Demo mission 2, god dam this game is frustrating

[Stormhouse]

I ordered the full game but its still in the mail. So I'm playing the demo mission 2 on

the allied side.

This game is so frustrating its hard to beleive. I tell my mortars to put smoke on some bunkers and nothing for 5 f*cking turns. While the enemy spots my tanks and is able to put smoke on them right away.

Also the flame throwers are useless you never have a chance to move them in close enought. Oh ya I hate games that tell you it has to be done in so many turns, that just drives me nuts.

Anyway I pissed of because I keep losing.

So I guess I should have played the demo a bit longer and not have bothered getting the game.

[RenoFlame 36]

Well, yes, it is difficult at first. In fact it's even difficult after you've been at it for a while.

Are you sure your morter teams can see the target? How far are they from a leader? Remember, if the leader can see the target and is in command range, morters can fire even though they don't have a line of sight.

Leaders also speed up reaction time, so your units will move and fire faster.

Tanks are a mixed blessing, especially Shermans. Since you know their vulnerability, hold them back until your infantry has scouted out the opposition. Use their sped to try to outflank enemy armor when possible. You know you're not going to win in a heads to head fight, so don't do it. Go around the sides and look for the flank shot. Shermans have to get in close because of their gun, but they have a fast turning turret and manuever well.

Don't be afraid to fall back with your infantry if you have to. Let them come to you if you can, and then let loose.

Cheers,

[Radar]

On board mortors need a LOS to the target area to fire. They can indirect fire via a HQ unit if the said HQ is in command range and it(the HQ) has a tracable LOS to the target.

Flame throwers are very useful(though tricky to employ in that scenario) to clean out enemy pockets (you can search out threads on this scenario too, for more ideas), ya can even embark then on your AFV's(warning: can be risky).

The full game is MUCH more satisfying. Send me a setup if ya want.

[Alex heritage]

hey mate dont stress i had trouble too the problem with ure spotters is either because they can't see the target or its a glitch. Oh and are we talkin on map or off map mortars here? i agree with ure point on flamers look at my thread about them simply called flamethrowers to get some hints as too how too use em

[Alex heritage]

oh yeah and don't get sorry about ordering the game believe me u WILL get better at it. it takes time but u will

[Gremlin]

I don't know if these will answer your specific questions, but you may find these tutorials useful, particularly when you start playing the full game: http://www.combat-missions.net/bootcamp/bootcamp.htm

[Brian Smith]

Keep at it mate!

It's that frustration and learning the limitations of the forces at your disposal that make CM so rewarding. VoT is a real eye-opener for beginners and you can learn heaps from it.

With regard to flamethrowers, I haven't been able to use one effectivly yet. What they are great at though is drawing fire. I tend to use mine by exposing them - just about any enemy unit with line of sight to a flamethrower will go crazy trying to kill it, so you get a good idea of what the bad guys have. Many times I have been trying to order my units to kill a real threat, but time and again they will switch targets to a bloddy flamethower!

Good luck and stick with it!

[Stormhouse]

I finally won the mission, minor victory but its a victory.

this time I had all my troops together and, I was finally able to put more fire on the enemy then he could on me. I was doing great until that panther showed up, then I lost all six tanks. But I was able to move in a bazooka about 20 meters from the tanks side and bang it was all over for the panther. Gee that front armor really is pretty strong on the panther. I even mananged to have 3 sherman one beside the other firing at the panther and nothing. They all got killed.

I didnt know that mortars had to be able to see the target. Now I do and I'm sure it will help a great deal.

thanks for the support.

[Agua]

Good job Storm!!!

That is a tough scenario, and ya learned something through playing it. That's one of the neat things about this game is you're continually learning something new. It is truly a masterpiece. Remember that when you get frustrated, just keep working through, asking questions on the forum and you'll work through to a solution and learn something new. It is a very tough scenario and gets you to begin thinking in terms of combined arms to solve it.

[ 05-06-2001: Message edited by: Agua ]

[Brian Smith]

Stormhouse

This forum is a brilliant place to find info on tactics etc - use the search function on this forum and the tips & techniques forum. Also, look at some other CM sites - there are some great sites with Boot Camp articles (someone with more time might be able to post the appropriate link - I can never remember whose site has it) and look for AARs (After Action Reports) - I used to print them out and read them avidly at home to learn and understand tactics. Now I only get beaten most of the time! And for a real blast, play VoT against a human in PBEM!

[Crockett]

Hey Stormhouse

Welcome !

The Demo is still installed in my hard drive and since I have played Valley of Trouble only against the AI ,I invite you to play it with me as a PBEM .Pick any side.

A PBEM is an experience you will never forget

It takes CM to a new level.

I am not looking to some newbie for an easy victory,I am myself a 6 months newbie in CM and lose many of my PBEM games.

If it is OK e-mail me.

Cheers

[BloodyBucket]

Posted by Stormhouse:

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>This game is so frustrating its hard to beleive <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well said. I have been playing for quite some time and I still feel that way on occasion. Congratulations on your victory, taking out that Panther with a bazooka is something to be proud of. Good show!

This is what makes it such a great game. You may get to the point where you can beat the computer every time (I have not) but as stated earlier there is the challenge of human opponents to keep it fresh. Hundreds of scenarios to download, hundreds of graphics mods, sound mods and this board to keep Combat Mission fresh.

If you want, you can even start designing scenarios and mods yourself to publish, or start a website dedicated to CM. I am too unskilled and passive to it, but just keeping up with what others are doing is a full time job.

Have fun with the full game. It is only just starting.

Oh, and welcome to the club!

[Stormhouse]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brian Smith:

Stormhouse

This forum is a brilliant place to find info on tactics etc - use the search function on this forum and the tips & techniques forum. Also, look at some other CM sites - there are some great sites with Boot Camp articles (someone with more time might be able to post the appropriate link - I can never remember whose site has it) and look for AARs (After Action Reports) - I used to print them out and read them avidly at home to learn and understand tactics. Now I only get beaten most of the time! And for a real blast, play VoT against a human in PBEM!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I take it PBEM is play by e-mail, I would like to try it, Does the demo support PBEM.

If so e-mail me at tomaszl@sympatico.ca

[russellmz]

remember one thing: go for a flank or rear shot. especially if you are allies...

never stand toe to toe with a heavy german tank from the front, even if u got eight shermans(unless you're willing to sacrifice a few to bait the enemy while the other guys gang bang him ).

[Brian Smith]

Stormhouse - check your email. I'll be in touch again in a few hours.

[Kobalos]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stormhouse:

I finally won the mission, minor victory but its a victory. . .this time I had all my troops together and, I was finally able to put more fire on the enemy then he could on me. I was doing great until that panther showed up, then I lost all six tanks...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Congratulations on your victory!

Here's a couple of comments on some of the things you've mentioned:

When using U.S. vs German armor, you should usually try to flank them (your speed is usually superior) and come in from the side rather than go head-to-head. Try to stay out of their LOS when moving into flanking position, if possible. If your armor hasn't been spotted, you may even want to use the MOVE command, rather than HUNT or FAST MOVE. The enemy will be less likely to hear your armor that way (this can be very effective when visual spotting is difficult, like at night or in fog). When you're moving into firing position, use HUNT so that you'll be more likely to get hull-down position.

Flamethrower units are difficult to use successfully, as you've pointed out. They tend to be best when defending. For example, you can have them hide in a foxhole in the woods. When enemy infantry approaches, it's BBQ time.

I've also had success with them on the attack, but only when they're supported with covering fire from their platoon, and only in trees/woods, and buildings. For example, they were very effective in a recent QB I played; they were part of an Engineer platoon that was sneaking through some woods to attack a German position in a village. They roasted several buildings when contact was made, and routed multiple German squads.

As others have mentioned, on-board mortars need LOS in order to target. The exception is if they have not been moved from their original placement, and they are in command with a commander that can see the target. (For example, the commander might be in some trees at the top of a ridgeline, and the mortar units might be on the reverse slope of the ridge, out of LOS. As long as the mortars are in command and the commander can see a target, the mortars can fire even though they can't see over the ridge. Keep this in mind when making your initial unit placements.

Give the game time; if you like tactical war games at all, you'll soon grow to love Combat Mission. I used to play Squad Leader (among other old Avalon Hill board games like Tactics II and Blitzkrieg), Behind Enenmy Lines (anyone remember that?), etc. -- I've been waiting for this game for years.

[Stormhouse]

I really like strategie games, any of you tried Sudden Strike. Not as realistic as this game but also allot of fun. I'm not a fan of Close Combat, I dont know that game just didn't grab me.

Oh ya I just got the full game in the mail today, I also called in sick because I really am sick. I was happily surprised when checking my mail that the game was in. Perfect day so far.

[Dunnee]

This game will probably end up taking over most minutes of spare time you have left. . congratulations, **** is tight.

[Greenman]

I just got the demo over the weekend, played for 10 minutes and ordered the game. Wow is all I can say. This spring, I spent some time and have discovered the wonderful world of small, community-oriented computer wargames. I'll never go back to THE INDUSTRY.

Anyway my question is this. How would ya'll rate the AI? I've played both scenarios with the Allies and had a good time, after getting the basics, even Valley of Trouble is not a big problem. I'm playing Chance Encounter with the Germans and am slaughtering the Allied AI.

[Dunnee]

The AI, well, you get used to the AI after a while. That does not,however, make the game any less fun...

[Gen-x87]

It is really tough at first because of a few things.

1. Probably used to games like StarCraft when you just rush.

2. Terrain is really tough unless you actuallly get down to level 1 to literally see what it is.

3. Most people think tanks are almost invulnerable to anything but tanks.

4. Most people always believed that American tanks were the best. As you found out the Panther which is just a German Medium tanks slaughtered your Shermans. Use thier speed to your advantage!

5. Arty is a realy biatch!

6. When you just get good enough to play the computer and get a little bored you will move onto playing Humans. Humans with experience. You will learn real fast then What not to do!

I have had the game since August but really didnt start playing it until the TCP\IP patch came out. Now for the las tmonth and a half I play the thing crazy style. I am learning something new everyday and well I actually had my first win last week hehe. And then another and another It is finally clicking for me on my strategy.

Point being that it is a tough game for somebody looking for something easy to play around with, and something easy to dominate in. That will not happen.

In the ladder I play in I think the #1 guy had a major loss to a relative newbie. His narrative was something along the lines of it should have been a total loss. Anybody can beat anybody on a given day in this game

Good luck and keep your chin up. If you get serious about this game you will be getting much more frustrated by it in the coming months.

Gen

[Volstag]

Stormhouse,

Don't give up man. This game is, by far, the best wargame I've ever played, and it's currently one of my favorite computer games as well.

IMO, canned scenarios just aren't as fun (for me) as the random Quick Battles (QB's) -- no offense to scenario makers!!

Again, this is just my opinion, but scenarios, for me, have more of a "puzzle" feeling to them -- especially if you play the same one multiple times. Even though there is a factor o' randomness on the part of the AI, you can learn to expect certain things based upon your previous experience w/ the scenario.

When you first get the game, fire up some small QB's (around 500 pts). You might (hopefully) find it a much more enjoyable experience.

Out,

Volstag

[Volstag]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Greenman:

Anyway my question is this. How would ya'll rate the AI? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The AI is good. It's not "masterful" by any stretch though.

The major problem with the AI is its single minded pursuit of the victory locations -- and the fact that it will rarely, if ever, withdraw and/or perform tactical retreats from an area. If you can setup a decent "kill zone" in/around a VL, you'll wax the AI.

It's for this reason, the AI seems (at least against me) to perform better during an "attack" mission (w/ me as the defender) -- then again, that could simply be a product of it having access to more units.

Even though I can crush the computer in Meeting Engagements 99% of the time, it's still really enjoyable to play against -- and every game, it usually does something to surprise/worry me -- and sometimes I learn tricks/strategies by watching it perform.

I would love, however, to see the AI improved in CM2.

Out,

Volstag

[Stormhouse]

How do you guys find TCP/IP players? This game is not on gamespy why? I hope there is a better way of find opponents then having to get there e-mail or ICQ number and setting a special day for the battle.

[Loke]

Just join the Tournament House CMBO club at

tournamenthouse.com/CM/

There you have a chat/play room where you can meet players and start a game right away.

It doesnt hurt that its the best CMBO club on the net either...