cptcurt Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 any idea the amout of senarios in the final release? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillLight Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 There are going to be two campaigns, one US and one german, that's confirmed. Figure each one having between 12-20 missions. Previous releases have had around 20-30 addition stand alone missions. Plus you have the community releases which soon follow, for this figure 3-10 times more than were made for CMSF just cause everyone is crazy for WW2. So all in all, my educated guess is 30 + 25 in campaigns for the official release, followed by about 100 more user made missions (standalone or campaign) in the first six months to a year. Oh, and then there's QBs... life is gonna ba good 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holman Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 For the first year at least, good user-made scenarios will come out faster than you can play them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveyJJ Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 For the first year at least, good user-made scenarios will come out faster than you can play them. You betcha! I've already got two maps and TOEs designed. I can finally combine my double major historical geography/fine art degree and love of tactical WW2 gaming to produce small scenarios/engagements for the community. Looking forward to it! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
British Tommy Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 For the first year at least, good user-made scenarios will come out faster than you can play them. I don't think so. I'm guessing the CM Normandy editor will be more complex than the CMx1 editor so this alone will slow down budding scenario makers. Plus keep in mind when they do start appearing, you will have to sort out the wheat from the chaff. This was done superbly by Gary when he set up the Proving ground (place to test your scenario's) and once the major bugs had been ironed out by play testers, the designer could move them over to the Scenario Depot (we are talking CMx1 scenario's) or BF's repository. Of course no scenario designer has to do this but I think it would be wise to give the scenario a good workout by play testers otherwise you could be sending out a turkey and players will avoid your next offerings. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt Belenko Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Are the Proving Grounds and Scenario Depot going to be open to CMx2 - WWII? I don't see any CMSF there at all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holman Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 I don't think so. I'm guessing the CM Normandy editor will be more complex than the CMx1 editor so this alone will slow down budding scenario makers. Plus keep in mind when they do start appearing, you will have to sort out the wheat from the chaff. This was done superbly by Gary when he set up the Proving ground (place to test your scenario's) and once the major bugs had been ironed out by play testers, the designer could move them over to the Scenario Depot (we are talking CMx1 scenario's) or BF's repository. Of course no scenario designer has to do this but I think it would be wise to give the scenario a good workout by play testers otherwise you could be sending out a turkey and players will avoid your next offerings. Nothing's perfect, and I'm sure we'll see a few dogs. But I'm guessing that nearly all of the experienced scenario-makers from CMSF will be jumping right into Normandy. They'll have to learn some new tricks, but they already have tons of experience with the engine. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finalcut Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Nothing's perfect, and I'm sure we'll see a few dogs. But I'm guessing that nearly all of the experienced scenario-makers from CMSF will be jumping right into Normandy. They'll have to learn some new tricks, but they already have tons of experience with the engine. Yes,but one Mans Dog,is another Mans Wolf. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
British Tommy Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Are the Proving Grounds and Scenario Depot going to be open to CMx2 - WWII? I don't see any CMSF there at all. Last I heard, Gary will be looking into including CM Normandy scenario's for both sites. I think it depends on the size of the files though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
British Tommy Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Nothing's perfect, and I'm sure we'll see a few dogs. But I'm guessing that nearly all of the experienced scenario-makers from CMSF will be jumping right into Normandy. They'll have to learn some new tricks, but they already have tons of experience with the engine. I agree, CMSF scenario designers should have advantage when it comes to working with the editor. But are those designers interested in designing WW2 scenario's? There is one scenario designer I hold in high esteem when it comes to putting together large (and huge!) historical scenario's and that is GEORGE MC. I know he's put together CMSF scenario's but I bet he's rubbing his hands together with glee working with CM Normandy. Hopefully there will be some of his work included when the game is released. For the small to medium sized historical scenario's you can't beat Mad Russian. I also hope he starts work on them once CM Normandy is released. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paper Tiger Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 The only REAL problem I forsee for folks new to the CMx2 scenario editor will be scripting the AI plans. Apart from that, it's quite easy to get a good looking map up and running in a single afternoon. And it's WW2, not Modern Era Syria where the two sides are perceived by many as being so mismatched. Lots of folks WANT to create WW2 missions so I think we'll very quickly see lots of new stuff appearing soon after the title is released. True, some of it might not be 'very good' but then, as long as the community is forgiving, (and this community appears to be very forgiving indeed of its scenario designers) folks will be encouraged to get better as time goes by. The potential killer to community creativity might be overly-negative feedback from players with unrealistic expectations discouraging new talent as it attempts to find its feet. Hopefully, there won't be many of these negative ninnies crushing the spirit of creativity here. We need to nurture the new talent. I know that many of the existing, experienced scenario designers, both on the Beta team and here, will be very eager to help the new guys out wherever possible, especially with regard to scripting the AI. So there's every reason to be confident that a lot of new content will appear. BTW, I should have a 16-mission campaign more or less ready to go shortly after the title is released. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillLight Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 He he, you can damn right be sure GEORGE MC is in it, we saw a map of his at gibsonm's preview, and it was B-E-A-U-T-I-F-U-L (as well as massive) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broadsword56 Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Will there be (or are there already) any "for dummies" guides or tutorials to AI scripting, for those of us who might want to venture into CMBN scenario-making? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gromit Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Agreed. A "word-to-the-wise" type primer from one of the (overworked) beta testers with map AI experience would be spot on. You know, basic dos and donts, along with other lessons learned from their perspective. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
British Tommy Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 The only REAL problem I forsee for folks new to the CMx2 scenario editor will be scripting the AI plans. Apart from that, it's quite easy to get a good looking map up and running in a single afternoon. And it's WW2, not Modern Era Syria where the two sides are perceived by many as being so mismatched. Lots of folks WANT to create WW2 missions so I think we'll very quickly see lots of new stuff appearing soon after the title is released. True, some of it might not be 'very good' but then, as long as the community is forgiving, (and this community appears to be very forgiving indeed of its scenario designers) folks will be encouraged to get better as time goes by. The potential killer to community creativity might be overly-negative feedback from players with unrealistic expectations discouraging new talent as it attempts to find its feet. Hopefully, there won't be many of these negative ninnies crushing the spirit of creativity here. We need to nurture the new talent. I know that many of the existing, experienced scenario designers, both on the Beta team and here, will be very eager to help the new guys out wherever possible, especially with regard to scripting the AI. So there's every reason to be confident that a lot of new content will appear. BTW, I should have a 16-mission campaign more or less ready to go shortly after the title is released. I must say I didn't see many overly negative comments over at the Proving Grounds when CMx1 scenario's were being uploaded daily. Sure, you always find someone who is not very diplomatic when posting feedback but good 'negative' feedback helps improves the scenario (if the designer decides to act on the comments). One excellent tip given to me many years ago by (I think) Mad Russian was, make a small scenario first and once you got that right and gained confidence, move onto something bigger. Never start off big! (except if your George Mc ) And good luck with your 16 mission campaign. How long did it take you to put together? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
British Tommy Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 He he, you can damn right be sure GEORGE MC is in it, we saw a map of his at gibsonm's preview, and it was B-E-A-U-T-I-F-U-L (as well as massive) Looking forward to looking that map over! And if it's not MASSIVE, it's not a George Mc map 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holman Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 I'll bet quite a few scenario designers have been around since CMBO. For them, this is going to be like coming home. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packito Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 How big are the maps/scenarios?, in miles / km Sorry for my english :confused: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJFHutch Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Shock Force allows 4km x 4km maps, granted at that size it takes a knife to your pc 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gryphonne Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Actually, is there some sort of in depth manual around (or is someone planning to make one) for sophisticated AI plans in CMx2? Such a knowledge base could be a real asset for future map making. And something that the community could expand over time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gpig Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 A good place to start would be to read through (and experiment with) the CMSF A.I. plans. Page 132 of the game manual is a good place to start readin'. http://www.battlefront.com/index.php?option=com_flippingbook&book_id=2&Itemid=223 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astano Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Here's some more on AI from the CM:SF forums: http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=82396 Actually, the entire CM:SF Scenario & Mod forum will probably be a great tool when the game first comes out, since the editor and features will be the same between the two titles. Obviously not everything will be relevant, but searching for "nuts-and-bolts" information should be productive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gryphonne Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Thanks guys will do some reading. I didn't really bother with making scenarios for CMSF, but CMBN will be an entirely different story 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paper Tiger Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 I must say I didn't see many overly negative comments over at the Proving Grounds when CMx1 scenario's were being uploaded daily. Sure, you always find someone who is not very diplomatic when posting feedback but good 'negative' feedback helps improves the scenario (if the designer decides to act on the comments)... Genuinely negative reviewers are hard to find, thank goodness. I think it is very important to provide a good dose of positive feedback to offset the negative and most folks here are very good at sweetening the pill. One excellent tip given to me many years ago by (I think) Mad Russian was, make a small scenario first and once you got that right and gained confidence, move onto something bigger. Never start off big! (except if your George Mc ) Very good advice it is too. I would strongly advise newbies from attempting to start with anything like LongLeftFlank's utterly astonishing work. A nice 400mx400m map with a couple of platoons on each side is a great way to start. With WW2, Germans v US, the new scenario designer is confronted by fewer balancing issues than he was with CMSF. And good luck with your 16 mission campaign. How long did it take you to put together? Still working on it. Eleven missions done, five to go so I reckon another 3-4 weeks before I get the last mission finalised. So far, I'd say it's taken me around 4 months of work to get where I am now. The maps were all done in a couple of months. But I haven't exactly been working flat out on it like I was for the NATO campaigns. BTW, GeorgeMc is my favourite scenario designer too. I rarely play other folks' missions, but I do play his, and MikeyD's. IMO, MikeyD doesn't get enough praise for his scenario work. He's crafted some challenging but FUN missions and I've always enjoyed playing his missions too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeatEtr Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 I attempted to make a joke scenario for CMSF, but never got around to finishing it. It was gonna be called something like "Battlefront HQ Uprising" which depicted the BF community assaulting the BF HQ demanding more info about CMBN, then referred to as CMN. It would of been complete with their bio pics in the intel image, yes even that little jar with Charles brain was gonna be in the image. But I'm lazy! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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