Dismounting and movement orders

[Georgie]

This applies only to a jeep without an assigned driver where a single icon appears for the occupants of the jeep. I can not find a method to order a jeep to move to a location and then for the occupants to dismount and proceed to another destination in a single turn. I have no problem doing this with a jeep which has an assigned driver where there is an icon for the driver and another icon for the passengers. Is there something that I am not doing correctly or is this the way it's supposed to work?

[womble]

I think you're correct that you can't dismount and move a driver in the same turn as they drive. Dismount happens at the point it's issued, not associated with any waypoint.

[Oddball_E8]

This is just one of the things that make me feel like BFC are trying to force people to play RT instead of WeGo (yes, that might not be true, but it sure feels like it)

[Black Jack Pershing III]

Another odd one is that you cannot order a unit to dismount or otherwise exit a vehicle and deploy its mg/mortar in the same turn, at least not AFAICT.

[MengJiao]

Another odd one is that you cannot order a unit to dismount or otherwise exit a vehicle and deploy its mg/mortar in the same turn, at least not AFAICT.

Wow. In RT, that all happens pretty fast. Stop. Dismount. Deploy. Takes about 10 seconds.

[Wego McPbem]

I'm pretty sure you can do that, you just have to do it by highlighting the waypoint where you want it deployed, then giving the order. Had me stumped for a while too.

[slysniper]

This is just one of the things that make me feel like BFC are trying to force people to play RT instead of WeGo (yes, that might not be true, but it sure feels like it)

THAT IS BECAUSE THE CMx2 ENGINE WAS DESIGNED WITH REAL TIME IN MIND.

If you can remember, when it first came out, Wego was no longer even in the system. but so many complained, it was back in very shortly. but the design was based apon realtime concepts.

[YankeeDog]

THAT IS BECAUSE THE CMx2 ENGINE WAS DESIGNED WITH REAL TIME IN MIND.

If you can remember, when it first came out, Wego was no longer even in the system. but so many complained, it was back in very shortly. but the design was based apon realtime concepts.

Draw whatever conclusions you like about BFC's design philosophy regarding RT vs. WEGO, but let's not go rewriting history here... WEGO has been a part of CMx2 since details of the the engine were first released to the public, prior to the 2007 release of CMSF. To the best of my knowledge, BFC NEVER publicly announced any plans to release a CMx2 game without a WEGO option.

[bodkin]

THAT IS BECAUSE THE CMx2 ENGINE WAS DESIGNED WITH REAL TIME IN MIND.

If you can remember, when it first came out, Wego was no longer even in the system. but so many complained, it was back in very shortly. but the design was based apon realtime concepts.

WEGO was always in CMSF, it was the 'blue bar' that was missing.

The one unfortunate side effect of giving the players/designers the choice of RT or WEGO is that I believe it has caused a subtle split in the community.

Some scenarios are being designed and tested primarily for RT style play with it's instant control over units. In CMSF and now in CMBN I've often found when WEGO players are struggling with one of these missions some RT player will claim they got a Total Victory.

I'm thinking a minute of not being able to control your units is a bit too long with the more complex CMx2 engine and the nasty surprises it can bring. One day I hope we're all singing off the same songsheet again, with a comprimise of the two systems, e.g. realtime that can be paused at any time and the last 20 seconds of action replayed.

[slysniper]

Draw whatever conclusions you like about BFC's design philosophy regarding RT vs. WEGO, but let's not go rewriting history here... WEGO has been a part of CMx2 since details of the the engine were first released to the public, prior to the 2007 release of CMSF. To the best of my knowledge, BFC NEVER publicly announced any plans to release a CMx2 game without a WEGO option.

Ok, maybe my memory serves me wrong, but I sure recall Wego being discussed as not part of the system, that would take some searching in the old files to find something on that. But the concept did not last long.

[Oddball_E8]

THAT IS BECAUSE THE CMx2 ENGINE WAS DESIGNED WITH REAL TIME IN MIND.

If you can remember, when it first came out, Wego was no longer even in the system. but so many complained, it was back in very shortly. but the design was based apon realtime concepts.

so what? even IF they did design it for RT, and there was such a huge outcry for WeGo that they had to implement it, id say they have had time enough to change things so they work in WeGo as well as RT.

half-arsing it is just not good enough.

[Erik Springelkamp]

Ok, maybe my memory serves me wrong, but I sure recall Wego being discussed as not part of the system, that would take some searching in the old files to find something on that. But the concept did not last long.

PBEM has been in doubt for a while during the development phase.

Not WEGO against the AI.

[womble]

...half-arsing it is just not good enough.

Every change requires work. By Steve's own admission, there is a very very long list of "things that could be better". By extrapolation, your attitude would say the game is a worthless heap of half-assery. How much longer would you have liked to wait before they released the "perfect" game? 5 years? 10?

[ChrisND]

Some scenarios are being designed and tested primarily for RT style play with it's instant control over units. In CMSF and now in CMBN I've often found when WEGO players are struggling with one of these missions some RT player will claim they got a Total Victory.

Evidence please? I've been intimately involved in CMBN's playtesting and I think that statement is a load of bollocks. I've seen this canard repeated too many times and I'm getting sick of it. Real Time is not polluting our previous bodily fluids.

It's entirely possible that some people involved in development are primarily real time players and may have inadvertently created scenarios that play better in real time. I don't think it likely however, considering that reporting bugs generally requires you to play WEGO in order to get save game files where you can see the bug in action - kinda hard to do in RT.

[Oddball_E8]

Every change requires work. By Steve's own admission, there is a very very long list of "things that could be better". By extrapolation, your attitude would say the game is a worthless heap of half-assery. How much longer would you have liked to wait before they released the "perfect" game? 5 years? 10?

oh i dont know... the engine has been out for 4 years already, and these RT vs WeGo problems have been known for almost the same amount of time.

id say four years of development without any improvements on these points goes to show they are not even slightly prioritized.

and just because i think parts of this game are not well done doesnt mean the whole game is half arsed... dont take my comments out of context.

[Oddball_E8]

Evidence please? I've been intimately involved in CMBN's playtesting and I think that statement is a load of bollocks. I've seen this canard repeated too many times and I'm getting sick of it. Real Time is not polluting our previous bodily fluids.

It's entirely possible that some people involved in development are primarily real time players and may have inadvertently created scenarios that play better in real time. I don't think it likely however, considering that reporting bugs generally requires you to play WEGO in order to get save game files where you can see the bug in action - kinda hard to do in RT.

I think he is refering to user-made scenarios.

[womble]

oh i dont know... the engine has been out for 4 years already, and these RT vs WeGo problems have been known for almost the same amount of time.

id say four years of development without any improvements on these points goes to show they are not even slightly prioritized.

and just because i think parts of this game are not well done doesnt mean the whole game is half arsed... dont take my comments out of context.

So where do you draw the line? The 4 years have been spent developing new content and the new functionality needed for the temparate setting. You're right that the "dismount" commands haven't been made to be bound to waypoints, it's certainly low priority. What feature would you have them leave out to spend the time sorting it? Never mind: you nor I know anything about what it would take to change the engine in that way, nor what anything else took to make. That is the context in which your comments are made, whether you intended it or not.

For my money, if they'd had the time to fix 'dismount' etc to waypoints, I'd rather they spent it on a whole bunch of other things first. You disagree with BFC's priorities. Hell, I disagree with their priorities: the frackin' interface for one. Blowing it up into a "RT vs WEGO" schism is just paranoia.

[sburke]

Maybe it's me but I find it somewhat depressing to hear comments about how much CMBN is lacking. I don't know if it is a generational issue, a personality issue, temperment or what. However having been around from the very early board games I think it is quite astounding what we have access to from such a small shop that is BFC. Frankly there is nothing else out there on the market that I find anywhere near as satisfying for the scale and when I watch the bug issues that much larger firms have with much "simpler" type games I am freakin amazed at how polished CM is by comparison.

There is always going to be that - wouldn't it be cool if we could add.....syndrome, but if BFC stopped right now and retired to that Villa in Italy, France or wherever Charles and Steve are investing their billions ( ) I would still be quite amazed with what we have.

[YankeeDog]

Ok, maybe my memory serves me wrong, but I sure recall Wego being discussed as not part of the system, that would take some searching in the old files to find something on that. But the concept did not last long.

I do suspect you're confusing the inclusion of PBEM with the inclusion of WEGO. WEGO was always part of the plan for CMx2 (or, at the least, the decision to include both WEGO and RT options in CMx2 was made before BFC ever publicly discussed any details of the new engine).

However, long prior to the release of CMSF, BFC did make some comments that they weren't sure if they were going to be able to have a PBEM option in the initial release of CMx2; file size being one of the big challenges. There was a lot of very passionate advocacy for PBEM here of the forums, and it ended up being in the initial release of CMSF.

Bear in mind that filing sharing services like Dropbox were just becoming popular back then, and internet connections were generally significantly slower. In many ways, the problem of large file exchanges for PBEM was fixed by things external to the game itself.

[slysniper]

Maybe it's me but I find it somewhat depressing to hear comments about how much CMBN is lacking. I don't know if it is a generational issue, a personality issue, temperment or what. However having been around from the very early board games I think it is quite astounding what we have access to from such a small shop that is BFC. Frankly there is nothing else out there on the market that I find anywhere near as satisfying for the scale and when I watch the bug issues that much larger firms have with much "simpler" type games I am freakin amazed at how polished CM is by comparison.

There is always going to be that - wouldn't it be cool if we could add.....syndrome, but if BFC stopped right now and retired to that Villa in Italy, France or wherever Charles and Steve are investing their billions ( ) I would still be quite amazed with what we have.

Boy, do I agree with this 100%.

It seems like there is so much more complaining than there was back in the earlier days. Now, many demand, thinking the game needs to be perfect.

It is a nice dream, but they sure do not seem to appreciate what they have. This game is by far, leap years ahead of any other war sim on any level as far as I am concerned, issues oh yes, but a little respect and a better attitude would be nice when you comment about changes that would be nice to see.

In general, I am amazed how battlefront has handled themselves all these years, they really have gone above the "call of duty" to provide the quility game they have and not just tell everyone to go shove it.

[slysniper]

I do suspect you're confusing the inclusion of PBEM with the inclusion of WEGO. WEGO was always part of the plan for CMx2 (or, at the least, the decision to include both WEGO and RT options in CMx2 was made before BFC ever publicly discussed any details of the new engine).

However, long prior to the release of CMSF, BFC did make some comments that they weren't sure if they were going to be able to have a PBEM option in the initial release of CMx2; file size being one of the big challenges. There was a lot of very passionate advocacy for PBEM here of the forums, and it ended up being in the initial release of CMSF.

Bear in mind that filing sharing services like Dropbox were just becoming popular back then, and internet connections were generally significantly slower. In many ways, the problem of large file exchanges for PBEM was fixed by things external to the game itself.

Ok,OK, maybe my age is showing, things are getting more foggy all the time as to how I remember things. So Wego was always there, lets get that straight.

[bodkin]

Evidence please? I've been intimately involved in CMBN's playtesting and I think that statement is a load of bollocks. I've seen this canard repeated too many times and I'm getting sick of it. Real Time is not polluting our previous bodily fluids.

It's entirely possible that some people involved in development are primarily real time players and may have inadvertently created scenarios that play better in real time. I don't think it likely however, considering that reporting bugs generally requires you to play WEGO in order to get save game files where you can see the bug in action - kinda hard to do in RT.

Gee a bit defensive, anyway there are missions in 'Road to Montenbourg' and 'Courage and Fortititude' that are definately harder in WEGO, try playing 'School of Hard Knocks' in WEGO and look at the help thread on 'Courage and Fortitude' on that mission the best advice is all about hitting pause and changing orders instantly.

"It's entirely possible that some people involved in development are primarily real time players and may have inadvertently created scenarios that play better in real time."

This is the point I was trying to make maybe I should have not said they were created to be that way on purpose but the end result is the same.