CMplayer Posted March 11, 2002 Share Posted March 11, 2002 Originally posted by Madmatt: the damage patterns (the jagged edges) on the collapsed walls are NOT modable although we may ourselves tweak it some more to make it a little less jaggy.Please do make it less jaggy...in particular the diagonal lines cutting through the dark space in windows looks funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puff the Magic Dragon Posted March 11, 2002 Share Posted March 11, 2002 Originally posted by Madmatt: Puff, as I stated already, the damage patterns (the jagged edges) on the collapsed walls are NOT modable although we may ourselves tweak it some more to make it a little less jaggy. Only the damage texture itself can be moded. MadmattMadmatt, that's what I meant :cool: ! Revising the textures - just repainting the edges with a bit pink color... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offtaskagain Posted March 11, 2002 Share Posted March 11, 2002 Originally posted by Madmatt: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by SS_Obergruppenführer: AAAARRRRRGGGGHHHHHH!!! Brilliant....Oh my God! Seriously, Madmatt just one question, will CMBB have an intro, something cooler than the one in CMBO?That's what we are planning for... Madmatt</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwazydog Posted March 11, 2002 Share Posted March 11, 2002 Puff, no, you cant do that unless you want slightly damaged buildings to have odd jagged lines through them. Guys, we know that this solution isnt perfect, but it looks pretty damn effective in game and the only alternative is not to have them unfortunately. As it is people with 32mb cards will may have their textures downsampled one level, so we *really* cant push the VRAM any further. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by KwazyDog: As it is people with 32mb cards will may have their textures downsampled one level*sigh* Time to start thinking about getting that GeForce 4... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by Michael emrys: Likewise. Oh well, my TNT2 was starting to show grey hairs anyway. Besides, CMBB is so totally worth it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffsmith Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by KwazyDog: As it is people with 32mb cards will may have their textures downsampled one level. DanOK Next Question.. Is this user selectable? I'd rather have a Graphically rich game run a little bit slower than a "Desampled" game run faster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ales Dvorak Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 But, Mad we have over 1000 scenarios to work it out. Please don't press on us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwazydog Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Hi Jeff, At this point no, its not an option. The problem is that it doesnt slow down the framerate just a little bit, it slows it down a lot. Charles told me that Steves framerates went up by over double when he added this code. On another system I tested here the speed was almost 3 times higher. The downsampling isnt too noticable though, so its a trade off that is certainally worth it Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sock Monkey Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Did Madmatt spell his name with craters or foxholes? Will foxholes (as, for instance, fall-back positions) be purchasable by defenders as a fortification like barbed wire and roadblocks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 BTS I see the missunderstanding. But I do NOT understand this : why uses a texture for a destroyed building more VRAM then for a undestroyed building? Wouldn't it be the same texture size of (for example) 256x256 pixel, but with the upper area repainted in 'pink'? [ March 12, 2002, 09:37 AM: Message edited by: Scipio ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwazydog Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Hiya Guys, Scipio, quick answer Each set of building textures will take up extra VRAM. For instance, using some rough numbers. 1 undamaged building (256x256) = 200kb 1 damaged texture for above buidling = another 200kb 1 heavy damaged texture = 200kb 1 destroyed texture = 200kb Thus, you are using about 800kb just for one 200kb building! Times that by about 25 buildings and you end up with a LOT of used VRAM Keep in mind that all of these textures have to be kept within VRAM during a battle, or you will end up with hard drive loading causing stuttering in game. Hope that helps explain it! Dan PS : Sock Monkey, they are craters...I think Matt will provide more info on this down the track though! [ March 12, 2002, 03:03 AM: Message edited by: KwazyDog ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culex Pipiens Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Very good work!!!!! a little question: are the floors always usable when there is a damaged building or you can use only some floors when the building is ruined???? bye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 KwazyDog I see the problem. I just wonder how serious this problem will be on a GTS2 with 64mb VRAM, 4xAGP and 512mb RAM. What I see as a standart configuration for a modern computer. [ March 12, 2002, 09:58 AM: Message edited by: Scipio ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by KwazyDog: Hiya Guys, Scipio, quick answer Each set of building textures will take up extra VRAM. For instance, using some rough numbers. 1 undamaged building (256x256) = 200kb 1 damaged texture for above buidling = another 200kb 1 heavy damaged texture = 200kb 1 destroyed texture = 200kb Thus, you are using about 800kb just for one 200kb building! Times that by about 25 buildings and you end up with a LOT of used VRAM Keep in mind that all of these textures have to be kept within VRAM during a battle, or you will end up with hard drive loading causing stuttering in game. Hope that helps explain it! Dan PS : Sock Monkey, they are craters...I think Matt will provide more info on this down the track though!I'm loath to say this but, this sounds like it has something to do with the way RAVE works. I don't know very much about Open GL but I suspect it may handle this situation somewhat differently. I think that maybe some folks here are wondering why.... "VRAM. For instance, using some rough numbers. 1 undamaged building (256x256) = 200kb 1 damaged texture for above buidling = another 200kb 1 heavy damaged texture = 200kb 1 destroyed texture = 200kb Thus, you are using about 800kb just for one 200kb building! Times that by about 25 buildings and you end up with a LOT of used VRAM " ... each one of those 200kb textures is not just "called" from some NON-VRAM memory location and swapped out when it is needed so that a building doesn't have to carry 600kb of extra digital baggage around with it. This sort of makes sense in light of some of the suggestions about modifing the damage textures and and just adding some transparent pink colour along the edges where you want transparency. my guess is the answer is that has somethig to do with the way RAVE works. Is is possible to point the finger at the limitations of RAVE on this partial damage issue? interesting thread your comments? -tom w [ March 12, 2002, 11:26 AM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viceroy Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 KwazyDog, As it is people with 32mb cards will may have their textures downsampled one level Is that likely to happen in large/huge scenarios only? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Rocker Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 First, CM is for sure the best looking tactical wargame. Apart from that : it appears to me that the graphical engine is not so good as it could be. But we should have mercy - a four men company with only one programer must make downstrokes. And as long as CM has no serious competitor this won't be a problem. But how long will they stand alone when CM:BB will be so successfull as it can be expected? It is never a good idea to spare money at the wrong things. About the compatibility to old computers, seen from an biz point of view : I can't remember a single game that wasn't sold only because it's hardware requirements were to high. My personal opinion here is very 'Darwinian': tough luck, all pre-500Hz Athlon processors. Goodbye, less then 32MB graphic cards. Farewell pre-Geforce era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M Hofbauer Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by Scipio: KwazyDog I see the problem. I just wonder how serious this problem will be on a GTS2 with 64mb VRAM, 4xAGP and 512mb RAM. What I see as a standart configuration for a modern computer. standard configuration for the teen FPS twitch crowd, maybe. [ March 12, 2002, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: M Hofbauer ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattias Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by Phantom Rocker: But how long will they stand alone when CM:BB will be so successfull as it can be expected? It is never a good idea to spare money at the wrong things.If you look back to 1999 and 2000 you will find numerous posts saying the same thing with regards to CM:BO. So far I don't see that competition. CM is not a game you go in and beat just by spending more money, you have to have a special kind of dedication to carry through the project. Il2 Sturmovik is the closest I have seen as far in this respect. -- M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puff the Magic Dragon Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Mh - silly me. Now I understand . But if it's possible to 'paste' a hardcoded 'damage crown' on the undamaged building texture, maybe it's possible to use a painted 'damage crown'?. In other words - what we need is - the 'removed' area - the 'undamaged' area - the 'border' Why not use a bit of everything? The undamaged area is in the VRAM anyway, the 'removed' area can be hardcoded, and the 'border' can be an additional bmp that can be pasted 'between' the two other areas - I think this don't need to be a full rectangel. A form like an L or a broad line, sized only a quarter of the full rectangle, can be used. And maybe it doesn't need to be different for each building, it only must look damaged and burned enough to fit on each building texture. I guess this should limit the needed VRAM. [ March 12, 2002, 12:37 PM: Message edited by: Puff the Magic Dragon ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 I swear, nothing is ever good enough for some of the grogs on the board. I am suprised the CM design team don't wake up in the morning and punt and say screw it with all of the complaining going on. The design team should be commended for their hard work. The graphics are super. It IS a tactical war game, not some silly real time shooter game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by Keith: I swear, nothing is ever good enough for some of the grogs on the board. I am suprised the CM design team don't wake up in the morning and punt and say screw it with all of the complaining going on. The design team should be commended for their hard work. The graphics are super. It IS a tactical war game, not some silly real time shooter game.Oh give us a break please. They're grownups and don't need to be coddled. BTS knows what a damned good game they've made, and we wouldn't be hanging around here if we didn't agree. But if they float a screen shot, it's not just to hear us say 'Oh BTS let us stroke your balls', it's also to hear the negative comments so they can take that into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puff the Magic Dragon Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Keith Thanks god BTS is always open for constructive criticism :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmatt Posted March 12, 2002 Author Share Posted March 12, 2002 Puff, it doesnt and can't work that way, Your apporoach would require multi-layered texturing which the game code does not currently support. As to critism or comments based on screenshots, nah at this point we pretty much just ignore you all and do what ever we want anyway. Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted March 12, 2002 Share Posted March 12, 2002 Originally posted by Madmatt: As to critism or comments based on screenshots, nah at this point we pretty much just ignore you all and do what ever we want anyway. MadmattGood to hear it! "Bash on Regardless!!" -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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