Joachim

It is not enough to see the target spot - you need to see the target area to see the spotting round. If you don't see it, you get a 2nd spotting round. If this is out of LOS you get exactly what you got. Gruß Joachim

*****Spoiler ahead**** A very nice scenario for the PzIV lang is Action at Manuchskaya. A perfect training scenario. Key for German success is the armor protecting the little available infantry. The outset allows for the Germans to attack from two sides, though the Soviet armor can hide from both angles. Moving the infantry ahead of the tanks, borg spotting eases identification. A few well placed FOs or MGs (spotters with binoculars) on the hills around the bridgehead will help, too. The terrain is suited to keyhole on suspected enemy infantry or gun positions and blast them. The terrain allows for long lines of sight. The Germans have freedom to maneuver, the Soviets are packed in a bridgehead. The PzIV in pairs or plts along the ridges can dominate the field. They will kill from 1200m+ with minimal hits from the Soviet tanks. IMHO the good positions for the German tanks are key. Play it, see what works, and try to use what you learned, though you won't find perfect conditions like that very often! Most of your tactics in further games should be to achieve such positions. Gruß Joachim

You can do it in the scenario editor. If you want to do it for a QB, you can import troops from a given scen: Create scenario Build map Give map to both players as pl 1 can check it in the editor. Player 1 is set as attacker and buys fortifications in the editor. He notes how many points he spent. Start QB. Import map instead of generating one. Confirm importing troops. Play QB Give setup of pl 1 to pl 2 so he can check the amount of points spent. Gruß Joachim

It is probably not an absolute value that can tell you something. But comparing a 9 men Soviet SMG squad with a GE PzGren Squad, you will notice how to use either and which type of combat you will seek. Little differences don't matter that much from my experience. Note that the firepower is for a regular squad of that type. Experience - and thus combat bonus HQs, too - change the value. You only see this when targetting and noticing that your vets have a higher fp than the chart says. Gruß Joachim

Yes, that is exactly the problem I (or rahter the AI) face. It places their withdrawn infantry in nice open places... But thanks, all my (obscure) questions have been answered: It is a common bug/feature, it is known by BFC, and cannot be helped when playing vs. the AI. Danke für deine Zeit, Joachim. </font>

As I have reached 1/43, I fear I have to design new rules - if only for myself. In lack of rules I just modified action at Manuchskaya for the first battle in 43... Currently working on an Excel Tool, but RL does not allow me as much time with it as I used to have when I took over - so things are slow... Oh... just had a good idea how to do the upgrade the data in the tool for each year. But have to focus on the rules instead of the tool... Gruß Joachim

As I can't find a question, I can't answer. But if you are a bit annoyed that you can redeploy cut-off troops in ops - yes, same over here. What is worse, the AI does it (ok it needs every advantage it can get). What is really bad is the AI just moves those forces backward till in the main setup zone and if you have chosen the fixed setup option it just drops them where they are, not positioning them. So if you play the AI and know where they will appear, you can try to have them in bad cover in the next battle. BTW - there are lots of other threads on ops and this problem. But we know we won't get another patch and the problem should have been noticed by BFC. Gruß Joachim

Hey, we all know that this is nearly impossible. No matter how you design it - if you actually succeed some would claim that it was just designed to give the demo plt an approach route covered by one MG only... What JC states is that all other equal "advance" and clever maneuvering of units is better than a plain move. He shows that by accomplishing something with advance that would not work with move. Nothing more, nothing less. On your idea that cover is overrated: Cover is a force multiplier. Would you rather be with 9 others in a woods or with 29 others in flat featureless open ground? Would you fight a Tiger with 3 T34s in hilly and wooded terrain? Would you do the same in a flat open rural area? Use Marders in the open or keyholing from cover? Cover does not work alone. But if you are able to effectively use it, it is one of the most important factors on the battlefield. Gruß Joachim

Glad to hear that it ain't just my problem. If the weather gets as bad as they say, I might find some time to make (and alpha-test) some changes. Better than driving to the Netherlands anyway. Gruß Joachim

Hunt etc. only work with spotted units. A hidden, dug-in ATG will usually spot first and decide when to fire (ie it uses hide and a covered arc), or unhides at the beginning of a turn. You won't stand a chance to deny it the first shot - except when you lead with infantry. Your goal is to deny it a 2nd or 3rd shot. By retaliating ASAP with anything you have. And this means during the turn. If the ATG can fire several shots at short distance, the tank is dead. You deny shots if you are able to pin the bugger. Once it is pinned, time is on your side. Patch 1.03 removed the "ATG behind crest" problem vs direct HE fire. So it should be possible to actually hit the gun with tank guns. But in good defilade, the gun is still hard to hit from a flat trajectory. So you need more firepower or mortars. If you hit a suspected position with area fire, you must target for the exact position. This is what JasonC means when he speaks of "full IDs". Their position is known. If it is a gun, it will probably not move, so even a generic marker afterwards will mark the position, Or the foxhole is still visible. If the gun moves, it will be visible and need time to set up, so you won't encounter this. Blast the gun till you know it is dead or make sure it receives continuous pinning fire once pinned and then move in for the kill. You need less fire to keep something pinned, but forgetting the target after it pins is a mistake. You know it is dead when you see an according marker, one of your units is credited with it or the generic marker shows no terrain in the controlpanel. Close counts with HE - but hitting the general area only works with 150mm or up. Firing at a sound contact will need a Sturmtiger for reliable results. Area fire does not work when the target is overridden by something else. A classic is the "area fire at ATG position - gun unhides as it feels discovered - tank acquires target - gun pins - pinning hides it - target lost" sequence. Use small covered arcs to keep your area fire sticky. Then 2 tanks firing one turn could work. Or one tank firing while you advance on the gun. Gruß Joachim

a) 75L24 types The short barrelled PzIV are HE chuckers. Use them as such. They support infantry vs local strongpoints. HEAT is just for self defence (though sometimes your only means of killing T34s). Their preferred method of killing T34s is numbers, surprise and hail fire. Plus lucky hits with the slow HEAT rounds. 75L43 up They are effectively marders who can stand up vs 45mm, ATRs and HMGs. As such, "Shoot and scoot", short exposure (I prefer "Hunt" timed to arrive around second 45,getting off 2-3 shoots and a quick reverse the next turn) plus keyholing. You can try and use better armored tanks (PzIII w/70mm frontal) as a shield. Often the TacAI will aim for the target with the higher hit probability. Hit prob is decided by distance and increases with the number of shots fired at a target. So if you show the PzIII before the PzIV and have it significantly closer to the enemy, your PzIV will not get any incoming (until a human player manually adjusts the target for the next turn). On the offense - use them from a distance. Close in only to mop up infantry. And always remember: Never go hull down (cf. CMAK thread)... Gruß Joachim

What? I had to read it and think about it properly? :eek: ..... Thanks Joachim. I made the mistake of trying to read it all when I probably didn't have enough time to do so and just 'skimmed' it. Just another sad victim of our 'attention span deficient' society </font>

The article focusses with the necessity of defense while on the attack. Defense after losing the strategical initiative is another topic. No article has to deal with all topics. You can learn from errors. Best if it ain't your errors. The article told me that a) Even when on attack - be prepared to defend so you don't waste your offensive resources. the top brass was over confident and ignored the necessity of sound defense tactics and was ill-prepared for defenses - Strategic goals were prioritized vs operational necessities. c) Tanks can not defend themselves - attach infantry to them d) Tanks should not wait for the infantry to kill the enemy tanks and then attack. The grunts need some help. Either the tanks or specialized TD. e) You need enough infantry frontline strength f) Have enough reserves ready. g) Dig in h) Don't give up strategic initiative if you don't have prepared positions. i) It is best to attack operationally but defend tactically. Yet it is not a Panzerfibel with a few easy lessons. The article presents facts. The reader has to read it carefully and think about it. In a discussion with "Patton-style" officers, it is a help for those who defend the more cautious approach. Gruß Joachim BTW: Great link!

I think it's because it's difficult to achieve a perfect hull-down position...</font>

In a CMBB QB vst the AI on a Stalingrad map, I found that firefights in factories at 10-40m lead to high ammo expenditure. A few turns and the ammo is gone - without killing the enemy. Suppressing the enemy and overrunning (advance/assault) him with other squads gets faster kills and saves ammo. Of course there is a certain risk with this tactic. Gruß Jaochim

In RL, SP ATGs worked with superior spotting, stealth and local odds. If they had superior optics and would hit at long ranges what they saw while the enemy could not see or hit them - great. Now in CM, you have borg spotting. Superior optics are poorly modelled - you spot better, but don't hit much better. Now with borg spotting, this is not that much of an advantage for better optics. While in RL rangefinders or the flat trajecotry of the 88 helped first shot hits, shoot and scoot does not work as well in CM. Hunt to reach firing positions in second 45, getting of 2-3 shots and then reverse in the next turn is usually better (not with that scenario). I do not like that scenario because the Axis has no chance to achieve stealth - it may be historic, but does not take into account the problems of the current CM engine. Using Hornissen in CM is only possible with keyholes, reverse slopes and room to maneuver. If you want to get the real feeling of Hornissen, create a huge map. Select terrain features comparable to the map in the scenario, but at least (!) three times as wide. A ridgeline and some foothills on the german side, allowing for frontal cover when doing flank shots and keyhole positions. Setup zones for the tanks and Hornissen are restricted to the center third of the map. Flags in the German center. The Hornissen now have enough time to spread out to the flanks to set up ambushes there and pick off single tanks from the sides. But they must maneuver to simulate that they don't know the exact point of attack for the Soviets. To reduce borg spotting for the Soviets remove Soviet infantry from the game and give the Germans several sharpshooters and MGs to button up the Soviets. Maybe add some rolling terrain on the Soviet side. Those tanks in a depression can't see the Hornissen and can't shoot back. Except for all this ranting, CM is a good game and the scen has a good idea. But I guess while designing it the shortcomings of CMBB where not known extensively. My experience with SP ATGS in CMBB is probably much better now than that of the designer when he did the scenario. I doubt I would have done it better then. Gruß Joachim [ February 04, 2004, 09:36 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

To be successful in tank battles, you need Über-Tanks or numbers (aka local odds). If the AI bunches up 25 76mm guns in a crowd, you won't stand a chance to get local odds in your favor when attacking that horde - not with borg spotting. Let them come to you in that dense terrain. Try to guess where the AI will move from flag to flag, ambush a small part (eg the head or the tail) from different angles to ensure flank shots, then move fast to the next ambush. The AI will hunt, thus even the T34 are slower than your StuGs. ATGs do only fire when several StuGs do, too. Use small keyholes. If possible, a small section of the AIs path should be covered by 3-4 of your guns and there should be only 2 tanks in it. Another way is to change the path of the hunt command. Try that StuGs need only turn a little when they spot something. Gruß Joachim [ February 04, 2004, 09:37 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

Yes. Play "If only". It depicts Stalingrad with a plt of Brummbär and a Sturmtiger. Just for effect, I fired one 38cm rocket and checked the result. Pretty good! 4 150mm guns will bring down a large heavy building before the inhabitants can leave. Just like 3 StuH42. Or a huge amount of 75mm guns. Or the Soviet alternatives - IS 2/3, SU122+, etc. Gruß Joachim

Just to make sure: You won't see them in the game. If it is an operation, you won't see them except for those connected to the map. They are only there if reinforcements are selected for that slot. You won't seem them where you actually edit the map - just like on map units, you can see them only in the preview mode Here is how to find them: If it is a scenario, you can cycle thru them with "+" and "-". If you have Axis reinforcement markers, press "+" to select your first unit, then press "-" several times. IIRC the markers are between the last unit and the flags. So first you cycle thru victory flags, then thru reinforcement markers, then thru fortifications. If it is allied, toggle sides in editor using "\" and do the same as for axis side. Another convenient way: They are selected via "area select" - just like units. Gruß Joachim [ February 04, 2004, 03:58 AM: Message edited by: Joachim ]

Reminds me of an old friend of mine. Doctor: "Did you ever have trouble with your head". Friend: "Trouble with my head? No, never!". Wife: "Bernie, tell him what happened in Russia". Friend: "Russia? What about Russia? Oh, I forgot!" Points to left temple. "In here". Points to right temple. "Out there". And I bet Bernie did not stop fighting cause of a shot going straight thru. Gruß Joachim

Can I ask the name of that scenario? </font>

I have an end file whose AAR states 1 plane shot down for each side. A priest and a 40mm bofors both claim 1 plane, no axis unit claims a kill. Gruß Joachim

IIRC htere was a thread once where they tested AC showing up depending on reinfocement turn (Which for QBs is always 0 = on board) and overal number of turns. In a 60 turn game the plane would show up later than in a 30 turn game. Gruß Joachim

TB, sorry for the late answer. Other duties on the long weekend... Well, I am currently playing the scen vs the AI and I found out that I have to make some changes. Guestimated time to compute last move was 2 hours (during the night). So turn rate vs AI is about 7 per week :mad: Seems moving to contact or hunting on wide open space takes time - and I guess the AI moved some forces, too. 7 turns per week is a high rate for me Battling Andreas, the 120 turn South of Kharkov scen is in turn 14 now - since December IIRC. So if you find another volunteer - I'd be glad to get it tested before summer. I hope to get some changes ready till next weekend, test it until turn 15 to check computational time and - if it works - will accept your offer. I guess blocking LOS will reduce processing time. Playing 3000pts in the open desert takes a long time, too (15 min), 3000 pts on a hilly map are quick. Or my PC has slowed down considerably from the 20minutes for turn 10 (most Axis forces on reverse slope, little firing). The battle won't play as Allies vs AI - the Axis uses towed guns. The current setup will have problems with Allied mech reinforcements, too. If it will be playable in two formats (Axis vs AI, 2 player), I will have to make some changes for the reinforcement structure (ie no Allied inf as mech reinforcement but as a 3rd foot infantry company on patrol somewhere... A thing I did not consider yet. This thread helps. Gruß Joachim

I like the buildup. I like huge maps. I like big forces. I can conserve ammo. I like clear missions. I was p***ed by the Frühlingswind map where you have no chance to really flank the Grants. Plus that you have to wait for the announced marders to kill the Grants. So except for some shoot&scoot on the GMCs nothing happened a few turns. Most scenarios had small maps or maneuver only for one side. So I dcided to create my own scen. For me. For fun. Vs the AI. Balance is not important. The goal is to have fun while maneuvring my forces to achieve the best result. Blind is not important as the vast space and 60+ turns allow for some flexibility on both sides. The briefing should tell you most of what you know about the enemy after seeing the setup anyway. General idea: Axis exploit of Breakthru in 12/42. Attack and Counterattack style. A plot around which I set the scen. Even if it is just for me. Big map (3.5*3.5). A prominent hill (level 18 at smooth terrain setting (1.25 per level)) with a magnificient view, a village/crossroads in front of it jst ahead of the center of the map. Small rises for turret down positions or for guns behind crests. Small gullies. Large wadis. Though generally flat, there is cover and several reverse slope positions. the wide space allows for maneuver and flank security is an issue. Though fictitious, I chose the allied forces as you would expect in a rear area. Infantry, some Grants, Stuarts, M3 GMCs and the arty park. Plus some FlaK on the hill (which is damn effective). Liitle FOs, as the arty is on board Axis forces: 2/3rds of a PzBtn (PzIIIj/l/n, PzIVg, Marders) and 2/3rds of an inf btn, half of it as reinforcements. Recce assets on board, but already advanced (larger setup area). They come from one corner, hidden from view. All GE reinforcements come from the same road - but on random turns, to prevent shelling. In another corner an Italian armor Co shows up, plus an inf plt - all reinforcements except for a single plt and an heavy FO that should immediately target the "FlaK?" landmark. Plus various odds and ends... IGs, a battery of 105mm howitzers on board, 88s, 50mmATGs. Toys for fun. The US has the same toys. It is more a fun scen to get to know the various wpns. Now to make sure the Axis attacks ASAP, I put a US mech patrol in their direction. If it drops its load in the right area, they will see the road from where the reinforcements come much earlier (the AI won't do that ) Stones, rocks brush and th ewirde spaces allow for some hiding. The initial setup will allow for the Germans to overrun the Allies with what they have, but with significant losses. The reinforcements must be shuttled towards the likely line of departure (covered by a small hill) by truck or on tanks or they will come late. Choose from getting your tanks which you need in the 2nd half getting whacked between houses or wait for the infantry and the CS tanks. Maybe the village has to change into a town to enforce infantry attacking it. The infantry itself will have little use in defending the hill vs the US reinforcements. If the Italians do not move out immediately, they will be late for the party. Infantry won't be that crucial in the endgame. The Axis has to clear the village and hill to deploy their guns and have covered lines of communications once the Allied reserves come into play. 2km from the party, the dust cloud will be visible several turns as a threat once they arrive - putting pressure on the attacker. Once the reserves arrive, it is an even match (in points). So now I am playtesting... Just like Treeburst, I usually wait for my main force. But here I moved out immediately as I have the necessary forces. Not all, but the right stuff. Plus the recce is ahead - I know the enemy is a mile away. And the pressure. The defender has to shuffle his forces around, too. GMCs can severly cripple the advance if used properly. An FO can target the moving troops, though they should be covered by dustclouds. (The Ai doesn't). So it should even be playable as PBEM. Even the planes did not target the wrong guys. 3 appearances, 1 shot down (mine), 1 bomb dropped by my other one), 1 damaged (Allies). Open country and distant forces including vehicles help... There is only one drawback... It's likely the CMAK version of "To the Wolga". Processign turns takes an hour while moving lots of forces thru enemy LOS... Now that most are hidden or in position it is 20minutes. And another one: It is possible for the defender to head towards the US reinforcement points.... but random reinforcement turns and several reinforcemnt markers ensure the Axis gets a beaating there. Mission statement is to take the hill. Opinions about the use of reinforcements or other points we covered in this threat? Any idea on improvements? I want this to turn into a theoretical discussion on ideas how to avoid certain errors in design. How to improve things. Cause I think a good scen is based on a good plot. And a map fitting it. The rest is craftsmanship - which is stil important. Gruß Joachim