killmore

Couple of more things to add: Soviet combat units directly involved into offensive suffered 22 to 25% casualties to accomplish their objective in 1944-1945 (See Fritz Stoeckli, "Wartime casualty rates: Soviet and German loss rates during the second world war, the prize of victory) Soviets never used 7th and 8th tank armies since these were created in 1944. They were in strategic reserve. By 1944 some soviet division had effective strength of 2000.

I think that AI plays about as well as soviet commander in 1941. If you give it lots of infantry you will notice human waves attacks! It should be really good at impersonating 1941 Soviets...

You can skip the end of war figure of over 10 million losses for germans. I was suprised by that number too. Then again there was large loss of German life in the last month and obviously it includes lots of surrendering units. In this case you would need to count Soviet losses until april 1945 too. So aproximate the numbers you would get will be: Germany: 5,100,000 (over 80% east front - some claim 88%) Axis Allies: about 1,000,000? (east front) Soviet Union: 11,000,000 Soviet allies: 200,000??? So Soviet:Axis east front losses seem to be around 2:1 [ July 25, 2002, 03:32 PM: Message edited by: killmore ]

These numbers come from "When Titans clashed" David M. Glanz & Jonathan House 1995 Axis had numeric advantage 1.4:1 in 22 June 1941 on eastern front Axis continued to have numerical advantage until December 1941 By April 1945 Soviet+Allies had 3.5:1 advantage Losses - means Dead/Missing/POW Soviet losses: 11,285,057 (Note: Soviet allies losses not included but seems well under 500,000?) German losses by April 1945: 5,100,000 (by April 1945 - all fronts over 80% in the east - (see Table E)) German losses east front : 10,758,000 east front war end (page 284) Axis allies east front total: 1,725,800 (959,000 dead) (Table E) Definitly seems less that 2:1 in losses to me. [ July 25, 2002, 12:05 AM: Message edited by: killmore ]

Grisha - have you heard about the movie "Kurskaja duga". I depicts the whole battle and I recall some amazing pictures. (Like T-34s crushing into tiges)

So you can justify your forum handle.</font>

Only if you simulate exactly the way both sides behaved. I will not behave like average soviet commander. I refuse to attack with human waves over the large front. Therefore the casualty ratios will not be the same. If you force me to behave the same way as Soviet commander then what is the point of playing? I want to have a choice how to play!

I am reading Glanz book where Glans points out that there were "Political Officers" in German army too. From his point of view they were equivalent of "Commisars". And as role of commisar diminished in Soviet army, it grew in German Army. Is this correct?

I do. Great link!

Yeah, "volunteers"... I think "volunteering" into GrossD was described in "Forgotten Soldier"... It was something like: "Ok - you have just volunteered!"

I am sure someone will ask whether the numbers include civilians? And why are these only German numbers? What about Hungarians trapped in Budapest? The german accounts list total of 18 million Soviet civilians killed by Germans. (If memory serves me right - yes I can find the source but I am too lazy) [ July 18, 2002, 09:40 PM: Message edited by: killmore ]

This is one of the most ridiculous statements I've EVER read on this board!</font>

Magical 10:1 soviet losses are making frequent reapperance here. In terms of CMBO losses of 2:1 conscript with light tanks vs veterans with medium tanks seem quite reasonable. This was a situation at the begining of the war. I don't want BTS to penalize Soviet squads just because they were Soviet. We don't have to reproduce these losses in the game because our tactics will not be the same. There is not way I am attacking in human wave over 2 kilometer wide front. If at all I would concentrate my attacks on very small area to achieve break through. Lots of Soviet units surendered without much fighting too in 1941 these are still counted as casualties. I "believe" that Soviet vs Axis losses were about 5:2 in total. Notice that is AXIS not just GERMAN. (Common mistake!) That is fairly good considering how unprepared Soviet Union was and that conscripts were fighting veterans...

You guys are simply spies and traitors! (I am joking of course!) (I don't even have an account there) [ July 17, 2002, 10:40 PM: Message edited by: killmore ]

People on unmentionable here forum keep thinking that in CMBB there will be 5 soldiers shown per squad instead of 3 in CMBO. Is this true?

Thanks for a great web page - I got couple of songs not mentioned here. apiotrow@san.rr.com if you want them

Http://www.battlefront.com/products/cmbb/press.html As seen above: ...Unique Turn / Real time hybrid system... Does CMBB have real-time mode option or is it a "politically correct" term for CMBO like game play?

I still don't like reverse "R"

I just remembered my Polish grandmother story. She asked Soviet soldiers why it says USA on their jeep. Why this is abreviation of course: "Ubijem Sukinsyna Adolfa" (Translation: "Kill Son-of-a-bitch Adolf")

They had tons of jeeps. Jeeps came from USA. Even in soviet moviet they show they driving american jeeps.

No way it should be "Vstavaj strana narodnaya" I got am MP3 if you want it.

Who were "Normandie Niemen"? (Pardon my ignorance)

I can't be positive about this, but I don't recall any actual British combat units deployed to the Soviet Union. They did send a fair number of combat aircraft, including Spitfires and Hurricanes, and usually sent various maintainence crews and pilots with them to teach the Russians how to use the equipment. Some of the British pilots flew combat missions as well. That may well account for reports of British fighter squadrons in Russia. QB]</font>

Actually there was a british fighter squadron in Soviet Union!

Where is Fionn when you need him?