niles Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I know there has been alot of hype about the Sturmtiger and so on, so I went out over the weekend and bought a book on German armor black projects, It mostly was about the Sturmpanther, the Monster Maus and the Sturmtiger. And I relize that not a single damned Maus saw service let alone finish testing, BUT I was just wondering how many here would like to see a Maus in CM:BO or CM:BB. Apparently the varient that went onto early testing had two barrels, a 15cm KwK 44 gun and a 7.5cm KwK, now honestly who here would rather have a double barreld, 33 ft long tank in their arsenal? I mean THIRTY THREE FEET! You could run over a sherman, but any way I just want to know would you rather have: Sturmtiger Sturmpanther Monster Maus All Three Give your feedback and thanks -Niles "Fieldmarshall" Hirschi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcm1947 Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Well, I personally won't use them in games (agaisnt the AI) God knows a person better not use them against another player but I might play with it just to see what it can do against various other vehicles, etc... I really don't care if the game has it or not but it seems silly to include it if it never saw battle, but hey maybe it was fun for BTS. I don't mind that if that's the reason why plus it will be interesting to look at and blow **** up with but again not in an actual game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Feh, if the Maus is put in the game then BTS better make it realistic i.e.: Drive 100 yards at 5 mph, destroy its engines and transmission and slowly sink into the ground, hopelessly immobilized. Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kestrl Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I hope BTS doesn't waste their time on adding the Maus because who wants a tank that travels at 13 km/h (8.07 mph) and is so heavy that it would bogged in any weather. I'm guessing it would never make it to the frontlines in a QB. I don't understand why anyone would want it or even purchase one because it would take several turns to move it around the battlefield. I would rather like to see BTS add the M16 Multi gun motor carriage with four 50. cal MGs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soddball Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 If my information is correct (from one of the twelve trillion threads on this)- - NO MAUS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Soddball: If my information is correct (from one of the twelve trillion threads on this)- - NO MAUS!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> hehehe...You are correct Sir! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarmo Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I'd love to have all three. Then I'd throw a couple of platoons of each one against some historic-accuracy-is-all-grognard. Too bad the IP play doesn't have videoconferencing so I wouldn't see his head blow up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I wonder what the ground pressure is on that thing... immobility like there's no tomorrow, but then again, with that armor and and armament who needs it? Still, if it did get in (which it won't) I'd take a spin just for kicks but not for a serious game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarmo Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I read from somewhere that Maus wouldn't have too great ground pressure. In fact it would have been low . This due to very wide&long tracks. Or maybe I'm remembering some other incoming supertank? Not sure. Wasn't there something even larger than maus at the drawing board? :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E Wendebourg Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Jarmo, I guess the afv you're thinking of is the P1500, and can be seen here: web page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I am all for all of those! Brin 'em on! Of course, this is CM though, so we need to make sure they are done accurately. So, could someone answer some questions for me? 1. What is the ground pressure of the Maus? 2. What is its speed across a variety of terrain? 3. How much armor did it have on each facing, at what angle, and what level of quality? 4. What is the penetration and HE payload of the guns it was going to carry? Did they ahve specialized ammo? 5. What was the typical ammo loadout for a Maus or SturmPanther? 6. How much ammunition did each MG carry? How many MG did they have? 7. What was the tested muzzle velocity of the 15cm KwK 44 gun, using non-test ammunition? BTW, please provide actual tested data, as it has been shown that "projected" numbers are never realized once production starts. Those dang engieers are always overly optimistic in the design phase! Thanks! Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake Eyes Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 The Maus represents Hitler's obsession with super heavies. This behemoth weighed in at 208 US tons and had max armour of 240mm. It mounted a 12.8cm/L55 gun. A co-axial 7.5cm/L36.5 gun was also to be included. Max speed was 20km/h (12.5 mph) which it attained during testing. Only two prototypes were completed and neither entered service. This is definitely a dream (or nightmare) machine for players. At the scale of CM the appearance of such a beast would be a real shock to the opposite side. Its use would be restricted to firm ground and roads. Don't even think about crossing a bridge. This beast seems to be very popular with many Forum members. The fact that it is totally beyond reason would be missed at the CM scale. The biggest problem it would have had is making an appearance anywhere the action is at the front. But once in action, where CM begins, it could be a challenge to use or face. Nonetheless, IMHO it would be about as interesting as using or opposing a slightly mobile bunker; easy to avoid and/or flank and difficult to get into position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 In terms of CM cost plus the new rarity factor, it just wouldn't be worth getting. Yeah, it would be fun to use the Maus or SturmTiger but it would ridiculously cost so much, and be impractical. Give me the Panthers Gs. They'll get the job done. Besides, we won't see the Maus in CM2. Hypothetical battles between SturmTigers and IS-3s sound fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Ok, I'll make you a trade... The Germans get the Maus if the Russians get Sturmoviks and not generic "Fighter Bombers" Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake Eyes Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Commissar: Hypothetical battles between SturmTigers and IS-3s sound fun.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Egads! :eek: You've got to be kidding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sascha Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Maus-specs (from achtungpanzer.com) <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Weight: 188000kg Crew: 6 men Engine: Daimler-Benz MB 509 / 12-cylinder / 1080hp (V1) Daimler-Benz MB 517 Diesel / 12-cylinder / 1200hp (V2) Fuel Capacity: 2650-2700 liters + 1500 liters in reserve tank Speed: 13-20km/h Range: Road: 160-190km Cross-Country: 62km Lenght: 10.09m Width: 3.67m Height: 3.63m Armament: 128mm KwK 44 L/55 & 75mm KwK 44 L/36.5 1 x 7.92mm MG34 Ammo: 128mm - 55-68 rounds 75mm - 200 rounds Armor (mm/angle): Turret Roof: 60/90 Gun Mantlet: 250/round Front Turret: 220-240/round Superstructure Roof: 50-100/9 Front Glacis Plate: 200/55 Hull Front: 200/35 Belly Plate Fore: 100/90 Side Turret: 200/30 Hull Side Upper: 180/0 Hull Side Lower: 100+80/0 Rear Turret: 200/15 Hull Rear Upper: 150/37 Hull Rear Lower: 150/30 Belly Plate Aft: 50/90 Penetration of Armor Plate at 30 degrees from Vertical. Ammunition: 100m 500m 1000m 1500m 2000m 3000m 4000m Panzergranate 40/43 223mm 212mm 200mm 189mm 178mm 156mm 140mm Pzgr.40/43 (APCR) - Armor Piercing Composite Rigid (Tungsten Core) <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 I was quite sure I read in that long JS-3 thread that MadMatt was hot for both the Maus and JS-3, simply because they were cool! I don't know if things have changed since that post. There were rumors (from Jentz or Zaloga?) that a Maus did see combat, perhaps trading shot defending the town near the testing ground. You PBEM players with your unit purchasing, you seem to take this so seriously! C'mon, let's have some fun testing the combat worthiness of one of Hitlers more outrageous creations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSpkr Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 There was an amusing post a couple of months back about a grog playing against a gamey freak. The grog made sure his infantry was lined up just so according to their historical use, then got annihilated when the gamey freak's combined MG-Jeep and 8" guns and rockets came flying down. Very amusing. I think if you want to be groggy and not use units like that, fine, but why should the rest of us be prohibited from experimenting a little bit just because you don't like it or because it wasn't used (though it was made in the era)? If you don't want to play someone who picks ahistorical combinations, then set out some ground rules ahead of time and the first time you suspect your opponent might spoil the immersiveness or whatever the heck it is you are whining about, delete the PBEM files from your computer, block his email address and find someone who 'won't spoil it' for you. Heck, if you want to be a perfect grog, then 90% of your troop purchases (as allies) should be green, and you should buy twice as much artillery (for Americans) as the current combined forces limitations allow. Your entire operating strategy should be to send out a platoon to make contact, then call down artillery for half an hour or so, then advance over the crunchy bits that are left. Wouldn't that be fun and 'accurate'? Grogs who whine about including period units that didn't quite make it into combat are like the people who complain in movie theaters because people talk during the opening commercials or get up to leave before all the credits are finished. You are looking for something to whine about and taking this all WAY too seriously. It's a game, people. Let people who don't want to be quite so anal have a little fun. [ 06-26-2001: Message edited by: MrSpkr ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freak Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Well said MrSpkr. Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellros Posted June 26, 2001 Share Posted June 26, 2001 Did the Soviets receive any Lend-Lease M16 AA ht's? If they did, then that would certainly be an excellent reason to include it in CM2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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