Red Orchestra Thread Reborn

[MeatEtr]

..for the new forums. I know interest for the game has thinned out over the years. But I just wanted to send a heads-up that there is a new 1.1 patch for the Darkest Hour mod. Theres been lots of changes/fixes/tweaks and new maps. I've only been able to play the new version for a few hours, but theres some definite improvements. Certainly worth checking out again since we all know their first release was pretty rocky.

Check out the details here. <--- download links there too.

Btw gautrek, how does the patch work for you? IIRC you were having trouble getting the mod to work.

[Spanish Bombs]

I held off on Darkest Hour when I heard the initial reviews. I've been playing some lately, though - toying around with the ISU-152 which is fun to shoot, but tough to aim and slow to reload.

[Elmar Bijlsma]

Are we talking about the same thing? Isn't Darkest Hours a westfront mod?

Wasn't too big a fan of the mod on release. Most maps I tried just didn't play well at all. I'll give it another go. Thanks!

[benpark]

Darkest Hour seems to be running quite a bit better now. Some of the brand new maps included with the new patch seem buggy, but the original ones are much better.

As for RO:Ost, people seem to want to keep playing the same old maps. There are some great custom ones (the Berlin ones fer example), but every time I look it's Danzig again on most servers.

[MeatEtr]

Darkest Hour seems to be running quite a bit better now. Some of the brand new maps included with the new patch seem buggy, but the original ones are much better.

As for RO:Ost, people seem to want to keep playing the same old maps. There are some great custom ones (the Berlin ones fer example), but every time I look it's Danzig again on most servers.

Yeah it seems as they cycle in new maps the older ones get much approved. As far as I know, the mod team doesn't have a big test team, so what gets released tends to be pretty buggy.

You would think people would get sick and tired of Arad and Danzig by now. But nope, the 24/7 servers seem be to always full. One custom map I loved and was a fan fav that goes back to the mod days was Koitos. Surprised that never got converted to ROOST.

[Spanish Bombs]

I should been more clear above, but I've been playing with the ISU-152 on the Arad Real Forest server. Sometimes I have to wait to get on that server, but its always fun once I get in.

[Coaxial_Puppet]

We should get a list of names out. I know it was in the last thread.

I started playing again.

Im surprise:

Coaxial_Puppet.

Darkest Hour is either hit or miss with me each day. I've had a couple of real intense moments on a few maps.

But I usually stick to ROOST

[Voodoochile]

I'll chime in!

Started playing 3 months ago. Never was a fan of FPS's, but this is an entirely diffrent thing!

I'm Zappateer over at the servers by the way.

Any of you ever tried joining this? -- http://www.ironcrescendo.net

Campaign 6 is about to start in 2 weeks. Also, instead of playing out the whole Eastern Front, this time the campaign will only focus on Stalingrad.

[Guest Panzer Boxb]

One of these days I will actually get back to playing this.

[MeatEtr]

I'll chime in!

Started playing 3 months ago. Never was a fan of FPS's, but this is an entirely diffrent thing!

I'm Zappateer over at the servers by the way.

Any of you ever tried joining this? -- http://www.ironcrescendo.net

Campaign 6 is about to start in 2 weeks. Also, instead of playing out the whole Eastern Front, this time the campaign will only focus on Stalingrad.

Oh yeah, I signed up on that website a few years ago or whenever they started it, but I forgot all about it. I did play in a league(forgot what it was) way back in the mod days. IIRC this iron crescendo tourney is similar to that one which is great for more casual players, no hassles like with clans. Definitely gonna check it out again though.

[MeatEtr]

Bumping it up, they just released a patch the other day. So, anybody try out the new "Fallen Heroes" map yet? I haven't DLed it on my new PC yet. Also haven't played RO in several months. I wish they would announce what their next project is, or have they and I missed it?

For anybody interested in the game, there's a weekend sale which is being offered for 66% off until Monday.

Here's a complete list of the Steam achievements they added:

• Knight's Cross: Win a match on every Official map as a German.
  
• Hero of the Soviet Union: Win a match on every Official map as a Russian
  
• Whack-a-Mole: for killing tank commanders with his head out of the turret hatch.
  
• Excellent Marksman: for long-range kills with a bolt-action rifle.
  
• Excellent Tank Gunner: for long-range tank kills with your tank's main gun
  
• Off the Tracks: Knock out the tracks on enemy tanks.
  
• Achtung Faust: Destroy 3 enemy tanks as a German Pak-Soldat with panzerfausts, without dying.
  
• Tankista: Destroy 3 enemy tanks as a Russian PT-Soldat with the PTRD, without dying.
  
• Buzz-saw: for kills with the light machine-gun.
  
• Tiger Tamer: Kill a German Tiger tank from a T-34 76.
  
• Turkey Shoot: Rack up 25 enemy tank kills from your own tank in a single match.
  
• Up Close and Personal: for melee combat kills
  
• It's Raining Men: Obliterate 10 enemy infantry using only tank shells, without dying
  
• Johnny on the Spot: for resupplying machine-gunners.
  
• Tiger: for multiple enemy vehicle kills in one life from the German Tiger tank.
  
• Excellent Sniper: for sniper kills.
  
• Countersniper: While playing as a sniper, kill an enemy sniper
  
• Blood Rage: Kill 10 enemies as an assault class, without dying
  
• Divine Wrath: Kill 10 enemy players in one Artillery barrage
  
• The Ultimate Hero: Survive a whole round, without dying even once, while capping all the objectives!
  
• Glorious Leader: As Soviet Squad Leader, win the map, ensuring that you are in every objective capped.
  
• Vasily Lives: As a normal soldier, pick up an ENEMY sniper rifle and get 10 kills before dying.
  
• Toaster: Destroy an enemy Universal Carrier or halftrack with a full load of passengers.

By the huge amount of playtime I've sunk into this game, I probably would completed all of these a long ago.

(shrugs shoulders)

[akd]

Fallen Heroes is a pretty fun map. One of the very few I've had fun playing as an MG'er.

[gautrek]

What is the point of Achievements.The only game i have tried that had them was L4D and i got bored trying to get them within about a week.I'm not a console gamer and don't need artificial reasons to keep trying.

[MeatEtr]

What is the point of Achievements.The only game i have tried that had them was L4D and i got bored trying to get them within about a week.I'm not a console gamer and don't need artificial reasons to keep trying.

Well, some love them, some just don't care, I'm somewhere in the middle. It certainly can't hurt having a layer of stats, even though it's still no full stat tracking, but still this will do.

Actually for RO, I think some of them are interesting and could be fun and tough to go after. Especially that "Vasily Lives" one, pick up a enemy sniper rifle and get 10 kills would be hard.

That Toaster one would be tough as well, heck you'd probably need server cooperation for that one. It's very rare to bag a HT or carrier that's fully loaded.

[MeatEtr]

Wow, here's a shocker, Tripwire Interactives next game is "Killing Floor", a first-person co-op survival horror game. Details here.

I think the whole RO community was assuming their free Unreal engine license would be used for some kind of a sequel. Now I understand if they want to branch out and try new stuff, but they've already got a nice community surrounding RO. But I heard they've hinted at two games in the works, so all bets are on the other one being RO 2. I sure hope so, RO is their bread ticket.

[MeatEtr]

Forgot about this thread, resurrected from forum death. IIRC it was a continuation thread from two previously filled threads dating back to around CMBB launch time. (original RO mod in beta)

Anyways, PC Gamer recently posted their preview article on RO2. Check it out here!

The campaign mode sounds interesting, reminds me of the operation/campaign tournaments from the old mod days. Here's a bit from the preview:

a 10-map mini-war where Germans and Russians attack and defend to capture and hold territory, or whittle down each other’s army count (your total deaths as a team is subtracted from an overall number—you’ll lose more if you’re on the attacking side). It’s like playing a Risk metagame between rounds.

[JoMac]

I also still play RO for the fun of it.

However, I hope they find a way to reduce the casuaties ( by 10x ) a bit, and make RO2 more of a realistic WWII FPS simulation rather then another face-paced killing game.

Joe

[Other Means]

That’s sparked my interest again. TBH I've never got on with the Unreal engine, it’s always felt a bit unnatural to me. I think if it used the HL2 engine I'd be on it 24/7. Still – worth giving a go I think.

[JoMac]

Casualties in most WWII skirmish battles were relatively low ( both sides firing and moving in cover at moderate to close ranges ), and added up when time went by.

However, there were times when an attempt was made to clear a room or charge an enemy position, then casualites would double or triple quickly.

To put it in perspective, on average it took 1,000 rounds of automatic small arms ( most of it used for suppression fire ), or 100rounds of bolt-rifle to KO one person.

Basically, a person in a combat situation might be lucky to hit one person using half or all his ammo before the battle has ended.

Ex 1; A german Infantry Squad on defense is held up in a building, and attacked by a Platoon of Russian Infantry. In a quick 5 minute encounter, the Germans loose half their squad ( 1 man lost per minute of combat ), and the Russians half their Platoon ( 2 to 3 men per Minute ) before falling back and attacking again 15 minutes to an hour later ( Campaign in RO2 ? ).

Ex 2; A Meeting Engagement between a German and Russian Infantry Platoon. In a quick 15 minute combat, both sides take about 50% casualties ( 2 men lost per side per minute of combat ) before one side or the other takes the objective.

I always thought casualties in RO were very high ( about 10x higher compared to RL ), and have figured out some of the reasons why below.

- Players do what they want, whenever they want in a hurry to beat the clock. Also, players figure when they die they will just re-spawn over and over again, and think nothing of it.

- The game engine makes for unnatural movement, especially when troops are making slight adjustments even when stationary, along with bright uniforms ( w/ faces and hands ) making it easier to be seen.

- There is no Moral System or Suppression for individual Players and up to Platoon. Players are not forced to make a decision to either fall back or advance when under heavy suppression fire, or

taking heavy casualties ( this also goes back to the first one above ).

- Its far to easy to hit with small arms, ( and especially with MGs ), because how the game engine handles small arms combat.

- I wont even touch how Armor and the ballistics were handled.

I always thought it was stupid when an JS2 hits a halftrack and just bounces off, or when an armored car rams a tank in attempt to tip it over and is successful.

- There are people that simply cheat with Code breaking, Aim-bots, etc all in an attempt to live longer while killing the enemy with one shot one hit kills.

I just hope many of the above have been addressed in RO2 ( including the newer engine )making it more of a Realistic WWII FPS Simulation rather then just another shoot-em up click fest game.

However, in saying the above I predict RO2 to be only 50% realistic as opposed to the original RO being about 25% realistic.

Joe

[JoMac]

Hmmm, I have also noticed what appears to be an MP43/44 in the top picture showing a Conveyer Belt. I just hope they dont add this weapons in RO2 HoS ( June 42/Feb 43 ) as it hasen’t been introduced until Spring 44 ( under developement in mid 43 ).

On the other hand, it actually may be a good idea to include all weapons & most armor introduced in Eastfront 41-45 into RO2, this because, Modders ( weapons & uniforms ) & Scenario makers can now play any battles ( maps ) in Ostfront 41 to 45 ( just like in RO ).

This can be ultimately included in future patches, mods, etc…Just a thought.

[MeatEtr]

I don't understand the point in comparing real WWII cas rates with a videogame. How is a game developer suppose to make people play as if their real life is on the line? It's simply not possible. Which is the main reason why a game will never accurately reflect cas rates from a real war.

Also, who would want to play a game that is more about brief recon-to-contact skirmishes with a lot of falling back? Sure this type of action was far more common than assaults, but also less fun for players of a videogame.

- There is no Moral System or Suppression for individual Players and up to Platoon. Players are not forced to make a decision to either fall back or advance when under heavy suppression fire, or

taking heavy casualties

In RO now there is a kinda jarring, screen shake, or screen blur to give the player more of a feeling of being suppressed. But I think overall a morale/suppression system is more psychological. So again, hard to do when no real lives are on the line.

- Its far to easy to hit with small arms, ( and especially with MGs ), because how the game engine handles small arms combat.

Completely disagree with you on this. The number one complaint by new players is that it's too hard to hit your mark. Grant it, you probably like I have, become a master with the bolt rifles. But it can still be very difficult to a hit a moving target at range. Out of all the games I've played the small arms modeling in RO is the most rewarding since it required lots of practice. At least much more than the typical run & gun shooter.

[noxnoctum]

Just so you all know they're working on some kind of suppression effect similar to DH's and Project Reality's (i.e. more powerful than RO:Ost's ineffective suppression system...:

It makes it at least LOOK like player's value their avatars' life. Still of course, people take far more risks than they would in RL.

[Elmar Bijlsma]

I liked RO's tank combat aspect the most. And while the mechanics for that seem to have improved, the vehicle line up is totally inadequate.

[noxnoctum]

If you'd read about how many months it took to model each of those two tanks you'd be a bit more understanding. Personally I'd rather have two extremely well modeled tanks followed by two more and two APCs after release (they've stated this) than a host of poorly modeled ones.

As a self-proclaimed "tanker" I don't see how you can't see this.

Quality > Quantity. RO1's tank combat was honestly a joke. It was great fun in CA. But tank on tank... not so much. Now it's practically a tank simulator... along with the whole "infantry thing".

[noxnoctum]

Hmmm, I have also noticed what appears to be an MP43/44 in the top picture showing a Conveyer Belt. I just hope they dont add this weapons in RO2 HoS ( June 42/Feb 43 ) as it hasen’t been introduced until Spring 44 ( under developement in mid 43 ).

On the other hand, it actually may be a good idea to include all weapons & most armor introduced in Eastfront 41-45 into RO2, this because, Modders ( weapons & uniforms ) & Scenario makers can now play any battles ( maps ) in Ostfront 41 to 45 ( just like in RO ).

This can be ultimately included in future patches, mods, etc…Just a thought.

It's the MKb 42 not the the STG/MP44/MP43. The prototype if you will for the STG. They were at Stalingrad. In tiny numbers, but it gives the devs the chance to include another cool new weapon. (they will be very rare btw, like 1 per map or something)

As for your issues with infantry combat, like I said above, they will have a much stronger suppression effect that will at least make it LOOK like players value their lives. It's impossible to put fear of death into an FPS... even people in a 4 hour long co-op session of ARMA2 with no respawn don't play as if their lives were on the line. PR and DH are the only games where I've seen people even remotely act like they were scared of getting shot (though of course you still see plenty of "heroics"---i.e. suicidal attacks on tanks with satchels are very common).

And like MeatEtr said... don't know what you're talking about when it comes to small arms. They're about 10x more challenging to learn than any other FPS. Even after 4 years, I still get the lead off and miss running targets sometimes when they're a decent distance away. The main problem is "pop up bolting"... whereby you can sight in on an MG, crouch when he shoots at you, then pop up and have your sights on the exact same spot and kill him, but TWI have plans to fix this. (probably just by making the sight be in a slightly different spot when you come back up) And like the man said, no one wants to play some boring recon mission, just like no one wants to play a "polish your shoes, straighten your bed and uniform, and clean the mess hall" military simulator.