Holien

Hmmm thinking about how this scenario might be improved what would people do differently. It is all well and good saying we did not like it but how would we have liked it? For myself I would change the following. 1. Better briefing about the existence of wire and mines. 2. Smaller map so less time spent getting to attacking position. 3. Better cover for attackers to attack from. 4. Some VP's outside the main compound. Perhaps a pumping house or some other such device which allows the defender some choices as well as the attacker. 5. Do it during day light. (I am not so sure on this?) The idea of the compound is good and the opportunity to choose ones landing zones were good. What was bad was that in making that choice it had no real impact on the game, so make the map smaller. This is just thinking aloud and I hope others out there might have some constructive comments to make on the design. H

Hindsight is a wonderful thing (regarding the Gate) and I thank Ali for backing me up on the comments about this game. "I agree with Holien that it was a pity that this night fight decided the victory ..." "This scenario tested players luck, not skill" When you get CMBB please let me know and we shall have a real contest... Then we shall see who whips who!!! H

Hmmm I guess that would explain your lack of foresight checking the forum Mr White... I see I get to play a Grog.... Ohhh Goody... Newbies together... H

Hi Xerxes, I have tried that and managed to get a group of T34's behind his main advance. This has helped as he had to detach part of his force to deal with them. The problem with the T34's at this stage is that there is a horrible time delay as the crews are green. This meant that I got into a corner where I could not get out. It was uesful but this game is a lot harder with the time delays. Ahhh for the days of the Stuart rushing a Tiger. He He He.... The T-34 is a serious zipping machine just need some decent crews in it. H

Hi Laxx, Nice screen shot and good info for people, thanks. I presume this was against the AI and not another human? I am playing this against The Capt at the moment and he has had a few tanks bog but I have not yet been able to touch him. His Tigers have just chewed too many of my tanks and I am having a hard time learning how to handle the Russians without Radios and the time delays. H

James glad to hear that you had better luck than your game. Have you found the section on how to deal with KV tanks? I am busy trying to find the section on how to avoid death from above!!! H

JK I think you will find that Tero is in fact an Elf and rather busy in Finland at the moment helping Santa to full fill his orders from all the kids around the world. H

Interesting, The ones where the attacker won shows how they came up against a poor defence IMO. The key being to spot the enemy on the wire and have a mobile defence force to plug the gap. I tried three seperate places and in the end I should have just stormed the gate. It is a real pity this game was the joker in the pack (IMO) and used to resolve the final. If I had the defenders in this game would Ali have been able to do any better? Luck is like that and is part of the tourney. It could be that in other games previous to this there have been similar situations and we have benefited. It would be interesting to hear Ali's own words on this? H

White4 what on earth were you doing!!! Sleeping? Good point on file sizes. H

Mine made it to Banbury this morning.... H

After doing some analysis, it is interesting that this scenario won the tourney for all three players in the play offs. Not sure what it says about it but this is the one that decided who was the overall winner in each group. 2 played the Germans and one was the Allied player. I would be interested in their take on this game and how it worked in a tourney environment. H [ December 16, 2002, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: Holien ]

Cpl, I have my eye on you young Ladie.... You are the dark horse and to be watched carefully. H

Done, As I was... (He He He) Thanks TB for all your efforts and time it is a big commitment and I do enjoy them. To play the games against such great opponents is the cream cake for me. The memories of White4 and the mountains, the battle against JK and his banter in the first one, the slow winter assualt with KF, the banter with CDIC and horror of the night, the speed with which Wolfie fell, the luck of non bogging stugs, the use of 88's, the damn Tigers and that fine chap from NZ.... I could go on and on, but all those are worth far more than a few bottles (as fine as they might be) from SA. Well thats what I will be saying to myself as I cry myself to sleep. Cheers and thanks for all the fish... H P.s. I just got a hug and a well done from my babe, she is going to comfort me.... Night all.... [ December 15, 2002, 06:08 PM: Message edited by: Holien ]

Right last post of the night, another good game with low tech forces and some choices to make. H AAR – North Of Epron Holien vs Lopaka An interesting map which captured the feel of the area. A small town at the rear of the map and only one road in to it. This goes down the centre of a marsh area and through a forest. The objective is three large flags towards the rear of the map. 1 each for the two artillery batteries and 1 for a HQ building in a central position. Plenty of buildings for the defender to use and this is going to be hard. In terms of the approach to be taken this really funnels the attack down the road. There are two other approaches but they are labelled as being mined and with the wet conditions and chances of bogging the road is the only real way to go. The German forces are two platoons (to begin with and a promise of a third) and several ½ tracks 20mm and 75mm armed. This looks to be a low-tech game. No tanks for me and I hope no tanks for the Allied player. Well the attack is a platoon on the right and left of the road. HMG’s to suppress the suspected HMG position and then move the A/C’s up when I feel it is safe / they are needed. I have two spotters with 16 rounds each of 120mm. I can see a building near the reported battery position on my right and take a gamble in getting the spotter to target wide that area. If the Guns are there and being towed by trucks then it might pay dividends. The artillery position on my left is beyond the woods so I send my other spotter with the group going that way, to do a similar job when I get a close enough LOS. I have a couple of snipers and send one on my right flank to get a peak at what is beyond the fields and the other is sent through the woods to check the left flank out. The action starts slowly and I manage to flush the HMG from the tall building by the road and at the edge of the forest. This had good LOS on my attack and I need to clear him before I reveal my ½ tracks. In the process my sniper on the left finds a minefield and I discover a Piat team skulking in the woods. On the right I hear truck noises and my arty lands roughly in the area. I do not know if it had any effect. I later discover that it nobbled one gun and a truck. My sniper on the right sees an AC (no ID so it could be a Stuart to a Daimler) and buttons the T/C but takes fire in return and bugs out to cover. Advancing down the middle I move an AC to crest a slight rise and help my Infantry attack the 1st row of buildings which have HMG’s in the second floor. This promptly dies from a 6pdr round and after some manuvering I manage to take out the gun. Several more piat teams are found and one takes out another of my A/C’s. I have lost a 20mm and 75mm A/c’s and I need to be more careful. My platoon on the left moves to edge of the woods and I get a LOS to a building near the battery. Again I can hear trucks. This is where I nearly lose the game. I send a half squad out to the left and through a gap in some barbwire laid down near a heavy stone building and small woods. This team gets to woods without drawing fire. Yippee I have found a hole. I order the rest of the platoon to rush through this gap. Bugger I have found an ambush as my men are stuck in the open. I lose two squads to this and only manage to extract the HQ and 4 men from the 3rd squad. My Zhreck team loses a man but is also saved. I drop some rounds on the battery position and I see a plume of smoke rise. I guess from radio chatter that I have taken a 25pdr and truck. My attack down the road is doing a bit better and I manage to tag a couple of Un_ID vehicles. On the far right I see a counter attack is launched and this is just as I get my third platoon in ½ tracks. I unload the HQ and a crack section to deal with it. It turns out to be a White ½ track with a Piat team aboard. This is perhaps a foolhardy move as it is unsupported and is soon burning with dead crew and Piat team from a Faust into the side. The HQ rejoins the other two squads which are now progressing down the main road with the remaining two A/C’s. I manage to get a foothold in the town and start exploiting it by bringing combined firepower onto the divided defenders. Several more of his A/C’s are taken and things seem to be going better apart from the stalled attack on the left. Then his guns open up on the buildings I am in and I lose a ½ track, which has put his nose, a bit too far forwards. This is when I start to realise that not only does he have 25pdrs but for AA cover a couple of Bofors 40mm guns. As things are looking bad I get a fourth platoon and a couple of green crewed Lynx’s. This will help but again I will have to be careful of Piats and those guns. I have no arty to take the guns out and I need to get within bayonet range. I rush the new platoon to the town and jump the squads into the fray, working closely with one another I manage to skirt the guns LOS (on the whole) and bring devastating fire power to bear against his defenders. His BHQ was all by itself in a Heavy building and soon falls. Other squads just melt away and I get the feeling that his troops are pretty green. On the left flank with the few rounds of 120 left I drop it on his defenders on the far left. These pull back and I rush the remaining HQ and depleted squad through a gap in the wire and over runs these men. This is out of the LOS of his platoon in that area. This platoon had re-located to defend against my central attack. Some of those squads made the mistake of getting onto the second floor of the light buildings and hence into the LOS of my 75mm ½ track and Puma. I then move this depleted platoon around his far-left flank and over run a 25pdr. My Zhreck team helps in its demise and causes him to re-deploy a squad to deal with this threat. This opens up his defence and my troops in the centre exploit the hole and the whole pack of cards comes tumbling down. I am desperate to rout his men before any reinforcements can arrive. I later read that this can never happen as the reinforcements will arrive no matter what. This sees me continue to apply maximum pressure on his men and I get a tad rash and lose the last 75mm ½ track, but by this stage his men are throwing up their arms. In the centre there is no resistance and I consolidate my hold on the central flag. On the right his platoon defending there lose the HQ unit and collapse. I push my men round to the right of the guns through the light woods and rush the remaining guns. They fall prey to bayonets and the trucks try and flee off the map. To no avail my men grenade them and mow down the crews. Auto surrender kicks in and my men can take a well-earned breather. So is this a balanced game? My opponent says this is the first time in his life that he has auto surrender kick in on him and I feel a bit bad that I have run through him and finished the game well before the end time limit. With that in mind I would say the Allies have a hard time of it here. Mind you when I looked at the possible set up for the Allied player I think I would have done a few things differently than Lopaka. The Allies get a fair amount of wire and this really can act as a great force multiplier. While the Allied player gets pretty naff troops in his defence force there is two platoons and quite a few HMG’s and plenty of piats and numerous A/C’ All with HMG’s. Lopaka failed to really co-ordinate his defence. Units were spread too far apart so that I could pick them off and his loss of the BHQ was criminal, you can not leave a unit like that all by itself with no sections nearby. The use of the piats was also very poor as they were used by themselves without other infantry support. This meant that they died quickly. It perhaps would have been better to hang them back in support of the infantry defence. Moving the guns was a difficult process and I think they might have been better deployed, however, my attack was so fast that I think I knocked him off balance and he gave up on the idea. Which is fair enough. I feel that if only two of the flags are defended then the Allies have a chance. This would have meant hanging back with all the vehicles and using them to support the two platoons. Who knows if this would have worked, just me trying to offer another approach? As for my attack, as always I get too adventurous and put my vehicle’s noses too far forward before truly checking out possible hiding places. The total loss of my platoon on the left was a silly mistake and all through the game I was pushing hard and fast and while this seemed to work I perhaps could have taken it slightly slower and saved more lives of my men. The scenario offers good choices of attack and defence and plenty of tactical scope to do things differently. I enjoyed the low-tech aspect of it immensely and was wondering when the Allies would get Shermans showing up. Result a Major victory to the Germans. Germans ---------- Allied 95 (24) ---------- 223 (73) ------------------- 20 Captured -------------------- 6 Mortars ----------- 11 Guns 4 Vehicles--------- 19 Vehicle Men OK 81----------------- 29 Score 77----------------- 23

Now this was fun.... One of the better scenarios and had plenty of choices to make. H AAR – Emville Exit (aka Chicken Run) Holien vs The Capt Well another nice map, two roads running down the centre of the map to a town called malice… The one on the right is a secondary road and sunken. The one on the left is a main road and raised up. The task to get as many of your troops and vehicles off the end of the map. Of course your brief says that there will be light resistance and the track marks spotted from the air will just be ½ tracks. ROFL. Now the town at the end of the map has wooded hills to the left and right with some good LOS on the roads. On the left flank there is a large patch of woods jutting out and apart from that there are cornfields and walls. The first troops I get do not have to exit and these are the ones to trigger any ambushes, which of course there will be plenty. I get three Greyhounds, three M20’s with the powerful 50 cal, but limited ammo load and two platoons of M3 carried infantry with attached zooka teams. One of the M3’s in each platoon, is the version with a 50 cal. The plan is to use the two platoons split to check out the woods at the end of the map and then move into town. On closer examination of the map there are some undulations which will allow me to get close to the town without exposing myself too much. On the left flank there is a nice dry river bed through the corn fields and this comes up right in front of the left most section of the wooded hill. So I send two M20’s and a Greyhound off to the left with a platoon and the remaining force down the sunken road on the right. I am going to give the raised road a miss. Mind you in hindsight the sunken road was a sure bet and the Capt had that covered. Well the ground being dry meant that my force cutting across the fields on the left sped over to the woods in the middle of the map. This was a mixture of light trees and more solid cover towards the edge. I cut through this to try and mask my move. As I traversed this section the alarm bells went ballistic when I heard enemy armour moving around up ahead of me. The troops jumped out of the ½ tracks and went on a little hunt. As it turned out there were two solitary Stugs with no Infantry support. Shortly after sending my recon force out that way I had the first of the forces that have to exit, a troop of five Shermans, two with 76mm guns which does not bode well. I sent one with a 76 and another 75mm upto support the left flank while the remaining three followed up the right road. By the time the Stugs had been spotted these two Shermans were fast approaching. As it happened, my zooka team managed to nail one of the Stugs and the other tried to bolt for cover in the cornfield. It failed to make it as one of the Sherman’s shot it side on. Excellent progress, two Stugs for a few infantrymen. Meanwhile on the right things were not going as well. The force I had sent up the road had reached the first small flag, which was in a small hollow in the road. An ideal ambush position. I dropped a squad split them and advanced them either side up the road for a quick check on the position. Good job two minefields were spotted and a couple of HMG’s opened up. One squad lost several men and was pulled back the other tried to rush a HMG and was mowed down. I brought up the newly arrived tanks and proceeded to blow up the HMG’s. In the process of doing this I unloaded another full squad and moved it up to the HMG foxhole. Bang 12 men dead as a couple of German Infantry squads opened up. Hmmm this is now slowing me down. Bang a Zhreck opens up and nobbles a Sherman and a ½ track, which had moved too far forward. I move the Shermans into better positions and pound the hell out of the position. Another Zhreck opens up and yet another Infantry squad (presumed to be the HQ unit). By this stage my advance up this side is stacking up and I have received another platoon of infantry in ½ tracks and 5 more tanks. All of which I have sent down this road. Several more turns pass and I am having an effect his troops break and I rush the position with the ½ tracks and A/C’s. This discovers another Zhreck and Infantry section but with fortune on my side they do little and without the HQ unit they soon break. The game is nearly half way through and I have only covered half the map. The force on the left is now rushing through the cornfield and down the dry riverbed. The M20’s lead with the Grey hound following then the ½ tracks and Shermans. I have a couple of split squads on the A/C’s ready to jump off at the first sign of trouble. Trouble hits just as my first M20 moves through the lightwoods. It drives on top of a hidden AT gun and takes it out just before it is nailed by a 20mm gun slightly further back. This gun then nails the following two A/C’s and the split squads jump off. The following Shermans nail the 20mm but the damage is done. My remaining infantry dismount and start their march through the trees clearing out any potential traps with the remaining ½ tracks and Shermans following. It is at this stage I discover that the AT gun was a crack unit and I have been very lucky. I also discover an extra foxhole without anything in it. Hmmm I wonder who lives in this hole? I soon discover a HQ unit further along and he soon succumbs to the might of my depleted platoon and ½ tracks. It is at this stage I spot a tracked beast in the town. Now there is a surprise a JdgPIV mk 70. Nice. Now things like that go in pairs, so where is the other one? On the right my force has to skirt around the mined road and then continues up to ridgeline which shelters me from direct view from the town. It is at this stage I need to send my recon platoon, what’s left of them (1 squad, zooka and the HQ unit) off to the far right. They can then get into the cover of the woods and work through the tree line and clear out any guns. The damaged Greyhound with the broken gun (Zhreck damage) makes the dash first then the ½ tracks and then the remaining Greyhound. Bang, all hell breaks lose and I lose a Sherman and the following Greyhound. Three guns have opened up on me. Listening to them I would say two big guns and another 20mm. In reality this ambush should have put paid to me, but the AI failed to pick and stick with targets and did a good dance routine. The remaining Shermans (with the extra 5) unleashed a hail of fire on the guns and they soon fell silent. This small action was helped by me running my vehicles at a diagonal across their LOS at speed. The guns failed to track the targets and were overwhelmed with choices. My HQ unit and single squad start clearing the woods followed by the ½ tracks and soon two Shermans which make the dash to the tree line. This gives me three angles of approach and should mean that I should get side shots on the two tanks in the town. The only issue now is how many infantry and what other AT weapons. Well the battle for the town goes well for me. The Capt did not have much of a chance as with my approach I had the town surrounded and with the fire power of the ½ tracks and Shermans nothing could stand up to the combined arms. The last two tanks put up a good fight but only managed to tag a couple of Shermans which I had poorly placed and were finally put paid to by my remaining Shermans. A lone Zherck popped up and was soon mowed down as he was out in brush and very exposed. The game ended with auto surrender and the remaining Germans throwing up their hands. The key point to my success was the speed with which I dispatched the AT guns, luck and skill. The loss of the two Stugs for nothing and the way I surrounded the town. Any Allied player that hits the town head on without trying to flank it will get a very bloody nose. The Capt’s 1st ambush was a good one but I would have done it slightly different if set up had allowed. The HMG’s should have been further back, or not there and in the town. Result a Tactical victory to the Allies. Germans---------Allied 130 (31)--------82 (17) 2 Mortars 20 Captured 5 Guns 4 Vehicles------12 Vehicle Men OK 4---------------258 Score 31------------ 69 [ December 15, 2002, 05:54 PM: Message edited by: Holien ]

Hi, As this cost me the finals, here is my AAR. AAR – Lab Rats Holien vs Ali The mission is to take a company of Elite Commando’s represented by Para’s into a lab and free some rats. At first glance, the map looks like an interesting one with plenty of places to land the boats and approach the Lab. The lab area itself is like an old Roman fort with large earth banks and buildings around the edge. The three large flags are positioned at two corners and in the middle of the rear. Two are closer together than one. I decide on trying to sneak up the far side with all my force I then split into four teams. One with the Co HQ and a couple of squads and the three HMG’s to act as a diversion. The other three will storm the two flags close together. The first phase of the game is boring as it takes a long time to land the boats and get into position. My first use of boats and I discover that one you need men in them to move them and two they have to be on land for the men to dismount. There are still two boats with crew floating about the lake, which I had planned to use as a diversion. My decoy group run across a sniper and in the process of taking him out on the earth bank cause more causalities to themselves than the sniper. One squad panics (does not show as panicked) and runs for the nearest cover which is a building beyond the barbwire. These 7 men get strung up in the wire and massacred by some Germans in the buildings below. This pisses me off big time. Not only do I have my own men killing each other the AI then wipes out a 10 man Elite unit for no gain. I now know that there are several German units below but my men behind the wall on the earthwork can not fire at those below as they are just out of sight. The only way to get in LOS is to go through the wire. What a naff design. Well thinking that I have the attention of a small garrison on the right side I send my men over the wire to the top and hope that they can run through the wire before being cut to bits. I use my smoke to try and block off LOS to the buildings I expect the enemy to be in. This move costs me two HQ units, and most of my squads. My opponent had men in most of the buildings (1/2 squads) and LOS to my men in the wire. The two platoons on the far left manage after some HTH fighting dispatch the few Germans there. The reduced platoon on the right is wiped out. At this stage I lose interest in the scenario and wish to give up. The situation is absolute crap and all I can do is try and hold onto the one flag I have. This nearly gets taken from me by a good counter attack, which a gammon bomb manages to blow up the building with the attackers in. At one point one reduced squad of mine throws down its weapons while the two men left in the other squad in the building fight on. I really disliked this game as a test of skill. It was lost through bad luck and poor judgement on my behalf. I did not find the wire until it was too late to change my plan. To have won this I would have had to do one of the following. 1. Attack through the front gate where there was no wire. This was fraught with danger as my opponent had men in the only cover and would have caused massive casualties as my men were stuck in the open. This however would have been better than being stuck in the wire. 2. Charged my men over the wire in only one location. This would have meant that I might have gained a foothold in some buildings with enough of a force to make a difference. As it was by rushing three different locations close together I ended up being nailed at those three places by split squads covering the wire. My opponent knew where I was coming from sound contacts and use of his snipers. This meant I was on a hiding to nothing. Of course I am sure that some Allied players might have won this. I hope not as it will vindicate my views. My opponent found the game boring and lacked any real challenge, well that is what he said at the time. He just had to sit inside the box and make sure he moved units to where he heard the enemy approach, what skill does that take? For a game in the final this has to be one of the worst I have ever played. Even in ROW I, I had some serious choices to make and a chance of controlling my destiny. I felt cheated by this game and was bloody lucky to not have auto surrender kick in. Result a Tactical victory to the Germans. Germans 71 (20) 2 Mortars Men OK 30 Score 64 Allied 124 (32) 1 Captured 2 Vehicles Men OK 29 Score 36 H [ December 15, 2002, 05:49 PM: Message edited by: Holien ]

Congrats to all three... Now to get ready for my third attempt... As for Lab Rats... Let the debate begin... If we are allowed. H

Ali stop sniffing around here and go and play with Rudolf.... H

Hi Scott, Just read Toms comments. Yep It helps big time when you are the attacker to know exactly what the defender has and where it might be. The game is balanced by Fog of War if played blind. And god does the defender need it. My point is that in my game the attacker used his artillery poorly and my point is that if the attacker uses his artillery well then this game is a hard one for the defender to win. It is great playing it again and seeing if my view was correct. However that view can always be changed when playing different people and with luck which is ever present in the game. H

This is a tough one to win as the Russian and your only hope is that the Tigers Bog. Try and work on the supporting tanks and ignore the Tigers. If you can wipe his Infantry and MKIII's you will win. Ignore / hide from the Tigers as it is a waste of time trying to get them. H

Is today Sunday the 15th? Has Christmas come early or did he get shot down by an Uber Finn... These and more questions will be answered soon... I hope.. H

Sgt Lucky Bstrd.... Has a fan club... He He He.... See how they bay for your blood. H

Always good to hear straight from the horses mouth. You just have to smile at some people and nod knowingly. Cheers P.s. I did not get a confirmation e-mail either. Is hall dig out the order number tonight from home and e-mail BFS. H [ December 11, 2002, 09:14 AM: Message edited by: Holien ]

If James is getting a copy then I had better have one to ensure that he does not get too far ahead of me. Anyway £10 is a small price to pay and if the money (or some of it) is going to my favorite charity then I am more than happy. I see Europe will be shipping on Friday. I do hope it beats the Christmas rush. H

Hmmm I was going to say something then forgot... H