Suggestions

[Jeff Heidman]

1. Make units with remaining action points a differnt shade so you cna pick them out easily.

2. Show the strike range of units when they are selected.

3. Subs should not get surprise attacked when moving.

4. Even if you disagree with #3, subs DEFINITELY should not get surprised attacked by transports when moving!

5. Let me allocate reinforcements from one single screen, for all my units.

6. Have the AI put an army in Paris instead of a corps.

7. Let one corps stack with one army and one air/rocket unit. Let all naval units stack.

Any more?

Jeff Heidman

[[Wiking]]

Units shouldn't get resupplied while surrounded. That's not realistic. Perhaps should be allowed to reinforce in city hexes to simulate conscription?

[[Wiking]]

Also: Carriers too cheap, U-Boats too expensive!

[Hubert Cater]

Thanks for the list guys, I'll look through and see what will be feasible before the final release.

Not sure what you guys mean by units being able to resupply when surrounded. As it is now, if a unit is completely cutoff from a supply source (remember HQ's, Cities and Fortifications all act as supply) then it will not be be able to reinforce. If a unit is completely surrounded on a city or a fortification then resupply will be limited and maxes out at a value = 5. It must be completely surrounded in the sense that it is surrounded by enemy units on all possible land hexes, if there is a friendly unit in the bunch then this limitation will not apply as it is not considered to be completely surrounded.

Hope that helps,

Hubert

[TimSmith]

1. One thing I would like to see changed is the number of turns. 27 per year seems a little low for this level of game. I think perhaps going to 52 (1 week turns) or 73 (each turn represents 5 days) would give a little more strategic depth. Perhaps an advance option for a extended game. Or have it be something that can be changed in the editor.

2. I agree that subs seemed a little weak and definately shouldn't be suprised by transports.

3. I didn't miss unit stacking given the unit sizes involved. That said I would like to see the ability to attack threw friendly units.

Hubert, all and all I think it is a great game, it's been awhile since I have had that "one last turn" type of game and SC is one of those.

[pzgndr]

OK, some random comments from Day 2. How about a help file on the menu? I just had an interesting experience with Yugoslav partisans moving into Munich. Partisans should be restricted to their country. How can you change units attached to HQs? This seems to happen by default since there's no selection available, but units aren't necessarily the closest to the HQ. I haven't figured it out. Highlighting a unit's HQ and sister units when a unit is selected would be helpful. Germans attacked Russia in April 41 and met stiff resistance. Too soon to tell for sure since I only had a couple turns, but Russian air and armor appear overrated. Russian fleet also seemed on par with German fleet, which is also unexpected. I'll have to see the design parameters and think about this more. The U-boat war needs work. There's no way the subs should be getting their butts kicked in 40-41. Maybe there's a game strategy to it, but it's not intuitive yet. Initial impression of Italian campaign in North Africa is that another hex row is definitely needed to get some maneuver room down there. I'm getting used to the game interface and flow of events. It does play fairly well and is enjoyable. Definitely makes you want to play the other scenarios and see what else will happen! :cool:

[SuperTed]

Originally posted by Jeff Heidman:

1. Make units with remaining action points a differnt shade so you cna pick them out easily...

Jeff,

The solution can be found in list of hot keys.

[Shep]

1) Strategic bombers should be able to choose to bomb the factory/resource/port in a hex instead of the ground/naval unit that occupies it.

2) Germans need a way to get north of Scapa Flow. Need extra hexes to the north.

3) No automatic adjacent detection for naval units.

4) Lend Lease.

[BloodyBucket]

The Strat bomb hits being absorbed by units is an issue that I would like to see resolved. The ideal solution would be to give the player a choice, if you made it so the Bombers only hit the cities than units could "hide out" in them, but that would be better than the way it is now.

The sub suprise issue could be fixed by making subs immune to all suprise. Better if other subs and carriers could still suprise subs. Best if surface units in range of usable air units could inflict suprise on subs, also.

I'm OK with limited supply for surrounded units in forts and cities. This makes sense, and historical examples like Leningrad come to mind.

Purchase screen should stay open as long as one does not actively close it. That says it all.

The move, wait, attack later option would be great, but I find that I don't miss the option of having several units combine for one attack, and I thought I would.

I have yet to figure out the way to do an amphib invasion. Is it corps only? Can you land in an enemy occupied hex? How about ports and cities? Seems to me that "opposed" landings into an enemy occupied hex should be possible (Omaha beach).

Not crazy about the stacking idea, the one unit per hex seems to work ok.

Altering the map for more terrain in the far North and South would be great, but IIRC it ain't gonna happen, so the only other solution (at least for the Northern area) would be some kind of transit or off map box.

I think the "Partisans" in Yugoslavia are actually Yugo army units, but I'm not sure.

Having a way to see what units are assigned to each HQ would be a plus, like in CM where double-clicking the HQ hilites all the subordinate units. Also, I seem to recall reading that units that stick with a HQ get a bonus of some sort, so a way to help remember who was commanded by who would be great.

I am OK with the turn length. Still wish that there was some visual indication of the season besides the text in the lower right screen. Even if the time of year had no effect on gameplay other than the turn length it would add flavor.

[SuperTed]

Originally posted by BloodyBucket:

I have yet to figure out the way to do an amphib invasion. Is it corps only? Can you land in an enemy occupied hex? How about ports and cities? Seems to me that "opposed" landings into an enemy occupied hex should be possible (Omaha beach).

BB,

Any ground unit can do an amphibious landing into any unoccupied land hex. Since ports are not land hexes, they would be excluded.

[Elmo]

I agree with Shep and BB. Strat bombers should be able to ignore units and bomb another target in a hex. It's fine if the unit adds to the AA value but you shouldn't have to kill them first.

[Hoyt Burrass]

I would personally like the option to use Military Symbols instead of Icons

[Wako]

I would like to second the option for having military symbology for the units. It makes it more immersive and less gamey to me.

I would also like to suggest allowing us to stack units. In 50sq miles you should be able to get at least 3 corps for example.

[Purple4Ever]

Originally posted by SuperTed:

BB,

Any ground unit can do an amphibious landing into any unoccupied land hex. Since ports are not land hexes, they would be excluded.

Hm - So Malta, which is occupied by an air unit, cannot be invaded by sea? If this is so, then it seems the only way to occupy Malta is to pound it with the Italian Navy (which I've tried and always lose 4-5 naval points in each attack vs. 0-2 enemy air points lost - not a good tradeoff!) until the air unit is dead. . . .then land an army/corps.

Are there paratroopers in the game?

[Lars]

1. The mini-map should have some useful info in it like shading to show possession and maybe unit locations.

2. North Africa needs to be extended southward (no room for maneuver), Norway/Finland northwards, and the Atlantic needs to be wider (no real mid-atlantic gap). Might as well throw in a Murmansk convoy route to boot (allow Allied MPP's to be diverted to Russia by convoy if Murmansk is held?).

3. How do you spend Italy's production points on new units/research?

Good fun, looking forward to the final version.

[SuperTed]

Originally posted by Wako:

I would like to second the option for having military symbology for the units. It makes it more immersive and less gamey to me.

I would also like to suggest allowing us to stack units. In 50sq miles you should be able to get at least 3 corps for example.

Wako,

The current symbols change as improvements are made through research. So, they do serve a purpose as such.

The game engine will not allow for stacking. It was a design decision to make it this way.

[SuperTed]

Originally posted by Purple4Ever:

Hm - So Malta, which is occupied by an air unit, cannot be invaded by sea? If this is so, then it seems the only way to occupy Malta is to pound it with the Italian Navy (which I've tried and always lose 4-5 naval points in each attack vs. 0-2 enemy air points lost - not a good tradeoff!) until the air unit is dead. . . .then land an army/corps.

Are there paratroopers in the game?

P4E,

Yup, the air unit must be destroyed first.

There are no paratroopers.

[rleete]

Hubert,

Gotta add my 2 cents worth here.

Subs are all but worthless for the Axis. Way too expensive for the 5-10 MPPs they can take out. Too easily taken out by Brit surface fleets. They sould at least be able to dive away from attacks more often.

The planes on Malta are far too hard to dislodge. Surrounded on all sides by the Italian fleet, pounded by 3 German and 2 Italian air fleets, The still manage to reinforce up to 8 each turn. How? do the Brits have transporters? There should be some penalty cost for getting reinforcements through such a blockade.

Strategic bombing of France by the Brits (AI) is far too effective. I have corps on all the cities, and air fleets defending each. But the Brits send over a bomber (escorted), and I lose 2 or more points on my fighters, 1-3 on the port, and he takes 1-2 hits on his fighters. The bombers get away untouched! Doing the same to Britain gets my fighters to 6 or 7, my bombers halved, and usually no result on the port (London).

That said, I really like the game, and do intend to buy it as soon as it's released.

Now, some questions:

Is there a way to disband a naval unit? The Brit and French fleets are expensive but mostly usless toys. I'd gladly sacrifice the entire French fleet for one more air fleet or a tank army.

How do you implement scorched earth? When the low countries fall, the Germans get a city and a port. Can these be reduced somehow? On the other side of the coin, how do you build up cities/ports? The ones in Norway never get above 5? Does industrial production help?

[Compassion]

Originally posted by R_Leete:

The Brit and French fleets are expensive but mostly usless toys. I'd gladly sacrifice the entire French fleet for one more air fleet or a tank army.

Until France falls and the way is left open to be-bop across the channel...

[SuperTed]

RL,

Originally posted by R_Leete:

How do you implement scorched earth? When the low countries fall, the Germans get a city and a port. Can these be reduced somehow?

Scorched earth only affects the cities in the Soviet Union.

On the other side of the coin, how do you build up cities/ports? The ones in Norway never get above 5? Does industrial production help?

Strategic targets rebuild automatically.

The maximum supply value of an occupied city that cannot trace an overland route to the occupiers' capitol is 5.

Industrial Technology reduces the cost of units.

[Hubert Cater]

Subs are all but worthless for the Axis. Way too expensive for the 5-10 MPPs they can take out. Too easily taken out by Brit surface fleets. They sould at least be able to dive away from attacks more often.

Nobody said the Battle of the Atlantic would be easy Answering this concern as well as many of the other posts in other threads, I think that some of the confusion here may be related to the naming system of the naval units. Keep in mind the scale and even though subs are given names such as 'U-29' or Cruisers are named 'Hood' etc. they more or less represent a wolfpack or a battle group. That being said, it could make more sense to call these units something else like 'Sharnhorst' Battle Group (as previously suggested ) but either way the costs do not really reflect the costs of purchasing a single sub etc., but more like a wolfpack as I've said.

Also, this is only a single year out of the war and the battle of the Atlantic was a long and hard fought battle. Beta testing the full campaigns has shown that the price system is about right and it does really reflect the fact that the Axis really did have some tough decisions to make regarding naval warfare as was historically. If I (playing as the Axis player) throw everything into the naval warfare then I certainly have to consider that this may cost me in terms of future land forces or just other warmaking areas in general. Could very well explain why the Germans did lose the Battle of the Atlantic as they had many things on the go

Besides I've generally found that subs can do more than just affect Allied convoys, they can tie up the UK navy, distract them or even pull them away from other hotspots, like the invasion of England , and they can even sink regular naval ships which is always nice.

OK all this being said, I have considered a few minor changes (nothing huge, mostly to do with FoW implementation) but all in all it's pretty much going to remain as is.

The planes on Malta are far too hard to dislodge. Surrounded on all sides by the Italian fleet, pounded by 3 German and 2 Italian air fleets, The still manage to reinforce up to 8 each turn. How? do the Brits have transporters? There should be some penalty cost for getting reinforcements through such a blockade.

Again Malta was a very tough nut to crack, and as someone just recently pointed out to me, there was a reason the Axis avoided it If it's something you've just got to have (I can certainly understand that ), a suggestion would be (in case you haven't already done so) to make sure there is an HQ in the immediate area of you attacking Air Fleets. Perhaps 1 German and 1 Italian HQ if you are using combined Air Fleets in your assault, they do improve the readiness of your units and may also provide combat morale bonuses if they have high experience levels. This will help but it is still something that will be tough to do!

Strategic bombing of France by the Brits (AI) is far too effective. I have corps on all the cities, and air fleets defending each. But the Brits send over a bomber (escorted), and I lose 2 or more points on my fighters, 1-3 on the port, and he takes 1-2 hits on his fighters. The bombers get away untouched! Doing the same to Britain gets my fighters to 6 or 7, my bombers halved, and usually no result on the port (London).

HQ's here are the key, you may have already used HQ's by keeping them close to your Air Fleets but they do help if you have not. The supply situation makes the difference since France is considered occupied the max supply from cities will be 8, while in the UK they are looking at 10. Check your supply on your defending Air Fleets and check their readiness all of which can be improved with HQ's. Also the AI will target the best unit/resource to attack that gives them the max return, which is why it usually goes for ports, some easy pickin's for them

That said, I really like the game, and do intend to buy it as soon as it's released.

Very glad to hear you are enjoying it

Is there a way to disband a naval unit? The Brit and French fleets are expensive but mostly usless toys. I'd gladly sacrifice the entire French fleet for one more air fleet or a tank army.

This was one area I decided to eliminate disbanding for, too easy to throw the whole balance of the game out since there would be a lot of return off of naval units.

Hope this all helps a bit,

Hubert

[rleete]

Thanks for the comments and clarification.

I have tried pairing a HQ with my defending fighters, and it makes quite a difference. Haven't tried it with bombers of my own, yet. Makes a good example of tha value of HQ units.

I understand about the disbanding naval units. Maybe when they were down to 1 or 2 strength, and you only get a small return? Sort of a "not worth repairing, just scrap them" type of thing.

I still think subs should either do more damage, or be cheaper. They only average 6 or so points per turn. When I intercepted the Canadian units transporting across, they took out 6 points from the transport. That's more points to repair the units right there, than the 6-8 MPP to interdict the convoy route. Of course, they were targeted by the entire Brit fleet after that, and went down without a single shot in return. Granted, it did tie up their fleet, but the AI does nothing with it otherwise.

Just one other point. It would be really nice to have some way to speed up the "repair" of captured and damaged cities/ports. Maybe only possible with a corps unit inside. Like the reinforcement screen, and the corps is unavailable for combat, as they are conscripted for the labor pool. I'm already assuming that those repair points would be relatively expensive, to prevent major reconstruction in a single turn.

[Yorick]

Someone posted something about buying Italian. I was lost on this for a little while until I noticed the Italian flag on the purchase menu. Click it and you can buy on the level 4 generals you want!

Yorick

[pzgndr]

HQ's here are the key

This is a GREAT feature combining C2 and logistics at the HQ level. I still don't fully understand how it works in the game yet, but I'm beginning to appreciate it. In a game last night, I paused for a week between taking the Low Countries and attacking France. I noticed a subtle improvement after moving air and HQs forward and regrouping my units. France fell in July. Would still like to see some way of changing HQ links. Is there a limit to how many units a HQ can support?

I skipped Yugoslavia and focused on Russia to see how that looks. Only had about 2 armies, a tank group and an air fleet for each army group when I declared war in February, which really isn't enough, but had better success against the Russians than my previous half-hearted attempt. I was also struggling to keep up with only about 300 MPPs per turn while the Russians were raking in over 400. Not sure what unit costs are for Russians and how things change with industrial research, so maybe all this works out in the long run. It just seemed like Russia was a bit stronger than they were historically. Hard to say at this point.

I'm still not impressed with the U-boat war. Hubert's comment about this only being the first year implies it gets better but isn't much help now. Subs should be darn near invisible and untouchable unless they choose to engage fleets or until Allied sonar research improves. I did manage to use my Italian subs to some effect, after finding the special convoy hexes in the Med. Suggestion - could all convoy hexes be highlighted? Clearly there are hexes that count and others that don't and we should know the difference.

A question about force pools. Are there any limits to how many units can be purchased? Obviously there's a MPP limit and the strategic situation to consider, but at some point in 1942 Germany should be strained by a limited force pool to defend a vast territory. Otherwise we may see a snowball effect if Germany is very successful in the early years and simply builds an enormous army to defend itself. Just wondering.

[Galatine]

Some good points above, some ok and some, well I'm not sure about.

My 2 cents worth:

1) HQ's for naval units. An Admiral's flagship?

2) Separate carriers from their fighter squads. I shouldn't lose my carriers last strength point because of an attack on a ground unit.

3)

a) Drastically reduce the range of fighters rising to the defence against bombing runs. Unless they have radar it should be a six hex area, not there maximum combat operational range.

Optionalise the use of fighters rising to the defence of bombing runs, as well as escorting. I shouldn't have to ground my bomber squadron just because my nearby fighter squad is weak and will get killed if it automatically escorts.

4) Increase the strength of strat bombing by a factor of 5 at the minimum. In a very similar board game I play, each bombing strike does 1-6 damage to an ecomomy while the bomber itself costs only 15 to build. That means on average the unit equaled it's cost in damage in 4-6 runs.

5) Allow units to enter ports. It acts as a barrier or artificial wall to limit access to a city by not allowing entrance to the hex. If I had a island with 6 ports is is possible for it to be taken?

6) Any fighter/bomber squadron station in OR next to a city hex should be allowed to reinforce AND still engage in offensive operations in the same.