JOCHEN PEIPER Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 Do they fight realisticly. Or like every man and his dog... I mean like fanatics... Does the full game have the 12th SS HitlerJugend... They gave the Canadians one hell of a time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 Hi, do a search on a thread called 'Waffen-SS are over-priced hamsters' are is revealed there. Also, search, and think before you post, please. Try to think about whether all these new topics are really necessary. Thanks in advance. ------------------ Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mensch Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 if you want to make them more fanatical. when you make your own luverly Operation you can set the fanatizim for the troops. thats all. if you want a good book on the panzergrenediers look up "steel inferno" by Michael Reynolds ISBN 0-44022596-5 it has accounts from the 1st ss panzer corps in normady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaffertape Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 The 12th SS are definitely in the game, but as mentioned in the 'Hamsters' thread, SS troops aren't unfallable. Its any squad's experience status (Veteran , Green, Elite, etc) that makes the real difference. The Canadian vs 12th SS battles do exist in CM, although at the moment I don't remember if any actually came with the CD... It may have been a user-made one. GAFF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disaster@work Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Germanboy: Also, search, and think before you post, please. Try to think about whether all these new topics are really necessary. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Has someone assembled a FAQ for this forum? This would eliminate the need for such chiding from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Disaster@work: Has someone assembled a FAQ for this forum? This would eliminate the need for such chiding from you. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Guachi tried to do one, IIRC. Don't think that ever happened. BTW, I would prefer 'friendly reminder' instead of chiding. ------------------ Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumbo Posted July 26, 2000 Share Posted July 26, 2000 They are realistically depicted. Namely they can be utterly aweful or desperate fanatics. It all depends on the quality level you give them. Just as is described in the accounts we have from WW2 different SS units varied wildly in quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Peltz Posted July 27, 2000 Share Posted July 27, 2000 Seems to me that the Canadians gave the SS a hard time on occassion also... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patboivin Posted July 27, 2000 Share Posted July 27, 2000 I am playing a scenario against Deadline, and so far his SS troops haven't taken a single prisoner. Instead there are whole squads lying in the field here and there, they just eliminated them all. No prisoners. After what I saw, I'm not going to take prisoners either, I am pounding them from a distance with my tanks, shell by shell... until there will be nothing left of them. You reap what you sow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen. Sosaboski Posted July 27, 2000 Share Posted July 27, 2000 The Poles had fun with the SS... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Bates Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindan Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 Sorry. SS are just normal troops equipped according to their TO&E. (like Polish Airborne). And a software-recommendation for free: Gassing people in a nearby KZ is not possible in CM. Perhaps you should look for the old "Hitler Dictator"- game for C-64. (banned in Germany BTW and rightfully so.) This could be more to your liking. (How many people do you want to gas today?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iggi Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 Pat, is this the kind and gentle Pat I PBEMed with. You've changed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Babra Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 Feeble attempt to distract Lindan with the dancing frog... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SS Peiper Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 Originally posted by Formerly Babra: Feeble attempt to distract Lindan with the dancing frog... ROTFL thats Great SS Peiper [This message has been edited by SS Peiper (edited 09-03-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SS Peiper Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 Jochen let me get this straight. Are you playing the Demo or the full game?? SS Peiper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 below is what I think of this remark. ------------------ h.s. [This message has been edited by Stoffel (edited 09-03-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Tom Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 Yeah, us Canadians really roughed up the 12th SS, which, through all accounts that I have read, were pretty strategically incompetent. Attacking with Infantry without tank support, and attacking with tanks without infantry support, jeepers! They must have wiped out a greater portion of their strength bumping against Canadian positions than they lost through the Falise operation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tailz Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Major Tom: Yeah, us Canadians really roughed up the 12th SS, which, through all accounts that I have read, were pretty strategically incompetent. Attacking with Infantry without tank support, and attacking with tanks without infantry support, jeepers! They must have wiped out a greater portion of their strength bumping against Canadian positions than they lost through the Falise operation!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Not entirely true... although created primarily out of Hitler Youth members, the NCO's/Officers were generally seasoned East Front SS veterans. (ala the infamous "Panzer Meyer") and handled itself well throughout the Normandy campaign, and bashed the Canadians about pretty well. (the North Novas and Winnipeggers for instance) Initially stunned by the youthfull status of their opponents, the 12th quickly demonstrated the ferocity and "no holds barred" approach to combat that would become their hallmark. (Indeed, within the first week of the Normandy campaign, Canadian troops would be exacting their own "no prisoner" approach to battle with the 12th. Many atrocities were instigated by both sides during the bocage battles that led up to Falaise) Far from being strategically incompetent, the 12th was well handled and demonstrated the tactical prowess that served the German military so well during the Normandy campaign. Like all the Panzer units in France, it suffered heavily at the hands of the Allied airforces whenever it attempted to co-ordinate for a counteroffensive or firebrigade defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Tom Posted September 3, 2000 Share Posted September 3, 2000 The Regina Rifles had enjoyed an EXTREME amount of success being attacked by the 2/26th, 1/26th and a Panzer battalion of the 12th SS. It did not lose its positions and infliced an EXTREME amount of punishment on all the German formations as they all attacked disorderly and independent of one another. The officers might have been veterans, but, they were not veterans of commanding units of this size! The original 12th SS Commander was killed off very early, and Meyer, a Panzer Grenadier Regiment commander was responsible for the Division. Actually, most of the engagements between the two forces did not end up in a massive aireal or artillery bombardment by allied forces as the Canadians moved beyond effective artillery range and air support communications broke down. You forget that before the Winnipegers were pushed out they severely damaged the 3/25 or 3/26th Battalion. If the Canadians were adequately reinforced the Germans would not have gained any territory. The North Novascotia Regiment was caught off guard by a surprise German Regimental sized attack that was eventually crushed by Allied weight of numbers. It was Meyer's folly to attack the Canadian positions. He lost too much of his armour, and too much of his infantry in ineffective attacks. He would have done much better to remain in concealed defensive positions with a full Panzer formation as close reserve instead of blunting his forces against the Canadian formations. What the SS troopers made up in ferocity and loyalty they lost in inexperience. The 3rd Canadian Division was as inexperienced, but, was definitely the winner of the engagement in Normandy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOCHEN PEIPER Posted September 4, 2000 Author Share Posted September 4, 2000 I posted this ages ago....Why bring it back now... I have the full game now... No need for this question to stand... ------------------ Quote. If you see a white plane it's American, if you see a black plane it's the RAF. If you see no planes at all it's the Luftwaffe." ---German soldier on the Western Front, 1944. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatAWilson Posted September 4, 2000 Share Posted September 4, 2000 Everything that I have read about the SS indicates that they were probably the best defenders around, but not the best attackers at all. In defense one needs dogged determination, a quality that the SS had in spades. In the attack, however, that same determination led to the SS often taking too many casualties. IMHO a legitimate gameplay issue is the separation of morale and skill. There should be troops that will not break regardless of skill level. BTS models this to pretty well with the "fanaticism" parameter. Sooo ... for all those who say "the SS kicked butt" - you're right - sometimes. For all those who say "the SS got their butts kicked" - you're right too - sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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