58 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]