Low visibility on projectiles in the desert

[DrJonez]

Anyone else noticing how much harder it is to see ordnance flying around when you're playing on a desert map? It really strains my eyes sometimes, especially bullets since they're yellow. It's really hard to tell where I'm getting shot at from when I play desert maps.

Any possibility of having ordnance visibility improved in a patch, or maybe a mod?

[GreenAsJade]

I don't recall even actors in Hollywood movies being able to see the ordnance flying around, and in fact this is something I've wondered about.

How big did the lead have to be before people could see it? Could you really see the charge from a 50mmish tank gun?

If you couldn't see it in real life, make sure we keep it quiet, or BFC will take it away!!

[GoofyStance]

This may not be quite what you want, but I believe there are some high-visibility tracer mods at http://www.cmmods.com I'm not sure though if they'd work in CMAK - perhaps one of the hard-core modders can say.

[Big Jim]

Surely bullets would only show when tracer rounds were being used, as the projectiles are extremely small and fast. Again, would it depend upon muzzle velocity how visible tank shells were? I only see mine when they bounce off enemy armour!

[Juju]

Originally posted by GoofyStance:

This may not be quite what you want, but I believe there are some high-visibility tracer mods at http://www.cmmods.com I'm not sure though if they'd work in CMAK - perhaps one of the hard-core modders can say.

They work. furthermore, there's different colors to choose from.

[Ant]

Originally posted by Juju:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by GoofyStance:

This may not be quite what you want, but I believe there are some high-visibility tracer mods at http://www.cmmods.com I'm not sure though if they'd work in CMAK - perhaps one of the hard-core modders can say.

They work. furthermore, there's different colors to choose from. </font>

[DrJonez]

I'm talking about the visibility of ordnance from a game mechanics standpoint. I, as the player, am having a hard time seeing the bullets. I'm not talking about how visible a real bullet would be on a WW2 battlefield. A few of you seem to be somewhat confused, heh.

[DaveR]

Originally posted by DrJonez:

I'm talking about the visibility of ordnance from a game mechanics standpoint. I, as the player, am having a hard time seeing the bullets. I'm not talking about how visible a real bullet would be on a WW2 battlefield. A few of you seem to be somewhat confused, heh.

Ah but if it's realism you want, then all you should be able to see is your own tracers, or tracers being fired away from you to be exact.

When I was crewed on Chieftain tanks, even with the main 105 gun all you could see was the trace and not the round itself going down range.

[MikeyD]

I'm rather of the opinion that CMAK has purposefully downgraded a player's ability to see who's shooting at who (whom?). Enemy armor targeting lines no longer regularly appear. Infantry that's firing on you no longer pop immediately into view. I'm liable to lose half a squad before I'm able to tell what direction the fire's coming from!

We're playing with two conflicting intents here. First there's the player's natural desire for maximum control all the time, but that's at odds with the game's attempt to reproduce a realistically confusing fog-of-war. I sure would enjoy having more situational awareness regarding incoming fire but I suppose I know why they set it up like they did.

And yes, that dayglo tracer mod is a BIG help

[mrpwase]

GREEN TRACERS! CHEMICAL WARFARE! RUN FOR THE HILLS! etc. Can't wait to download that mod.

[stikkypixie]

A bit of a newbie question but, what exactly are tracers? I figure that they are special bullets or something?? Can anyone help me?

[Meach]

A tracer round contains highly visible material that burns, I think, and shows the path of the rounds thru the air. Usually one in four rounds is a tracer round to aid aiming.

What I cannot fathom is why on TV the tracer rounds look so deceptivley slow. I reckon it is an optical illusion but still cannot figure it.

[MikeyD]

Tracers: If you watch any old WWII documentary you'll see film of anti-aircraft fire with streaks of light arcing into the sky towards incoming planes. Tracers are, basically, bullets/shells with a small cavity hollowed out at the rear and packed with brightly burning incendiary. For mgs they're often every 5th or 6th bullet in an ammo belt. For the gunner they take the guesswork out of aiming, rather like spraying something with a fire hose. Traces colors vary widely from white to green to red.

[LordCalvert]

At the end of my military service we had unspent ammunition wich we had to spend (who knows why, it was the army). We loaded the machinegun with almost only tracers (lot of them left too). It was like spraying water with a hose. And, yes, I had the impression you could follow the rounds with your eyes, reaching the target and ricocheting away up or down or to the sides.

[stikkypixie]

Oh, i always thought the bright bullets on TV were caused by friction, thanks guys!!

[GoofyStance]

I read somewhere that tracer rounds may have a slightly different ballistic profile than regular rounds, so they could actually be misleading because the tracer rounds follow a slightly different trajectory than the regular rounds. I think this was especially true in WW1, when fighter planes on balloon-busting missions were loaded with a mix of regular rounds (for dogfights) and incediary rounds (which essentially are the same as tracer rounds - correct me if I'm wrong, folks).

[Hensworth]

The question of why they appear so slow on TV remains though.

You've got me wondering about that now.

Could it be something to do with speed of the projectile relative to framerate ? Something akin to the spokes of a wheel appearing to turn in the opposite direction ?

[Vergeltungswaffe]

Originally posted by GreenAsJade:

Could you really see the charge from a 50mmish tank gun?

Absolutely. The muzzle velocity is nowhere near fast enough to render the projectile untrackable by the eye, if (and this is important) the direction of travel is reasonably close to the path of vision (ie, you likely won't see much if you are perpendicular to the path of flight).

[stikkypixie]

Originally posted by Sgt_Kelly:

The question of why they appear so slow on TV remains though.

You've got me wondering about that now.

Could it be something to do with speed of the projectile relative to framerate ? Something akin to the spokes of a wheel appearing to turn in the opposite direction ?

Maybe it's like a stroboscope, like you said with a normal framerate, you might get that effect. Damn where are those physicists when you need them. :mad:

[Ant]

The question of why they appear so slow on TV remains though.

If something is travelling directly toward, or away, from you then it appears stationary. So it all depends on its velocity in relation to your viewing angle.

I remember an interview with an old Battle of Britain Hurricane pilot in which he describes being shot at by gunners on German bombers.

He said that the tracers would arc outwards very slowly, almost away from you; and you thought they'd missed you by miles. Then all of a sudden they'd alarmingly arc back in again toward you and speed up.

[GoofyStance]

Originally posted by Ant:

Then all of a sudden they'd alarmingly arc back in again toward you and speed up.

That effect appears to be modelled in CMAK - I've gotten down to Level 1 view right next to a tank as it's engaging in an long-range armor duel, and watched as MG rounds came in on a flat arc. The tracers appeared to speed up somewhere halfway between the two antagonists. Pretty neat, I thought.