Robert Olesen Posted February 25, 2003 Share Posted February 25, 2003 Originally posted by SuperSulo: There, I added a "NewRollIndicator" to my die program. Get it at the usual place. (No, I don't know that url by heart... ).Got it, thanks. That was fast! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Another question: I'd like to reduce the size of the battles. Partly because I find larger battles cumbersome, partly because my PC doesn't like managing too many units at the same time. My preference is in the 1000 point range. So, I grabbed one (or more) of Bilton's rules (can't remember which one) and copied the rule sheet. I appreciate that rule set, Biltong Reducing the size modifier (param 28) is easy enough, as is the game length (param 43). And the autoparam sheet is a great way to test the modifications But I'm a bit unsure as to whether I should change the values for the support units (e.g. reduce them by 20% or so) - that is params 29 through 35. My battle group will be of the same size, perhaps just a bit smaller. Should the amount of support units be aligned to the size of my battle group? I guess so. Perhaps I need to reduce my battle group even more to get this to work properly? What would be a good size? Another thing: Will this get me into problems later in the game, when axis forces are less plentiful - will I be severely outnumbered? And finally: Is there a side effect of this change that I have overlooked? Edit: Actually, it occurred to me that the battle multiplier is applied to the support forces only, so reducing the multiplier and the force values themselves amount to the same thing in the end. So, I can achieve more variation by reducing the support point values and using a wider spread in the battle multiplier. In fact, there's no reasn why the battle multiplier can't go below 1 for a very small die roll, except that you need to have enough points to buy something useful (I suppose that 50 points for air power is useless ) There obviously isn't a "correct" answer to my questions here, but I would be interested in hearing about how the support values have been calibrated (so that I know if I'm violating any assumptions or making something that is grossly historically inaccurate) and whether others have experimented with this. [ February 26, 2003, 05:48 AM: Message edited by: Robert Olesen ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 And another thing, while I'm at it In my repeated recalcs using the autoparam spreadsheet, testing the effect of my force size changes, I noticed a fairly large number of cases where a meeting engagement concides with allocation of large artillery, I don't have any hard statistics, but I do find it noticeable. I'm no history buff nor a military tactician, but it seems to me that a meeting engagement in general should not allow for very much artillery. These battles are supposed to happen accidentally, so any artillery allocation has to be a standing allocation to the unit. It can't have been assigned for the purpose of a specific battle, as no battle is planned. So, it would feel more right to me if artillery had a negative modifier for a meeting engagement. With the current rule set, a meeting engagement gives no artillery modifier. I could be wrong 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSulo Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Apache, I have no problem with downloading... What exactly is happening when you try? You can't "right click-save as", you must left click on the link. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biltong Posted February 26, 2003 Author Share Posted February 26, 2003 Originally posted by KingMikeH: ... Along the same lines as HerrFlicks/BigAlMoho's comments, I'm discussing playing the Allied opponents against my regular tcp/ip opponent (a rehash of our CC2 campaign, 52 battles long) using BCR and am wondering if Biltong/Apache/Super etc. have any thoughts on handicaps that might be necessary to make it playable. And sorry, but you KNEW someone was going to come out and try and make multiplayer your system designed to bring more "meat" to the single player experience, right? LOL _ I've thought about the same thing myself and it was discussed (briefly) in a previous thread... Off the top of my head: Most modifiers would be ok. terrain/weather/Quality/fitness/casualties etc etc - all based on history. Take turns in determining the battle parameters & force size. Task force - this is a problem...create something similar for the Allieds and then take turns to roll up the category points? Use a formula to increase the attacker/assaulter/prober's points? Force size - get rid of the Battle type modifier? It will take some experimenting and thought, but it will be possible... Real problem of course is that you will never finish (even) 41 Cm3 will be out before you do 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biltong Posted February 26, 2003 Author Share Posted February 26, 2003 Originally posted by Robert Olesen: ...As you can see, there is a potential for improving the explanation of this [/qoute] Tried to post the changes I made to the rules and guide, but the bloody board keeps on complaining about paranthesis in HTML or something - gave up and mailed you Hope the changes clears it up. Biltong 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 OK, I will have to reduce the force size. My first battle involved a battalion of green Romanian infantry (plus some artillery and a bit of support), 40+ green Romanian tanks (probably roughly equivalent to another battalion) and my own force. This was a 2000 point assault on a small town map with massive damage. It took seconds to get a response to any mouse or keyboard input. Processing a turn (or the setup) took minutes. That won't do. I later noticed that there is a warning regarding the damage setting and "small" PC's - but it shouldn't be that bad. Is it? I'm using a P3/550 with a 32Mb TNT2 graphics card and 256M RAM. I'm attempting a reduction of the force multipliers, so that they start at 0.5 and end at 2. I may have to introduce a map damage modifier as well. I also changed the roll for the number of turns to get a much wider spread. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Supersulo - I get a full screen Donwload Counter.Com board that says "An error has occurred The title says it all - the following error occurred while you were trying to download - 'No Counter for this download exits' Please contact the site owner, chances are they have not set something up correctly or something is wrong blah blah blah?" Not sure what's causing it? [ February 26, 2003, 04:31 PM: Message edited by: Apache ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Originally posted by Biltong: Tried to post the changes I made to the rules and guide, but the bloody board keeps on complaining about paranthesis in HTML or something - gave up and mailed you Hope the changes clears it up. BiltongIt's in your inbox. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Here's another one of my "stupid" questions I finally managed to get a manageable first battle set up, only to discover that due to 20% casualties, my PzIV and PzIII doesn't show up (along with 4 out of 5 vehicles in a PzIIC platoon ) Do these unfortunate two tanks get the +1 experience bonus after the battle (note 16)? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 King MikeH - sorry for delay in response. I will be working on a Soviet set at some time in the near future but I need to complete BCRAV 42 and may do all the way to 45 first. Don't really have any thoughts on specific Sov modifiers yet, sorry. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Thought I might mention that while I find BCR great fun, this may have a lot do do with me ignoring pre start casualties (for both sides). Casualties for the Germans in the setup just make it too hard (in my experience) - the Allies effectively ignore casualties anyway, as if they get, say, 30% casualties, this is compensated by 30% plus points, so it really doesn't affect their OB. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 sandy, I'm pretty sure that you also get more points when you have casualties. So it should even out. But it _is_ a p.i.t.a. - as it must have been (probably more so) in the real syuff. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingMikeH Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Biltong & Apache, thanks for the replies! I think we're going play the standard game, where I as the Allieds won't have any continuity of units, and take a 20% reduction in strength to start with. We'll see how it plays out. Apache, the soviet set sounds exciting, good luck in getting to it before CM 4 comes out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterk Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Just noticed that this thread is attaining Peng-like proportions. I have a feeling we'll have our own sub-culture and cesspool pretty soon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Biltong/Others interested, I have nearly finished the first stab at converting BCR '42 (regular) to a Soviet version for those who prefer to play the Allied rather than Axis forces. I have not done '41 and personally at least will not (no time, inclination). I have a little more to do in terms of looking at units to use to make it interesting for players and would like an acquaintance of mine to look it over for accuracy. Once finalised I can send it to Biltong so he can have a look and then either mail it out to those that want to play it (to give feedback for adjustments) and then Biltong can see if SuperS will host it. It is perhaps a little unfair to send SuperS beta versions of this set too. If players are interested we can progress this through to a a final playable state (it is not far off now mind and players who want it can post here and I'll mail it out - just don't expect perfection yet) or we can bin it. Matter for you. Thoughts? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Lane - got your mail. You can mail me and I'll reply here. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Lane - got your mail. You can mail me and I'll reply here. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biltong Posted February 27, 2003 Author Share Posted February 27, 2003 Originally posted by Robert Olesen: Here's another one of my "stupid" questions I finally managed to get a manageable first battle set up, only to discover that due to 20% casualties, my PzIV and PzIII doesn't show up (along with 4 out of 5 vehicles in a PzIIC platoon ) Do these unfortunate two tanks get the +1 experience bonus after the battle (note 16)? Nope - broke down/got bogged/lost etc on the way to the battle - no experience in that - just a mouthfull from you, the CO 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biltong Posted February 27, 2003 Author Share Posted February 27, 2003 Just had a look at my inbox - getting outa hand New guys - if you have questions/suggestions on how to change/improve/add to the rules etc - please post it here... someone is bound to reply and if they don't - I will. It's far better to post than to mail me, since other guys might have the same question and would like to see the answer as well or if you have a suggestion it might have been discussed before (over 800 posts in 4 threads so far!) and one of the old hands might point out what was decided and why. As for the rules - no more additions/changes etc at the moment unless it's a really serious ommission... I've got over 100 maps to process: Check/give feedback/transform for other battle types/list etc - On average I can do +- 5 per night... so we're looking at a month+ before I'll be looking at anything else - some of the map guys have been waiting for 2 weeks. Please - I don't want you to stop asking/suggesting - all good suggestions will go on the list and eventually they all get processed - ask Apache 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biltong Posted February 27, 2003 Author Share Posted February 27, 2003 Originally posted by Apache: ...I have nearly finished the first stab at converting BCR '42 (regular) to a Soviet version for those who prefer to play the Allied rather than Axis forces.... Once finalised I can send it to Biltong ... Don't send it to me!! Dont send it to me!!! Yaaaagh!! I'm snowed under!! Help!! Offer it for testing on the board - There's been about 3 or 4 enquiries about a Soviet side - hopefully those guys are still around and will test it... Where do you get all the time Apache??! Send me some 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 27, 2003 Share Posted February 27, 2003 Originally posted by Biltong: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Robert Olesen: Here's another one of my "stupid" questions I finally managed to get a manageable first battle set up, only to discover that due to 20% casualties, my PzIV and PzIII doesn't show up (along with 4 out of 5 vehicles in a PzIIC platoon ) Do these unfortunate two tanks get the +1 experience bonus after the battle (note 16)? Nope - broke down/got bogged/lost etc on the way to the battle - no experience in that - just a mouthfull from you, the CO </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterk Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 You don't lose your vehicle or men for eternity. They just missed one battle, that's all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted February 28, 2003 Share Posted February 28, 2003 Originally posted by Peterk: You don't lose your vehicle or men for eternity. They just missed one battle, that's all. The way I understand it, it is as if the crew were killed. You get a new replacement crew for a vehicle of the same type (or the same vehicle perhaps). Thus, your accumulated experience is lost. I gather it works just as if an infantry unit failed to show up: They are presummed killed/missing and will be replaced with new people. The effect is less with infantry, as the experiene has to be evened out across the unit (you can't buy an infantry company with varying experience), but it is a problem for vehicles and other supporting units that you buy individually. I can accept the assumption that missing infantry is lost, but for vehicles it is more likely that it simply broke down and the crew is thus unable to participate in this battle. The same goes to some extent for guns. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biltong Posted February 28, 2003 Author Share Posted February 28, 2003 Robert has a good point (see above) - The Casualties parameter is a bit harsh... So here goes: 41 South Note 5 - Casualties Handle partial units such as men missing in a HQ, squad or team missing from the initial setup because of the Casualties (23) parameter like normal casualties of combat: MIA//frostbite/gonorrhea etc. etc. You replace them the next time you have a Normal Replacement (58). The result of that die roll determines the quality of the replacements. Whole units such as HQ's, squads, teams, vehicles, guns or armor missing from the initial setup because of the Casualties (23) might just have got lost or broken down. Roll a die for each 'missing' unit to see if it returns with all it's original experience or if it is MIA and the whole unit is replaced with the next Normal Raplacements (58). DIE June to Aug 1-7 Got lost - no signposts anywhere!! Returns and keep experience. 8-10 Rode over a mine - Pieces sent home. Unit is replaced. Sept to Oct 1-6 Stuck in mud/Broke down etc - Returns and keep experience. 7-10 MIA/captured/sent home with shell shock etc. etc. Unit is replaced. Nov & Dec 1-4 Delayed by thick snow. - Returns and keep experience. 5-10 Whole Unit disappears in a blizzard. Bodies found in 1963. Unit is replaced. Note: In either case units can only 'return' or be replaced during Normal Replacements (58) and not if an Allied or Axis Counter/Immediate Assault/Attack takes place. 42 South Note 5 - Casualties Handle partial units such as men missing in a HQ, squad or team missing from the initial setup because of the Casualties (23) parameter like normal casualties of combat: MIA//frostbite/gonorrhea etc. etc. You replace them the next time you have a Normal Replacement (58). The result of that die roll determines the quality of the replacements. Whole units such as HQ's, squads, teams, vehicles, guns or armor missing from the initial setup because of the Casualties (23) might just have got lost or broken down. Roll a die for each 'missing' unit to see if it returns with all it's original experience or if it is MIA and the whole unit is replaced with the next Normal Raplacements (58). DIE Jan to end 2nd week March 1-4 Returns and keep experience. 5-10 Unit is replaced. Start 3rd week March to end Aug 1-7 Returns and keep experience. 8-10 Unit is replaced. Sept end 3rd week Nov 1-6 Returns and keep experience. 7-10 Unit is replaced. Start 4th week Nov to end Dec 1-3 Returns and keep experience. 4-10 Unit is replaced. Note: In either case units can only return or be replaced during Normal Replacements (58) and not if an Allied or Axis Counter/Immediate Assault/Attack takes place. Hope you like this... [ February 28, 2003, 11:02 AM: Message edited by: Biltong ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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