Help Please with Busting the Bocage

[GerryCMBB]

Hello:

Main problem I have is trying to use the mortars. In this bocage coutryside it is hard for observers to get a LOS. They seem to just be able to see to the next hedgerow. This requires moving the leaders up front and I don't know if that happened in WW II? But even up front, as I said, their LOS seems restricted to the next hedgerow.

Also after getting to the second rows or so or hedgerows I am having another difficulty. The enemy show up as contacts (playing Veteran) but even when near them they seem to stay as contacts. They are in bocage so I assume they are hiding in there?

Also I have a few squads and tanks on a hedgerow hitting the forces opposite and somehow that does not seem to be enough firepower to drive them back. Don't know what I am doing wrong here. It seems I have overwhelming numbers and firepower.

Thanks in advance,

Gerry

[Broken]

Hello:

Main problem I have is trying to use the mortars. In this bocage coutryside it is hard for observers to get a LOS. They seem to just be able to see to the next hedgerow. This requires moving the leaders up front and I don't know if that happened in WW II? But even up front, as I said, their LOS seems restricted to the next hedgerow.

Also after getting to the second rows or so or hedgerows I am having another difficulty. The enemy show up as contacts (playing Veteran) but even when near them they seem to stay as contacts. They are in bocage so I assume they are hiding in there?

Also I have a few squads and tanks on a hedgerow hitting the forces opposite and somehow that does not seem to be enough firepower to drive them back. Don't know what I am doing wrong here. It seems I have overwhelming numbers and firepower.

Thanks in advance,

Gerry

Finding good LOS for your spotters is a challenge in this scenario. Are you familiar with how to check LOS from points where you currently have no units? Place a Move waypoint at the point you want to test, highlight that waypoint by clicking on it, and then select the target command. The target line will now indicate the LOS from the new waypoint, not the current unit location. This way, you can find a location where your spotter will see the target you want to hit with your artillery/mortars.

Don't forget to delete your test waypoints or you may have some unpleasant experiences.

[Che]

I must be doing something wrong ... highlighting the waypoint then using target just gives me the LOS from where the unit sits - not from the waypoint.

[GerryCMBB]

I believe that even though the target line emanates from the unit, it actually is reporting on LOS from the waypoint.

Gerry

I must be doing something wrong ... highlighting the waypoint then using target just gives me the LOS from where the unit sits - not from the waypoint.

[mjkerner]

Che, although the blue line originates from the unit's location, it is calculated from the waypoint. I don't know why that is, but it is.

[Che]

Thanks guys. If I had looked more closely at the LOS line ... really dumb on my part.

[Rocky Balboa]

You may also find that your 60mm mortars are more effective in this scenario using direct sighting instead of indirect.

Suppress the enemy hedgerows as much as possible with tanks and infantry, then move your mortars up to your hedgerow and let them fire directly at the opposite hedge.

[womble]

You may also find that your 60mm mortars are more effective in this scenario using direct sighting instead of indirect.

Suppress the enemy hedgerows as much as possible with tanks and infantry, then move your mortars up to your hedgerow and let them fire directly at the opposite hedge.

IIRC, you can fire 'slightly' out of LOS with 'direct lay' mortar fire. I'm pretty sure that means you can area fire behind a bocage row that you can see the front of. I vaguely remember gaining the impression (possibly incorrect) that you can fire from just one action spot shy of one row to one action spot past the one you could see if you were up against the row you're behind.

[Rocky Balboa]

IIRC, you can fire 'slightly' out of LOS with 'direct lay' mortar fire. I'm pretty sure that means you can area fire behind a bocage row that you can see the front of. I vaguely remember gaining the impression (possibly incorrect) that you can fire from just one action spot shy of one row to one action spot past the one you could see if you were up against the row you're behind.

This may be the way area fire with mortars work but if you have targets then there is no need for area fire. A good German hedgerow defense will normally include some dug in MG's which can make it difficult for Infantry to acquire fire superiority. The direct fire mortar is excellent for dealing with this.

I normally hold them back behind the PLT until the MG's open up and are spotted. I then move the mortar up so he can direct fire on the MG's. The MG's are normally too busy shooting at the doggies to notice the mortar setting up and the next thing you know he's got a major headache to deal with. Tanks are also useful in this way as well.

[Pak40]

Hello:

Main problem I have is trying to use the mortars. In this bocage coutryside it is hard for observers to get a LOS. They seem to just be able to see to the next hedgerow. This requires moving the leaders up front and I don't know if that happened in WW II? But even up front, as I said, their LOS seems restricted to the next hedgerow.

Ironically I just read a passage in a book on Normandy that talked about this very problem. Spotters had trouble spotting the rounds or were too close use the heavy stuff. It seems that CMBN is dead on historically accurate most of the time .

60mm mortars can be used in direct fire mode as others have stated. Just be sure that the enemy is suppressed.

Also after getting to the second rows or so or hedgerows I am having another difficulty. The enemy show up as contacts (playing Veteran) but even when near them they seem to stay as contacts. They are in bocage so I assume they are hiding in there?

This is part of the fog of war (relative spotting). Each squad/unit has the ability to spot an enemy unit. If a squad loses contact with a unit then a ? will appear. Sometimes those ? stick around even if another one of your squads is still on top of the ? and has confirmed that the enemy ? is either dead or has left the area. In other words, your original squad that generated the ? has to confirm for themselves that the ? is either dead or has moved.

Also I have a few squads and tanks on a hedgerow hitting the forces opposite and somehow that does not seem to be enough firepower to drive them back. Don't know what I am doing wrong here. It seems I have overwhelming numbers and firepower.

Gerry

If you have this sort of overwhelming firepower you are, more often than not, doing serious damage to the enemy. FOW will prevent you from knowing exactly how much. Often I have thought the same thing as you and when I finally get the balls to send my troops across the field I discover that most of the enemy is dead, wounded, or suppressed. However, there are still times where I misjudge things and have lost lots of men.

[Jarink]

I've tried playing this scenario only a couple of times, but what worked best for me was to just absolutely pummel one small section of hedgerow at a time with offboard arty followed by tank direct fire or direct fire 60mm mortars. Pop some scout sections out on the flanks to ID any neighboring survivors and follow through the gap with my main force. Don't try taking an entire field at once. Take only half of it, flank the survivors and rout them. Use adjoining hedgerows to your advantage to isolate the battlefield!

[GerryCMBB]

Thanks for the great insights and tips everyone.

Gerry

[Broken]

Don't try taking an entire field at once. Take only half of it, flank the survivors and rout them. Use adjoining hedgerows to your advantage to isolate the battlefield!

This was my approach. Advance up one side of the road only. I chose the left side, but the right side probably works just as well.

[LemuelG]

The bocage will soak most of the bullets you fire at them, while the bullets they fire at you will be unimpeded.

The best way to play is to constantly scheme on shooting your enemies in the butt; it sounds flip, but this is the true path to success.