Berlin CMRT Map

[RockinHarry]

9 hours ago, NPye said:

Know what you mean but in this case you can't get near it, it can see all movement, i placed 4 spotters in there with 88mm and 128mm Artillery batteries, plus it was staffed by 300 personnel (in reality) I put a company of elite Luftwaffe Company in there. It just pounded the Soviets to Hell. 88mm on the ground to deal with tanks plus wire and trenches with another company covering the ground... Even the troops on the balconies didn't suffer to bad, maybe because the angle is very steep to fire on. Interesting at the least and shows probably why the Soviets bypassed these towers as to assault one would inflict huge casualties, but there would be a price to pay for not knocking it out, this tower in the Zoo Gardens knocked out many tanks when the Soviets stormed Moltke Bridge and the Reichstag... plus however many Russian Planes... and infantry. 

Yes, if you make the setup this way then they all have good survival chance. Adding any Arty to the oppenent paired with FO and TRP likely makes it strongly diminished though. Or any big HE throwing SU having direct LOS to it/them. Guess few of the i.e JSU152 make the whole structure crumble in fairly short time. But got to test balconies some more. If they have considerable effects on infantry survival/cover then I have some ideas. Some other weak spots is each levels floor. I.e you can decimate an enemy on upper floors by shooting buttom up at them, either from same building or from outside through windows. But that seems realistic considering floors where mostly made of timber those times.

[RockinHarry]

14 hours ago, NPye said:

The Zoological Flak Tower, set in the Tier Garden Berlin, this tower caused both the soviets and the British a lot of trouble... The Soviets 1st attack on the Reichstag was completely stopped with the help of this tower 128mm Flak/AT guns and the British found it really hard to demolish... lol The tower had commanding views that spanned for miles across this sector of Berlin... I know I can't replicate this correctly (as I cant place any 88mm or smaller flak guns on the roof) but it's still a formidable obstruction for the Soviets. 

Looks is stunning btw.

[NPye]

Here's my latest offering, A photo book, made in old style presentation and colouring.

Whilst building the Mod I have researched through 1000's of old photos of before, during and after the conflict ended. When you see Berlin in 1900s it is such an inspired city, with culture at its foremost, the architecture is so beautiful, the layout of the streets all complimentary, it has vast retail areas like Saarlandstrasse, Alexanderplatz, Potsdamer Platz,  Unter den Linden to name a few...then the huge cultural sector like Museum Island. There are Palaces and Cathedrals...

Then you look at the destruction, all this gone not just in Berlin but by 1945 the whole country, as the all mighty Third Reich goes into its death throes... war is such a waste, the lives lost and the lives ruined, the cities destroyed by a conflict brought about by one man and one political parties vision.

Imagine being a Berliner, what suffering they endured for years putting up with the Nazis telling them what art to like and what books to read, what cinema, the propaganda every day. From the housewife to the business man they waited in line  for everything, even whilst under Russian Artillery fire in the last days as not to lose their place. Then having the news that a relation had been killed at the front... and if you were a soldier imagine seeing the destruction every time you can home getting worse and worse until total destruction and you are fighting on the streets were you live, your 14 year old son is in charge of an AA gun in the Z sector, your wife dead from Allied Air Terror attacks, your home in ruins and all your friends and neighbours all gone. Dead or moved to another location... Anyway enough already, you know the deal. 

So grab a coffee and enjoy my slideshow of the Potsdamer Platz battle area. 

 

[NPye]

3 hours ago, Vacillator said:

I remember we were discussing this a while ago - could they not have just blasted the top with artillery?  A few hundred barrels dropping 152mm or bigger would surely have limited the lifespan of the 128s?   Or a bit of rocket action, who cares about accuracy in Berlin...

Know what you mean... needs further research as for the reason that didn't happen, or did it and but wasn't effective, even in 1945 artillery surely could have blasted them somehow??? Good question.

[NPye]

2 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

 

It´s bits of a Blender hack then combined with one the known placement cheats in CM editor. Only tried in CMFB ATM.

 

1. In Blender move the objects full hierarchy up 30-40m. Export.

2. In CM place the edited flak in intended action spot.

3. in map editor place the building "on top" of where you know the flak is.

4. open 3D deploy editor and see results.

5. exit deploy screen then go to 3D map preview. "Destroy" roof and upper story of newly placed (modular) building with SHIFT +ALT Click. (that for making the "flat" roof looks) Add balconies if desired (SHIFT+CNTRL Click) and change facades + windows to your liking. Exit 3D preview.

6. Enter deploy screen again and see if the Flak drops or dropped down to next valid level. Should be the one below the destroyed roof then. Check out various face command effects. You can get the Flak beeing placed on the balcony i.e

7. If everything "sticks", save mission and do a play test.

8. If play test does not reveal any issues, replace the "hacked" MDR with original one, or simply delete it from data/z folder. Have fun with flak towers.

That for cover value of even a 16x16 type mod building. But the situation was bits of unfair I got to admit.

Edit: might share the "hacked" 88Flak MDR as well. Think it´s version where I removed the gun carriage. Use at your own peril. https://www.dropbox.com/s/iq4m3ecya1bskzg/flak36.7z?dl=0

 

I'll give it ago... cheers bud

[NPye]

2 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Looks is stunning btw.

Cheers bud, interesting how trying to get things to look something close to the real thing is a massive challenge with this game...lol But we love it...

[RockinHarry]

18 minutes ago, NPye said:

Know what you mean... needs further research as for the reason that didn't happen, or did it and but wasn't effective, even in 1945 artillery surely could have blasted them somehow??? Good question.

here´s some interesting impressions on the flakturm in last days of war. Can be google translated (to english) with option near top left of page. http://richard.tom-goebel.de/berlin-1945/familie-oswalt-soldatengrab

Also since it was a Flak bunker it also held various smaller caliber Flak for close defense vs anything coming at it through airspace. While that thing was large it likely was still hard achieving some well placed hits on top by means of indirect firing artillery? But interesting that they´re still in action til the last days of the war nonetheless.

[Artkin]

3 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Yup the kicked up dust is still at ground level. Mod tag what for? Haven´t tested yet, but I guess should work for any the given cases. But if the Flak tower placement sticks, you can go along with the original MDR. Normal placements "should" work as usual, but haven´t tested yet.

Edit: That was a "just for fun" hack only. The simple mission setup worked, but that doesn´t mean it works in any different setup (and CM game) as well.

Right so all that was changed was the .mdr? You can throw the whole folder with the flak into documents -> user data -> z. Assign the new .mdr files a mod tag at the end of their name (m1a2_sep [MODTAGNAME].mdr). Then make a mod tag which is just a .txt file (Give it any name) with the only text inside being "MODTAGNAME". Then you can assign a scenario the mod tag, so the Flak88 will only appear different in that particular scenario, and will be normal for the rest.

I'm sure you knew this already. If not, and if you are confused at all I can elaborate further.

[RockinHarry]

39 minutes ago, NPye said:

Here's my latest offering, A photo book, made in old style presentation and colouring.

Whilst building the Mod I have researched through 1000's of old photos of before, during and after the conflict ended. When you see Berlin in 1900s it is such an inspired city, with culture at its foremost, the architecture is so beautiful, the layout of the streets all complimentary, it has vast retail areas like Saarlandstrasse, Alexanderplatz, Potsdamer Platz,  Unter den Linden to name a few...then the huge cultural sector like Museum Island. There are Palaces and Cathedrals...

Then you look at the destruction, all this gone not just in Berlin but by 1945 the whole country, as the all mighty Third Reich goes into its death throes... war is such a waste, the lives lost and the lives ruined, the cities destroyed by a conflict brought about by one man and one political parties vision.

Imagine being a Berliner, what suffering they endured for years putting up with the Nazis telling them what art to like and what books to read, what cinema, the propaganda every day. From the housewife to the business man they waited in line  for everything, even whilst under Russian Artillery fire in the last days as not to lose their place. Then having the news that a relation had been killed at the front... and if you were a soldier imagine seeing the destruction every time you can home getting worse and worse until total destruction and you are fighting on the streets were you live, your 14 year old son is in charge of an AA gun in the Z sector, your wife dead from Allied Air Terror attacks, your home in ruins and all your friends and neighbours all gone. Dead or moved to another location... Anyway enough already, you know the deal. 

So grab a coffee and enjoy my slideshow of the Potsdamer Platz battle area. 

 

marvelous and ground breaking! Also taking Stalingrad and few other mods into account of course. Kudos all.

[RockinHarry]

4 minutes ago, Artkin said:

Right so all that was changed was the .mdr? You can throw the whole folder with the flak into documents -> user data -> z. Assign the new .mdr files a mod tag at the end of their name (m1a2_sep [MODTAGNAME].mdr). Then make a mod tag which is just a .txt file (Give it any name) with the only text inside being "MODTAGNAME". Then you can assign a scenario the mod tag, so the Flak88 will only appear different in that particular scenario, and will be normal for the rest.

I'm sure you knew this already. If not, and if you are confused at all I can elaborate further.

I did understand, thanks. Yes, would be normal procedure usually. I meant mission designers don´t need tagging it since once the hacked 88 is placed appropriately, the original one then works as well after saving the mission. It won´t change placement again. At least didn´t happen in my small test games. So no need to share the MDR file which is just a crude hack anyway. There still might be side effects, but don´t want testing it much further. Just for fun thing as said.

Did you try the file and mentioned procedure already?

Yup, MDR file changes only. Rest is right placement order as outlined in my posting.

[NPye]

32 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

here´s some interesting impressions on the flakturm in last days of war. Can be google translated (to english) with option near top left of page. http://richard.tom-goebel.de/berlin-1945/familie-oswalt-soldatengrab

 

Awesome read and info...

[Artkin]

51 minutes ago, RockinHarry said:

I did understand, thanks

If you only did your procedure then the flak 88 would be on floor #1 in the house, correct?

And when you altered the .MDR that's how you got it to be off the ground, correct?

Or if I am misunderstanding you said: You can have a raised flak (in a building) and a normal flak (On the ground outside) in the same scenario?

[RockinHarry]

59 minutes ago, Artkin said:

If you only did your procedure then the flak 88 would be on floor #1 in the house, correct?

Correct!

59 minutes ago, Artkin said:

And when you altered the .MDR that's how you got it to be off the ground, correct?

off the ground and above allowed "in building placement" (which is nogo normally unless using the unit first - building second cheat)

59 minutes ago, Artkin said:

Or if I am misunderstanding you said: You can have a raised flak (in a building) and a normal flak (On the ground outside) in the same scenario?

Both! The hacked MDR is for initial placement only. My theory is that it circumvents the games "no guns nor vehicle" placement editor rule and puts it outside normal boundaries (above the buidling in this case). But a ground unit got to be somewhere, so it can´t float in the air and thus drops down to next "valid" (invalid actually) ground spot, in this case the upper level of a building directly below. The NOGO on destroyed roofs still applies, so it drops down to next "valid" one. That´s my theory.

Once the Flak sticks to this upper level it gets "valid" status and remains there, even when therafter replacing the hacked MDR with original one again. This status then gets saved with the mission file obviously. Then you can keep going with placing original MDR object like example below.

This is from 1st game turn setup phase. Doesn´t change when hitting GO. Everybody stands and fights from positions they got assigned during editor placement phase. Fun thing in below example the one Flak on the balcony (right hand building) gets the crew turning to bungee jumpers. At least parts of them.

Edited November 1, 2022 by RockinHarry

[Lucky_Strike]

1 hour ago, RockinHarry said:

Fun thing in below example the one Flak on the balcony (right hand building) gets the crew turning to bungee jumpers. At least parts of them.

Hahahah LMAO video please 

[Artkin]

1 hour ago, RockinHarry said:

Correct!

off the ground and above allowed "in building placement" (which is nogo normally unless using the unit first - building second cheat)

Both! The hacked MDR is for initial placement only. My theory is that it circumvents the games "no guns nor vehicle" placement editor rule and puts it outside normal boundaries (above the buidling in this case). But a ground unit got to be somewhere, so it can´t float in the air and thus drops down to next "valid" (invalid actually) ground spot, in this case the upper level of a building directly below. The NOGO on destroyed roofs still applies, so it drops down to next "valid" one. That´s my theory.

Once the Flak sticks to this upper level it gets "valid" status and remains there, even when therafter replacing the hacked MDR with original one again. This status then gets saved with the mission file obviously. Then you can keep going with placing original MDR object like example below.

This is from 1st game turn setup phase. Doesn´t change when hitting GO. Everybody stands and fights from positions they got assigned during editor placement phase. Fun thing in below example the one Flak on the balcony (right hand building) gets the crew turning to bungee jumpers. At least parts of them.

Holy crap thats amazing. So if I understand correctly the flak will fire from the top floor instead of the ground floor? 

[Lucky_Strike]

3 hours ago, NPye said:

Here's my latest offering, A photo book, made in old style presentation and colouring.

Great stuff Nigel, thanks for posting.

 

[Artkin]

4 hours ago, NPye said:

Here's my latest offering, A photo book, made in old style presentation and colouring.

Whilst building the Mod I have researched through 1000's of old photos of before, during and after the conflict ended. When you see Berlin in 1900s it is such an inspired city, with culture at its foremost, the architecture is so beautiful, the layout of the streets all complimentary, it has vast retail areas like Saarlandstrasse, Alexanderplatz, Potsdamer Platz,  Unter den Linden to name a few...then the huge cultural sector like Museum Island. There are Palaces and Cathedrals...

Then you look at the destruction, all this gone not just in Berlin but by 1945 the whole country, as the all mighty Third Reich goes into its death throes... war is such a waste, the lives lost and the lives ruined, the cities destroyed by a conflict brought about by one man and one political parties vision.

Imagine being a Berliner, what suffering they endured for years putting up with the Nazis telling them what art to like and what books to read, what cinema, the propaganda every day. From the housewife to the business man they waited in line  for everything, even whilst under Russian Artillery fire in the last days as not to lose their place. Then having the news that a relation had been killed at the front... and if you were a soldier imagine seeing the destruction every time you can home getting worse and worse until total destruction and you are fighting on the streets were you live, your 14 year old son is in charge of an AA gun in the Z sector, your wife dead from Allied Air Terror attacks, your home in ruins and all your friends and neighbours all gone. Dead or moved to another location... Anyway enough already, you know the deal. 

So grab a coffee and enjoy my slideshow of the Potsdamer Platz battle area. 

 

Looks like we're playing a different game, especially with the train cars. Outstanding. I have to say though, I saw some places with large rubble piles in front of buildings that had no damage. Is the rubble from bombings? Pushed aside by a dozer maybe? Or just an oversight? 

I also love that hollowed out building at the start. That feels very Stalingrad.

[RockinHarry]

5 hours ago, Artkin said:

Holy crap thats amazing. So if I understand correctly the flak will fire from the top floor instead of the ground floor? 

Yup, they do. See my earlier posting.

 

[RockinHarry]

5 hours ago, Lucky_Strike said:

Hahahah LMAO video please 

maybe you can see in your own game. Drop to CMFB missions folder and watch any side. Also as test it doesn´t just work on my own computer. Flak needs to be on some the balconies to see bungee jumping, which is bits of a randomn thing due to game engine slight adjustments during each game run. Have fun

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8j6v573n4wbudxd/0_88Flak High Test.btt?dl=0

[Artkin]

8 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Yup, they do. See my earlier posting.

 

Dude thats absolutely incredible. You guys are friggen wizards. Now you gotta get the flat roofs in from cmbs/cmcw

[Aquila-SmartWargames]

You guys are impressive

[JM Stuff]

9 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

maybe you can see in your own game. Drop to CMFB missions folder and watch any side. Also as test it doesn´t just work on my own computer. Flak needs to be on some the balconies to see bungee jumping, which is bits of a randomn thing due to game engine slight adjustments during each game run. Have fun

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8j6v573n4wbudxd/0_88Flak High Test.btt?dl=0

Hehe nice try I was playing the axe and they took some hits then I took the place of the allied and they were more strong, the problem is the smoke that hidding the target very quick but is nice to see that they can fire from the roof... this is my opinion !

JM 

Edited November 1, 2022 by JM Stuff

[RockinHarry]

22 minutes ago, JM Stuff said:

Hehe nice try I was playing the axe and they took some hits then I took the place of the allied and they were more strong, the problem is the smoke that hidding the target very quick but is nice to see that they can fire from the roof... this is my opinion !

JM 

So it worked in your game? Good to know then. Open it in editor and set ground condition to wet and wind to strong. You can edit and save all that, but don´t try moving the Flak off the building. For new placement you´d need the hacked MDR version.

[RockinHarry]

1 hour ago, Artkin said:

Dude thats absolutely incredible. You guys are friggen wizards. Now you gotta get the flat roofs in from cmbs/cmcw

or alternatively try some the flat roof indi buildings. Haven´tried that either. I once tried importing CMSF1 flat roofs to CMBN 8x8 mod building and succeeded (in 2015 IIRC). Just had some texture issues, which I could likely avoid from better knowledge today. @kohlenklau would be among specialists for these cases I think. 

[NPye]

Downloaded the ruins set from Aquila-SmartWargames dropbox, and to my bewilderment it worked after a bit of pissing about, although some of the textures aren't working properly, I wonder if this is something one of you tech guys could look at? I love it and we really are breaking all barriers in this game...

 

Download Link

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/1tviryry89g6py7/AAAJpSvGH6u1iEx4WzwVLSnJa?dl=0&preview=CM+Ruins+Pack.zip

Edited November 1, 2022 by NPye