CMplayer Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Well I set up a test. A regular German Sturmkompanie on a single tile open ground island. (Yes you can pack a whole Sturmkompanie into one tile). Surrounding them on all sides are 100 bazookas. Turn one, the bazookas begin area firing the island. The Germans knock out about 5 bazooka teams before being totally routed. A few more turns of this treatment and no one is left alive on the island. :eek: Try it yourself to see the 'cluster bomb' effect. Just be sure to give the Germans a few pillboxes pointing the wrong way to keep their global morale from flagging. Now a serious question. Is it okay in a battle if I let my bazookas burn off their ammo against infantry targets, once I think there won't be any more armor to fire at? 8c rounds can cause a casualty or two against guys in a building or woods, and might help make the difference between a win and a loss in a firefight. Am I going to P-off a historically minded opp deliberately using bazookas against infantry? regards, --Rett [ 07-03-2001: Message edited by: CMplayer ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
argie Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Nope. The zooks were used against infantry. Most against strong points. As an interesting side note, British troops used wire guided Milan missiles against Argentine infantry troops in Malvinas. Not too much armor around to fire at. The blast of such weapons is enough to toast infantrymen pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maastrictian Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CMplayer: Well I set up a test. A regular German Sturmkompanie on a single tile open ground island. (Yes you can pack a whole Sturmkompanie into one tile). Surrounding them on all sides are 100 bazookas. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This is -- perhaps -- the funniest thing I have read all week, maybe all month. Thank you. --Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfish Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by argie: British troops used wire guided Milan missiles against Argentine infantry troops in Malvinas .<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Don't you mean the Falklands? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Maastrictian: This is -- perhaps -- the funniest thing I have read all week, maybe all month. Thank you. --Chris<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You think it was funny to read, set it up and watch it...you won't be disappointed. --Rett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilhammer Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Zoooks were also used to blow holes through walls. BTW, it is Las Malvinas. Long live the Monroe Doctrine and Truman Doctrine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agua Perdido Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CMplayer: Well I set up a test. A regular German Sturmkompanie on a single tile open ground island. (Yes you can pack a whole Sturmkompanie into one tile). Surrounding them on all sides are 100 bazookas.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Would you mind terribly mailing me that scenario? I think we can use it in the Cesspool. Agua Perdido Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by argie: Nope. The zooks were used against infantry. Most a gainst strong points.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Thanks, I'll give my opponents your email if they think I'm gamey --Rett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Agua Perdido: Would you mind terribly mailing me that scenario? I think we can use it in the Cesspool. Agua Perdido<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Sure no prob, I got my HD clogged with lots of stuff like that. You should meet my arty spotter friend, Lt. Mr. Boom. They could make a comic book about his adventures... --Rett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 The value of firing AT weapons at infantry is as much suppression as inflicting casualties. I think suppression is underrated by most people – I don't mean when a squad is 'Taking Cover', I mean just when it goes from 'Alerted' to 'Cautious' – this can make all the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YECoyote Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Malvinas is another name for the Falklands Islands, I think. I could be wrong, but I have seen it in several places where they call it "Falklands/Malvinas" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarmo Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CMplayer: Well I set up a test. A regular German Sturmkompanie on a single tile open ground island. (Yes you can pack a whole Sturmkompanie into one tile). Surrounding them on all sides are 100 bazookas. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ooh. I really bursted when I read this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agua Perdido Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jarmo: Ooh. I really bursted when I read this. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> So did I, but then I started thinking: was this really a fair test? 100 bazookas is something like three times as many points as a Sturmkompanie. A more even matchup would be a Sturmkompanie vs. 30 or 40 bazookas. Would the bazookas still come out ahead so easily? Now I realize I really need to knock off work and go have a drink! Let your rallying cry this 4th of July (and not just for us Yanks--it's fun to blow stuff up, even without a holiday as an excuse) be: "One-hundred bazookas!" Agua Perdido Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Agua Perdido: So did I, but then I started thinking: was this really a fair test? 100 bazookas is something like three times as many points as a Sturmkompanie. A more even matchup would be a Sturmkompanie vs. 30 or 40 bazookas. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I should mention that the bazookas were on defence, so they were dug in. --Rett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conscript Bagger Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Can't remember which, but either MacDonald's "Company Commander" or Gantter's "Roll Me Over" mentions being fired on by a German bazooka (schreck or faust, I imagine) - the author says it was the first time he'd seen a bazooka used against infantry, and remarks about how frightening it was. I don't think it's gamey, but it sounds like it wasn't an everyday occurrence either. If what happens to AT teams when they get spotted by infantry in CM is at all representative of what happened in real life, one can see where they'd be hesitant to draw infantry's attention by firing on them. Plus I'd think they would want to save their ammo for enemy armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pak40 Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 That's an amusing test as well as informative. Unfortunately, in real battle situations I've seen nothing but dismall results of bazookas against infantry. In fact, I've yet to see a soldier injured or killed by a bazooka or schrek round, and I've looked closely every time I used one or had one used against me. The only thing I've seen is maybe some surpressing results, that's it. I've yet to see a infantry casualty caused by a hand grenade also. I've looked closely at every close combat situation I've been it and have yet to see one. I would have begged to BTS that these "bugs" be changed but it seems that others have seen these things happen quite frequently so there must not be any bugs. It's obviously a conspiracy mounted by my copy of CM and my computer [ 07-03-2001: Message edited by: Pak40 ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juju Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Pak40: That's an amusing test as well as informative. Unfortunately, in real battle situations I've seen nothing but dismall results of bazookas against infantry. In fact, I've yet to see a soldier injured or killed by a bazooka or schrek round, and I've looked closely every time I used one or had one used against me. The only thing I've seen is maybe some surpressing results, that's it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> My thoughts exactly. Until an opponent's Scheck set fire to a house that held a whole platoon of my infantry. A little while later in a different PBEM the same thing happened. And just recently I had a platoon occupying a large building. The were only just holding uot, and ammo was going low. There was no AT threat, since it was an infantry only battle. All of a sudden one of the squads decides to use their faust against some enemy infantry. Guess what? Yup, one burning building and one platoon running this way and that. Kinda changed my views on them little fellers in an anti-infantry role if there's buildings around, I'll tell you that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
argie Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kingfish: Don't you mean the Falklands? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Falklands??? What the hell is that??? A Nordic land or somefink? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalin's Organ Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by David Aitken: I think suppression is underrated by most people – I don't mean when a squad is 'Taking Cover', I mean just when it goes from 'Alerted' to 'Cautious' – this can make all the difference.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> David's been trying to convince himself of this by repeating it as often as he can ever since he assembled the "Raevsky Redoubt" grand battery of 2" mortars to bombard a wood I was in - and all they achieved was to alert a couple of squads!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodyBucket Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 I have heard one old vet say that they often fired bazookas at infantry when they were in buildings or fieldworks. He also told me how he took out a tank with a bazooka from a small basement window during the Bulge. Since the backblast prevented firing the damn thing in the usual manner (small room), they wedged it in the window with sandbags and fired it remotely with some sort of Rube Goldberg string arrangement. Hit the tank (Model unknown, he thinks every tank he saw was a Tiger) in the roadwheels and when it bogged the crew was coaxed out with gasoline. Try modeling that in CM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REVS Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 Speaking of 100 bazookas pointed at innocent boys on an island... To introduce an old ASL gaming friend to the new CM system, we dropped him into the intro Valley game, but modified things so the Axis had about 50 modules of 300mm artillery targeted on him across the front. We had warned him that artillery was just a wee bit more effective in CM than ASL, then we let it rip! Talk about 100 zooks aimed at boys on an island! Our artillery barrage was a credit to the designers' graphics. Well done BTS! I don't think I'll ever forget how much we laughed that night, as the artillery rained down on the old hand/newbie. He just said "F***, that artillery's pretty amazing. Is it always like this?" We assured him it was. He wanted to play on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen. Sosaboski Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 A vet in the 80th Inf Div that I talked to said bazookas were the most efective way for infantry to do house to house fighting. Pour suppressive fire on the building, then get the bazooka team to fire at one of the walls or the window. End of problem most of the time. However, in CM, I have noticed that 'zooks are useless for digging out infantry. Anyone else have better luck? I remember in CC2 actually using them to some success in that role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMplayer Posted July 4, 2001 Author Share Posted July 4, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gen. Sosaboski: A vet in the 80th Inf Div that I talked to said bazookas were the most efective way for infantry to do house to house fighting. Pour suppressive fire on the building, then get the bazooka team to fire at one of the walls or the window. End of problem most of the time.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Why? Because the round penetrates the wall and explodes inside? Or does it break a hole in the wall, making it easier to shoot in rifle grenades? All or none of the above? --Rett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Duquette Posted July 4, 2001 Share Posted July 4, 2001 HE rounds as well as shaped charge rounds (HEAT) were manufactured for the M1A1 and M9 Bazookas during the war. In addition HEAT is apparently very effective against troops in bunkers and buildings. Someone know if the PIAT or Panzerschreck had HE rounds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blenheim Posted July 5, 2001 Share Posted July 5, 2001 BUMP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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