Ok Should I get this game?

[ErikinWest]

Ok I love strategy games. I have found this one and after playing the demo it's everything i dreamed of!

But there are 3 games which one is the best?

Should I buy all three?

How does Multiplayer work?

Are there any good mods/modding tools for this game and if so can you tell me where to get them!

Cheers,

Erik

[tar]

Sure, get all three!

Well, it really depends both on your budget (but the games are actually relatively inexpensive as computer games go) and interest in the theaters of war covered.

That said, CMBB and CMAK are the ones that are closest to each other in terms of game play. There were major tweaks made to the game modeling, particularly the infantry and MG suppression modeling between CMBO (the first of the series) and the others. In that sense, CMBO is now kind of the odd-man out and generally felt to be a tad less realistic in the modeling than the others.

On the other hand, it is much less frustrating as well.

Multi-player (meaning actually 2-player) works quite well. Both exchanging files by EMail and the on-line TCP modes work quite well. Since it is turn-based, one does have the choice of which of the methods to try. Although I've only done a little bit of play against live opponents, it is a lot more nail-biting because they are a lot more resourceful and scarier than the AI.

There are tons of mods, but since I'm not into that, I'll let others comment. I play the game for the gameplay and not (primarily) for the graphics.

One other thing that is really good is that there is a large community that supports the game both by posting on this forum and also by producing truly tremendous amounts of additional scenarios.

[Wicky]

Greetings ErkinWest,

Firstly this is a tactial wargame, next, CMBO was the 1st game using the CM engine and with BB and AK they made gradual and improvements that have culminated with dust, covered arcs and many other handy features.

Basically do you want to drive your tanks in NE Europe, Across the huge Eastern front or soak the sun up in N Africa and into Italy (with some 3rd party battles converted to CMBO territory) - Buy all three or at a minimum BB & AK

Check out the extensive FAQ (stickied at the top) for an extensive insight into the workings of a remarkable series of games

Enjoy

Originally posted by ErikinWest:

Ok I love strategy games. I have found this one and after playing the demo it's everything i dreamed of!

But there are 3 games which one is the best?

Should I buy all three?

How does Multiplayer work?

Are there any good mods/modding tools for this game and if so can you tell me where to get them!

Cheers,

Erik

[ErikinWest]

But in terms of mods and players:

For mods do there tend to be larger communities for

CM:BB and AK compared to BO?

Is there a lot of on-line players? If so which game mostly?

Cheers,

Erik

[Cos]

There are a large number of online players. You can pick up a game here in the opponent forumor look into one of the many CM clubs to join and find foes.

Band of Brothers is the club I belong to (http://webandofbrothers.de/index.htm) and there are many more out there.

Again as others stated depending on your finances and tastes you'll want to pick up what suits your tastes. I would recommend getting CMBB and/or CMAK over CMBO if you are not going to get all 3 games.

[para]

Yes

[dieseltaylor]

Do NOT buy CMBO.

Aas it has considerably different orders and effectiveness of weapons you will only confuse yourself if you attempt to play all three.

There is more than enough gameplay in both CMAK and CMBB for a lifetime. If you wish to play Northern Europe there are lots of such scenarios available for CMAK done by the community.

[Yskonyn]

Like dieseltaylor said, you can get more than enough western front mods for CMAK.

I've been right in your shoes some months ago and decided to buy CMBB, CMAK and both strategy guides of which I never had a bad feeling including this day.

CMAK hasn't been fired on my pc yet (except from the demo while I was deciding what to buy) and it still safely tucked away in its sleeve, because I am so busy playing CMBB.... and modding it!

You can actually have data worth three or more games for CMBB alone once you get into modding the titles (see the forum for extensive info).

As for the online play, there are many active online players for either CMBB and CMAK (CMBO is slowly fading, so I've been told). You could join a club like Band of Brothers or join a tournament.

If you like the demo's then it's true what people say: you'll get blown away by the full versions. I was also! Go for it.

[Philippe]

With regards to mods, note that the modding community for all three games is pretty much the same group of people.

CMBO is already 99% modded, so you won't see many new CMBO mods coming out these days, largely because it isn't necessary. I still have a few CMBO-only horizon mods on the drawing boards that I probably won't finish until I play a scenario that would use them (at which point I'll go nuts until I finish the mod). CMBO is also 95% covered by a fully matured mod manager. (For the other two games you really need to use two mod managers, which is a nuisance).

Some of the CMBB mods can be retro-fitted to CMBO, and the same goes for a few of the CMAK mods.

Fully modded CMBO looks better than out-of-the-box CMBB and CMAK. Un-modded out-of-the-box CMBO looks like Playmobiles.

And just so we're on the same page, mods only affect the graphics, not the underlying game mechanics.

Some prefer the subject matter (Americans, British, Canadians, Poles, and French fighting their way from France to Germany), and many of the battles take place in familiar locations that you might have visited on your summer vacation (Paris and the south of France).

The game engine lacks a few of the enhancements of CMBB and CMAK, but the game has a really great feel to it. You'll spend a long time playing it before the things that were changed in CMBB and CMAK start to really bother you. And I don't find anything confusing about switching back and forth between CMBB and CMBO.

Another thing that CMBO has is tremendous scenario depth. Over 1700 scenarios have been written for it, more than you will ever want to play. So if you want an unfamiliar battle to play with a live opponent, just fire up the Scenario Depot search engine, feed in the parameters you want, and you're bound to turn up something that you haven't seen before that you'll like. CMAK and CMBB don't have as many scenarios written for them, and unfortunately a fair amount of the CMAK work seems to be conversions of CMBO scenarios into CMAK. It's a pity that that design effort isn't directed more towards researching battles in North Africa and Italy.

CMBO is a matured product and a classic. Most people have it, many of those that have it still play it from time to time. So though you won't see many new players looking for games (there are more than enough, though, if you search), there are plenty of older players who will be quite happy to give you a game for nostalgia reasons, and it will usually be quite a good learning experience.

So the short answer to your question is get all three and appreciate them for their differences.

[MikeyD]

Buy the game!

Don't bother to buy CMBO - CMBO is a real hoot to play (some say more fun than the later products) and the scenarios are great fun, but its really starting to show its age. I'd instead suggest buying CMAK and downloading the 3rd party 'CMBO redo' scenarios using the later game engine.

CMBB or CMAK?

CMBB's got King Tigers, BT fast tanks and Cz38T light tanks. CMAK's got Grants, Crusaders, Marmon Herringtons, and every Sherman type ever made. They've both got Stuarts, Churchills, PzIIIs and Stugs. One side speaks English in CMAK.

[ErikinWest]

I have a question about the game:

In the demo (which was awesome) I clicked on a squad and on a little bar to the right showed there was like 6 Nagant Rifles, PPD40 or PPSH1, and a DP22 machine gun. Does this show that there are actually 8 men in this squad and it's being represented by 3 men?

Cheers,

Erik

[MikeyD]

"Does this show that there are actually 8 men in this squad and it's being represented by 3 men?"

Yup, 3-man squads are an abstract representation. The size of a squad depends on the unit's TO&E. U.S. infantry squads often have a whopping twelve men to the German's nine, though the Germans often have those nasty MG 38s imbedded in the squad. As the squad gets whittled down you'll see the number of weapons dropping. You'll also see a squad number in the info bar go from 8 fit + 1 wounded to 5 fit + 4 wounded, etc. A German squad with just one mauser rifle and no ammo is of somewhat limited utility

[SKELLEN]

Originally posted by ErikinWest:

Ok I love strategy games. I have found this one and after playing the demo it's everything i dreamed of!

But there are 3 games which one is the best?

Should I buy all three?

Cheers,

Erik

All three games are good in their own way and really depends what floats your boat. Do you prefer Western/Eastern/Mediterranean front?

If you are unsure about CMBO then d/l the demo and see for yourself, you just might be persuaded to buy. It is an antique now for sure but then I suppose you could say CMBB is obsolete and CMAK obsolescent (that's progress), also there are many good battles to choose from for CMBO.

I have all three and must admit sometimes it is hard going back to CMBO after playing BB/AK, but it is the original after all and so we should accept it for what it is, and I continue to play it to this day and still enjoy it.

Of course if you are really patient you could always hold out for the release of the new engine, which is due early 06 perhaps.

[Yskonyn]

Well you see that the 'is CMBO fading/phased out' issue is still quite a hot one

Let's say, ... to make things easy.

[John D Salt]

Originally posted by ErikinWest:

Should I buy all three?

Yes. All of them. Right now.

All the best,

John.

[dieseltaylor]

I thing it is easy to have fond memories of playing CMBO and then graduating to CMBB and appreciating the difference.

However if you are brand new to the games then having to learn that in CMBO machine guns are virtually useless but in the later games that they are deadly will be a frustrating experience. Of course learning the effects of the different orders will also double the learning curve for newbies.

I really find it hard to understand that anyone can suggest learning two different game systems at the same time. It can probably be done but all the intricacies of actually fighting battles follows learning the basics. And fighting the battles has an immense learning curve to it.

That there are lots of pretty mods in CMBO is almost an irrelevance to learning the game. If Erik wishes to mod then CMAK being the newest surely has the most potential for modding anyway?

[Cannon-fodder]

As someone who started with CMBO and then moved to CMBB, I must say that I was REALLY SHOCKED at how dangerous infantry versus infantry combat suddenly became. In CMBO, you very seldom managed to actually destroy a hostile infantry unit, or at least it would take ages. I must admit I always had serious issues with this.

When you move to CMBB and AK, infantry die QUICK. you can't afford to let your infantry advance in stupid ways. Much, much better. As for armour combat, I wouldn't know too much about it since I'm not a grog.

I can tell you that, IMO, BB and AK are hugely superior to BO, if only because of the infantry improvements. THere are also loads of other advantages. And, you get to play as the Ruskies! yay!

[MikeyD]

Something else to consider:

For CMAK you may want to download a few mods to improve the 'you-are-there' aspect of th game. In CMBB you WILL want to download a LOT mods! Updating T34s is an absolute must since they appear in practically every scenario.

Don't let modding put you off. It's fun to collect FREE STUFF! Some people seem to do more modding than playing!

[MeatEtr]

Originally posted by MikeyD:

Some people seem to do more modding than playing!

Hehe, and MikeyD is probably one of them. But everybody loves him for it. His mods are easily some of the very best. His mods are what i like to call "AD's". That stands for automatic downloads, cause it's a no brainer to dl them. Do a search for "best mods" and you'll find the best and fav mods from the community.

Oh and btw, like most others stated, you definitely want CMAK and CMBB. There's just been too many tweaks to the CM series to bother with CMBO anymore. Besides, CMx2 will be out(hopefully) in a year-to year-in-half. So you'll have time to enjoy them.

[ErikinWest]

Ok so since I'll will be getting BB and AK can someone make a list of mods for the game? Also I have more questions

1. When you have a mod and someone else doesn't have it does it automatically transfer it to them via-email? If so is there a way to scan a file before opening?

2. When you get a mod it doesn't overwrite the files it just adds files to them right?

3. If I were say interested in doing some modding does the game come with a pre-build mod program or do I have to use something like 3dmax to mod it?

*When I mean 'modding' I mean 3d model editing. I assume the game comes with a map editor.

Cheers,

Erik

[Philippe]

1. The mods stay on your computer. If you compare screenshots you'll discover that no two people see exactly the same thing.

2. Mods overwrite files. You have two choices: a) lots of files organized by subject, mod author, and back-up; or a mod manager.

3. Modding is very easy and can be done in Paint, Photoshop, or Paintshop Pro. Almost all the graphics are stored in a folder as bitmaps, making them incredibly easy to inspect and manipulate.

Naming lists of essential mods seems to be a favorite topic of threads. If you poke around in the game-specific forums you'll come across them. Or start your own, if you like.

About ten minutes after I finished downloading the CMBB demo I started modding it. Certain historically inauthentic visual features can only be removed by mods, and that's probably one of the first things most peope fix. After that it's just a question of deciding which textures bother you enough to make you feel the need to do something about them.

The websites you'll need to visit are CMHQ (a semi-official site), CMMODS, and Mark Gallear's site (the inauthenticity fixes). Tom's CMHQ also has very good material and should be visited. Unfortunately one of the most useful sites closed a few months back: CM Outpost had illustrated catalogues of all the mods for CMBO and CMBB, and was a great record of what was out there. Almost everything gets posted to CMMODS these days: you'll need to register and log in every time you visit, but it's an essential address.

You don't need sources of scenarios at this point, but almost all of the finished, available scenarios can be found at The Scenario Depot. In addition there are several smaller design sites with collections of very high quality work, like Der Kessel and Boots and Tracks. These scenarios won't run in the demo, however -- you'll need the full game.

[ErikinWest]

OOOOH!

Is there a mod with motorcycles? I love motor cycles! Also is there a Japanese mod? Where you fight in the pacific?

Cheers,

Erik

[dieseltaylor]

No motorcycles this series of games but ... who knows. As for Asia I know someone is doing mods to fight out there. There will be a few people who want to play those. Someone else is doing the Spanish Civil War, and again some post 1945 Palestinian battles.

[teotwawki1]

Although I've yet to install/play them, there are indeed mods for CMAK to simulate WWII Pacific theater, Korean War, and Vietnam era battles.

[hnh3_cm]

Hmmm...

I wonder how Battlefront feels about people telling others not to buy their product.