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CM:BO Invitational PBEM Tourney of "Stars" …. Part II


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Gentleman,

This Invitational Tourney of "Stars" thread has now moved here, Madmatt warning us that the original Invitational thread is becoming dangerously long in posts, which might result in a server crash.

To recap, the following people have are participating in a round robin tourney over several leisurely months, with the prizes below:

1) Fionn Kelly

2) Martin "Moon" Turewicz

3) Bill Hardenberger

4) SuperTed

5) Michael Dorosh

6) Ari Maenpaa

7) Fuerte

8) Berlichtingen

9) Jshandorf

10) MickOZ

11) Claymore

12)

13) CapitalistDogInChina

14) John Kettler

15) Jarmo

16) Robert Hall

17) Texas Toast

18) Sten

19) Ben Galanti

20) Mr. Spkr

The prizes ….

1) US$220.00 wine value for the winner, I'll pay for postage/freight; Wine description here…

2) The John Platter: A South African Wine Guide for the winner, 450+ page booklet.

3) A bottle of Islay Single Malt Scotch or US$100.00 for the winner. [sponsor: Claymore]

4) US$50.00 bonus prize to a non-winner. [sponsor: Treeburst155]

5) US$50.00 prize to the combatant voted as the "Best Sportsman" [sponsor: Mrs. Treeburst155]

Kind regards,

Charl Theron = idea hatcher

Tourney Manager = Treeburst155

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(copied from other thread)

No, Mr Spkr, the 100 pt. rule on deletions was never put in place. It was finally decided (and posted) that there would be no restriction on deletions but compromise between players who disagreed on the issue could be achieved by setting a point limit to deletions in negotiations. I suggested 100 points.

Now that I have set up many games it is becoming clear that many are purchasing battalions and deleting virtually all the support weapons of the battalion. At the same time it has become clear that many are NOT taking advantage of deletions at all or very little. It is my opinion that the second group is at a significant disadvantage

and should be warned of that fact.

I allowed the support units to be stripped from battalions from the gitgo because I figured everyone would probably do it. Now that purchasing patterns are beginning to appear it is clear that some just don't delete and others have no problem with it. Those who don't delete should seriously consider doing so or remember to negotiate the issue. This is a heads up for you guys. A lot of troops can be had for 1,500 points if battalions are purchased and the support weapons deleted. Something to think about, eh?

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GAME UPDATES

Well, this is rather strange posting an update here, but with your pleasure, or disdain, I will proceed.

Berli

Ahhh, his, I must say, masterful initial assualt with Shermans and mounted engineers laid a heavy blow to my 251/1 mounted panzergrenadiers. You see we are playing a map with heavy woods in the center divided by a single river which is only crossable with vehicles by a lonely bridge. The main flag is on the bridge with four minor flags forming a box around this bridge. Two on my side, two on Berli's.

His initial assault practically wiped out my grenadiers and thier HTs, but lucky I anticipated trouble and had a few reinforcements nearby. With them and the now vaulted UBER schreck unit his 5 tanks lay in waste and he now atempts an odd flanking manuver.

I suspect he has atleast one more trick up his sleeve since I doubt Berli is a one trick pony.

The depraived Aussie Mick

This battle is so far a game of cat and mouse. A large hill dominates the center of the map with two major flags atop it. So far Mick has attempted reconing the hill. Needless these forces were quickly routed with a precision arty strike.

Time is slowly ticking by with so far neither of us show thier hands. I have a feeling the lst few turns of this one will be quite bloody.

Manpie

He hides. He waits. He drops arty blindly. Either I am walking into a trap or I am winning. Who knows?

That is all...

Jeff

[ 07-18-2001: Message edited by: Shandorf ]

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Concerning Treeburst155's remarks,

Testify, brother!

Since I had played maybe two games total with pick your own troops prior to the tournament, the vast bulk of my gaming being PBEM QBs with computer chosen troops after parameters were set, it never crossed my mind to do what Fionn

did. He dumped what would slow him down and came at me with an SS Motorized battalion (sans transport) at ramming speed. I've NEVER seen so many Germans in my CM life, let alone moving that fast.

My failure to think the possibilities through

and do a much better job of choosing my force and screening my guys resulted in 4 platoons facing 9, except it was 5 on 1 at the initial point of contact. The result of that bolt out of the blue was the unhinging of an entire flank and the conversion of a systematic advance into a desperately improvised succession of hasty defenses. He has knocked me out of every VL I held before and macerated a complete veteran glider company.

Learn from my mistakes, I beg you. You have been warned!

Sincerely,

John Kettler

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Shandorf,

It's late, and I'm barely here, but as I recall he dumped his HMGs, probably 'schrecks

and mortars. I don't remember the TO&E for the unit, so it's hard to be specific. I think he

bought regulars. With 9 maneuver platoons and 4 company HQs it doesn't really matter. It's easy for him to keep troops in command, and as long as they are, they fight like Janissaries. He's got so much C3 he thinks nothing of leading an assault with a company HQ. That was a first, let me tell you. That little maneuver cost me a vital platoon HQ and a pair of 60mm mortars mit crews. How I wish this game let crews defend themselves instead of being butchered! Grr.

As noted elsewhere, I have very little experience at picking troops, hence can't tell

you anything solid other than that Treeburst155 personally bought and vetted our forces. Fionn's force was wholly legal, just stunningly unexpected as to size, composition, handling and speed. He wanted me to learn from my mistakes, and I have.

As the immortal Crusader said in "Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade" of the greedy unworthy who grabbed and drank from what he thought was the Grail and dissolved and imploded as a result, "he chose...unwisely."

As did I. As did I. Next time!

Regards,

John Kettler

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Bit of an update from various fronts:

JShandorf:

Jeff has described the terrain very well. A huge central lump with two VL's on a scrubby plateau. I sent a cook and Herr Oberst's valet to the top to take a looksee and draw some fire. They succeeded. Germans do that. As a result, I've got positive sightings on two AFV's and at least a couple of squads. The price: a couple of regretful letters to Stuttgart. The map precludes early heroics. The end will be full of smoke and gore. It's almost...depraved.

Fionn:

He has annihilated my fine German boys who must now sue for a bitter peace. Bah! It's too painful to describe. There is some snow.

Bil H: Ah, this battle goes much better as my excellent Amis stoutly defend a long ridge at night, crested by no less than eight VL's. My forces, aided by a number of AFV's, have repulsed numerous probing attacks by German infantry and armour.. with zook teams knocking out one SP Gun and two armoured cars. Arty on both sides has caused some local havoc. The pressure is on as the Axis forces manoeuvre for a last ditch push...

Texas Toast: In this one, I'm a Jerry but a Brit Wannabe. I miss those Wasps and quick Cromwells..so good to have at night. He's drawn early blood on my right as we circle around a central village.. knocking out a flakwagon and giving a scout or two a taste of cold steel. I reckon he's got plans to burn the place up.. either that or knock it down.. maybe both. I'm calling in a night air strike....

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Hill 197.

'Tis the beginning of the end for my gallant men. Enemy resistance to occupying this vital piece of dominant terrain turned out to be not only ferocious in intent but deadly in execution. G-2 really blew the call on this mission.

Withdrawals of certain elements have already begun, and every effort will be made to allow the broken remnants to escape. Sadly, my HMGs are going to wind up POWs or dead, since I can't abandon the guns and run away with just the crews. Pity, really.

The military situation continues to deteriorate, aided mightily by a veritable deluge of Fionn's 120mm mortar fire. My positions are now a toss-up between the surface of the Moon or NVA positions at Khe Sanh after massed B-52 strikes.

An important indicator of imminent unpleasantness came when Fionn pulled his platoon in the woods on my far right out of a firefight and deep into the woods. Thereafter the massive steel hail fell in earnest. Spectacular! Painful! Shattering!

Meanwhile, I did some shooting myself, chewing up some of his elements on the forward slope of the hill, but taking some serious lumps, too, in my platoon remnant. My .50s generally continue to fight on, keeping some SS heads down which otherwise would be doing more. Then there's desperate combat at spitting distance raging on my extreme left. The 81mm FO died heroically while keeping the defensive barrage going, so there is now what appears to be a platoon minus of SS blazing away at one of my HQs from grenade range. Whee!

Fionn wants me to surrender, but every point I save is precious, and every casualty I inflict

worthwhile in the larger context of the tournament. Odd, isn't it, how it takes a tournament to get us as commanders to withdraw when we're beaten, instead of fighting to autosurrender or annihilation? He thinks I can't offer organized resistance. He's wrong.

I fight on!

Regards,

John Kettler

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Fionn wants me to surrender, but every point I save is precious, and every casualty I inflict

worthwhile in the larger context of the tournament. Odd, isn't it, how it takes a tournament to get us as commanders to withdraw when we're beaten, instead of fighting to autosurrender or annihilation?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Read this over again, gentleman…. As stated before, it could be the difference between drinking wine or water! EVERY POINT COUNTS.

Thanks for the DAR (during action reports) so far, very entertaining and well written. John, could you persuade Fionn to do a DAR/AAR, even if it means that he has to send that via you (per e-mail) to this forum?

Kind regards,

Charl Theron

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Hey I'm back...I know you all missed me. ;)

I've relocated to New Mexico for a week or so , but have finally convinced my ISP to talk to me while on the road.

Game status:

Moon - on vacation - game paused - he's down at least 1.5 platoons.

MrSpkr - still waiting for the first turn. The setups are complete.

JShandork - finished the legal negotiations - waiting on Mike for the particulars

Ho hum

Cheers

Murray

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Wait a minute.... Claymore.. when did we negotiate? Did we? Hell.. I can't remember. I know I did some negotiations with SuperTed. What the hell did we decide?

Okay... Listen up! Murray! Claymore! and Superted! Here is what i can last remember about out statuses.

Claymore: I have no clue. E-mail me at jshandorf@mediaone.net and lets rehash what we settled on.

Superted: Negotiations are done.

1. Blind map

2. 100 point area limit on deletions.

Murray: We are still in negotiations. E-mail me also at jshandorf@mediaone.net

I am going to make up a form letter with my standard conditions.

Also...just to remind people, you might want to consider banning that Sdkz/7 AA truck. People have had problems with it in the past and I noticed one of my opponents bought one, so all future games will have that banned as a requirement.

Jeff

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jshandorf:

Wait a minute.... Claymore.. when did we negotiate? Did we? Hell.. I can't remember. I know I did some negotiations with SuperTed. What the hell did we decide?

Okay... Listen up! Murray! Claymore! and Superted! Here is what i can last remember about out statuses.

Claymore: I have no clue. E-mail me at jshandorf@mediaone.net and lets rehash what we settled on.

Superted: Negotiations are done.

1. Blind map

2. 100 point area limit on deletions.

Murray: We are still in negotiations. E-mail me also at jshandorf@mediaone.net

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Uh doh....Claymore = Murray. I agreed to your restrictions (blind map/100 pt deletion, me Axis) (ONLY RESTRICTIONS!). I sent an acknowledgement of our game to Mike and am awaiting the date before constructing the purchase list.

Cheers

Murray/Claymore

[ 07-19-2001: Message edited by: Claymore ]

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Hello, gentlemen. I've got 10 emails concerning this tournament that I am working on now. I've been gone for 36 hours. I'll post any final scores within a couple hours. Our stats man, Michael Dorosh, is out in the boonies somewhere playing soldier with the Canadian Army I believe. That being the case I'll post the standings here too sometime in the next couple hours. Carry on.

EDIT: Here's the latest: As reported above SuperTed got by Berli 53-29. Congratulations SuperTed!!

Fionn put a hurtin' on MickOZ 83-17, and took apart John Kettler too by a score of 80-20! Fionn is on a roll here! So far, out of the four games Fionn has completed, John Kettler has the best score against him with just 20 points! Congratulations Fionn!!

Yes, gentlemen, the Irish juggernaut must be stopped while there is still time. Who will do the honors? Here's the way it stands right now:

Fionn..........328...4...82.00

SuperTed.......154...3...51.33

M. Dorosh......150...4...37.50

Claymore.......99...1...99.00

Moon...........60...1...60.00

Berlichtingen..54...3...18.00

John Kettler...20...1...20.00

MickOZ.........17...1...17.00

Sorted by average:

Claymore.......99...1...99.00

Fionn.........328...4...82.00

Moon..........60...1...60.00

SuperTed......154...3...51.33

M. Dorosh.....150...4...37.50

John Kettler...20...1...20.00

Berlichtingen..54...3...18.00

MickOZ.........17...1...17.00

[ 07-20-2001: Message edited by: Treeburst155 ]

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Don't worry, Berli. So far you are a prime candidate for a shot at the bonus prize. ;) You also still have plenty of time to make a comeback.

Gentlemen, the standings above DO NOT reflect Berli's lastest smack down by Fionn. I'm sure there is a bug in Fionn's copy of CM that causes the score to be miscalculated. BTS, do somefink!!

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"Yes, it's over. Call it a day."

And what a brutal, bloody day it was! My plan to sacrifice a platoon HQ and two doomed-via crawl-speed Ma Deuces under its fully functional command in order to allow a bunch of broken and routed units to leave the board was thwarted by the callow AI which didn't understand American grit at 14% morale.

Worse, the chicken thing didn't let my stalwart 4.2" FO who was under direct fire by Fionn's battalion HQ drop his last two rounds on the largely wrecked remnant of Fionn's platoon in the woods on the crest. Even one round close to those guys would've finished the unit off as a combat entity. Sigh. I think if a shoot's in progress and an autosurrender

occurs the game should allow a final salvo, representing an FFE until otherwise commanded

fire order.

Company A, 3rd Battalion (Glider) is no more. The unit now consists of 15 survivors (60mm mortar crews) of an initial force of 258. Intercepted German radio reports indicate 39 U.S. POWs and casualties of 204, with 44 being KIA.

If there is any good news it is that the demolished glider company put up such a terific fight that the German SS motorized battalion seems to be overextended, worn out and badly cut up. Intercepts indicate the SS lost some 130 men (39 KIA) of a force estimated to be around 350 if mobility limiting elements are stripped from the basic battalion. Radio monitoring of our command net during the battle indicates the SS battalion

was stripped of many support elements in order to win the race to seize and secure Hill 197.

G-2 believes that a prompt counterattack, pushed home strongly and with adequate fire support and even light armor, will smash the already damaged SS unit and allow Allied seizure of the original objective. G-2 regrets its failure to anticipate the wily plan of the German commander.

That's all I have.

Regards,

John Kettler

PS

WineCape, I'll ask Fionn for an AAR.

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Murry A.K.A Claymore.... Roger that, but can we added the addendum there will be no Sdzk/7 purchases? I hate those buggy uber trucks.

BTW Superted and I just started our deployment. When I got Ted's email and the attachment he mentioned about not being shocked when I see the map. Wasn't quite sure what he meant until I opened the game to deploy my troops.

HOLY CRAP! THE MAP IS A FRICKIN POOL TABLE! And I am NOT kidding when I say pool table. It is as flat and perfectly free of any debris, such as bushes let alone a tree, as the head on Panzer Leader's favorite beer.

I am dead! I didn't buy some Uber armored outfit. My men are going to die horrific and quick deaths!

Oh, the horror!

Jeff

P.S. Treeburst, you suck.

[ 07-20-2001: Message edited by: jshandorf ]

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Here's an AAR from Fionn. Thanks, Fionn!

Hi all,

A friend told me I’d been asked for an AAR. Here goes…

The map DID feature an earthen ziggurat which completely dominated the map and was centrally located. The VLs were situated on all 4 corners of the hill with a fifth at the top of the hill. Such a dominating terrain feature which completely dominates the map can only mean one thing…. that it will dominate tactical planning and act as an irresistible lure for both commanders. I could have sought to fight John on the hill etc but I knew that is where his attention and forces would be focussed therefore I resolved to fight the indirect fight by, ostensibly, using the ziggurat merely as a location from which to conduct maskirovka operations aimed at keeping Mr Kettler’s attention while I disembowelled him elsewhere. Terrain doesn’t win battles, killing and psychologically breaking the enemy does.

If you attack the dominant terrain the enemy thinks this is your main operation. This means that your main thrust can continue in relative peace while the enemy is focussed on a mere demonstration.

So, I concentrated 2/3rds of my force on the right half of the map and 1/3rd on my left. I simply moved forward to contact and, by the 4th turn, had encountered John’s forward line. His reconnaissance line was virtually non-existent, especially on my right ( which, incidentally, was where my main force was advancing at the run) and where it existed comprised only 3 Crack Sharpshooters barely more than 40 metres n advance of his main body.

Isolated, weak, unsupported reconnaissance elements don’t last long and if they are too close to the main body they don’t provide any worthwhile advance warning. I annihilated his recon by turn 5 and had frontally begun to pin elements of his 4 platoons. On my right my main body detached two platoons to flank his flank platoon while two more platoons continued deeper into his territory seeking out his FOs and supporting HMGs. Some artillery fire hit a platoon at the top of the ziggurat hurting the platoon but also showing that attention was focussed to my left and centre. I think very little attention was paid to my right flank at all, despite the fact that just under 2 companies were advancing there.

The 6th turn featured the destruction of his rightmost ( from my POV) platoon and a Company HQ dash into his support line for that platoon. Soviet doctrine speaks of the desirability of engaging supporting lines with units which rush past the enemy MLR at the same time as the friendly main body tries to reduce the MLR. This attack which so seemed to surprise Mr Ketller was simply a variation on this theme. His platoon and supporting mortars ( roughly 60 men) was destroyed within 90 seconds of combat because:

I hit it with 3 platoons ( 1 frontal, 1 far flanking (firebase) and 1 close flanking)

I engaged his support line at the same time as his front line. This complicated his tactical problem and also robbed his front line of the support fires it so crucially needed at this stage.

Elsewhere I was continuing to make a demonstration against the enemy on my extreme left flank. I had brought 3 x 120mm FOs to the engagement and decided to use them en masse to crush the enemy on my left flank. I was moving too quickly anywhere else to make use of anything with more than a 40 second delay in any case. If I spotted it on turn 5 it was attacked on turn 6 and dead by turn 7.. My arty would only have begun firing on turn 7 so it was best to use it in a supporting sector where I wasn’t bothering to assault.

With the annihilation of Mr Kettler’s rightmost (from my POV) platoon I was free to push leftwards. This push isolated one of his platoons in the brush on the reverse slope of the ziggurat. It was facing the remnants of two of my platoons to its front, 2 of my right flank platoons to its rear and one of my platoons from my left on its left hand side. In essence it was virtually surrounded and outnumbered at least 4 to 1. I tackled the HMGs and HQs in the woods behind it and poured fire into its positions. Meanwhile I drove the platoon to its left out of the woods it held with one of my platoons ( I believe 3 men escaped from those woods) and close off ALL avenue of escape for the platoon cowering in the brush when, on turn 8 my forces linked up and completed the encirclement. By that stage it didn’t matter much though as I had reduced that platoon to just 3 panicked survivors.

That left only the 1 platoon on my extreme left… The 120mm FOs had done a great job destroying its infantry squads and routing them but Mr Kettler interpreted my movements on that flank incorrectly. He stated that I pulled the infantry platoon facing that platoon + 60mm mortars + multiple HMGs because I wanted to avoid my own arty hitting them. My intentions were nothing of the sort. I withdrew my infantry deep into the forest since my arty was now available to pin the Amis in place, thus leaving my infantry free to manoeuvre again.

I moved the infantry over covered terrain and within 80 seconds of disappearing from view I found myself around the Amis flank and would have been astride his rout of retreat in about 60 seconds if the game hadn’t auto-surrendered then.

On my right nothing much of importance happened anymore. I cleared out 2 HMG nests with the 2 platoons left on that flank and assaulted his FO position. Interestingly enough 2 out of his 3 FOs continued to concentrate exclusively on my formations on the ziggurat even when my infantry were under 30 metres away. An excellent example of focussing on entirely the wrong area IMO.

I read, with amusement, many of Mr Kettler’s comments during the game as his view didn’t correspond at all with what I knew was really happening. I didn’t disabuse him of his conceptions though since doing so would have ruined the “surprise” and/or allowed him more insight into my thinking than he achieved.

As to Mr Kettler’s continued ability to resist.. Well, he had 39 survivors on-map at the beginning of turn 9. 3 of his 60mm mortars had escaped BUT that was all. Of those 39 survivors only 2 HMGs and one platoon HQ were not panicked or routed. I had platoons on the flanks of all his positions, platoons to their front AND one platoon 60 seconds from completely cutting off his escape route forever. If Mr Kettler feels 2 MGs and a platoon HQ are going to stop 6 or so platoons then his definition of “effective” resistance and mine are very different. His global morale was about 14% and he had a sum total of 6 weapons capable of firing at me. I had a platoon for every weapon he could fire ;). Not exactly a good ratio for him. The 2 x 4.2 inch shells are absolutely irrelevant. They MIGHT have inflicted 1 or 2 more casualties but I doubt it (unspotted fire is notoriously inaccurate).

In short I think the auto-surrender at the beginning of turn 9 was entirely appropriate. Anyone who would seek to continue fighting when an entire reinforced company ( over 200 weapons) was reduced to just 6 merely ensures the total slaughter of their men IMO.

Conclusions:

Well, I simply used maneuvre, decisiveness and mass to achieve the positional advantage I wanted and could exploit using shock effect. As befits the fact that I maneuvred using the terrain better than Mr Kettler ( many times my forces appeared on his flanks “out of nowhere” without being spotted approaching) I achieved surprise at the decisive points and therefore won those fights at those points.

Overall though I think the game shows the importance of

flank protection… Mr Kettler’s rightmost platoon ( from my POV, leftmost from his) had NO flank protection worth a damn and it paid for this with almost instant death.

The recon screen was virtually nonexistent and too close to the main body in any case. Fail to recon, prepare to fail.

Focus on dominant terrain but NOT the dominant sector is a major error and one which is all too common.

Push your troops hard. Pushing them hard for 10 minutes saves lives in the long run.

The importance of terrain analysis… I did a better terrain analysis than Mr Kettler ( as shown by the fact that I realised that my right was almost ideal terrain for a covered approach aimed at allowing a sudden and decisive thrust to unhinge a flank.) and that won me the battle.

Well, I think that’s enough for now. I focussed on my right flank since, really, the left and centre were merely holding actions. I was simply pinning Mr Kettler’s forces there in order to allow the decision to be reached on my right. That I wiped out half his force ( 2 platoons) on the left flank is immaterial, to my way of thinking, since this battle was won through maneuvre and decisive action and not through how many casualties I inflicted in a particular spot.

P.s. I think Mr Kettler’s assessment of my Bn’s ability to fight again is EXTREMELY optimistic. Then again he was totally optimistic in our game until such time as I chose to hit him with my hidden force. His current optimism re: a counter-attack would be the exact same. It would last only as long as I wanted it to. The terrain we’re in is tailor-made for me to chew up an infantry Bn with counter-attacks, ambushes etc

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