New series of classified documents released via Wikileaks on war in Afghanistan

[Homo ferricus]

Not sure if anybody else caught this, but it would seem like it's a pretty big deal. Wikileaks recently released a bunch of classified documents about the war in Afghanistan 04-09. Interesting material includes:

The Taliban have used portable heat-seeking missiles against allied aircraft, a fact that has not been publicly disclosed by the military...

Secret commando units like Task Force 373 — a classified group of Army and Navy special operatives — work from a “capture/kill list” of about 70 top insurgent commanders. These missions, which have been stepped up under the Obama administration, claim notable successes, but have sometimes gone wrong, killing civilians and stoking Afghan resentment.

and even references to what Intel has been gathered on Osama Bin Laden.

In some reports he is said to be attending meetings in Quetta, Pakistan. His money man is said to be flying from Iran to North Korea to buy weapons. Mr. bin Laden has supposedly ordered a suicide attack against the Afghan president, Hamid Karzai.

but not much

In any case, there are links to the classified military documents that were leaked in the article. It was an interesting read to me and no doubt it will be to others who find themselves following the war closely.

[hcrof]

I get the feeling that the media is trying to blow this one up out of proportion. To be fair, the fact that so much classified information was leaked is shocking but the content is not.

Having studied the Afghan war pretty closely for a civilian with no professional interest in the matter I am not surprised about any of this. It has long been speculated that the Taliban has a few primitive or out of date MANPADS due to to indicators such as the extensive use of flares by aircraft as well as rumours that helicopters have been hit by missiles. (Wasn't a MI-17 supplying a US base destroyed by one?)

Likewise I thought it was well known that NATO was using SF assassination squads against key targets (especially Al Quaeda), its just now that some of them has been given a name.

As for the idea that Al Quaeda is getting weapons from the Iranians I would take that with a healthy dose of scepticism. Al Quaeda (and the Taliban for that matter) hate the Shia Iranian clerics possibly even more than they hate the west. If Iran was giving them weapons they would be playing a risky game indeed!

The final revelation was that the Afghan war is a messy conflict that was badly mismanaged for years (until as late as 2008 IMO). Well that is no surprise either!

So yeah, I would say that the real story is the fact that 90000 restricted documents were leaked but the actual information is not going to redefine anyone's view of the war. As for the comments by wikileaks that it was comparable to the opening of the archives of the Stasi, that is just wrong.

[Elmar Bijlsma]

I'm with hcrof.

Much ado about nothing. So far no great surprise for me, at least.

[Boeman]

As for the idea that Al Quaeda is getting weapons from the Iranians I would take that with a healthy dose of scepticism. Al Quaeda (and the Taliban for that matter) hate the Shia Iranian clerics possibly even more than they hate the west. If Iran was giving them weapons they would be playing a risky game indeed!

Human nature throughout history often tells us that race, religion, creed and all manners of affiliations are factors that can be easily overlooked when the stakes are high enough.

There's no doubt that Al Qaeda may have a disdain for many secular societies. Nonetheless, all nation states have their own subsets with priorities and agendas that do not coincide with the status quo.

From gangs and organized crime families to corrupt officials looking to make a quick buck; if the money pile is large enough, anything becomes possible (as evidenced by capitalist corporations who continued to do business with Nazi Germany throughout the war). If it just so happens that Iran is Al Quaeda and the Taliban's meal ticket for acquiring hardware for the foreseeable future, so be it.

Keep in mind as well that Iran has continually denied involvement in Iraq's political future despite clear indications to the contrary. For the moment, the West (namely the United States), is a considerably bigger concern for them than Al Qaeda. If Afghanistan becomes the proxy for which Iran can hinder American efforts indirectly, so much the better.

Would it also surprise you to know that the greatest source of small arms for Palestinian militants during Ariel Sharon's tenure were actually from the Israeli soldiers themselves?

[hcrof]

I cannot speak about Al Quaeda with as much authority as I can about the Taliban except that as far as I am aware they are enemies of the state of Iran. The Sunni religious views of their leadership regard Shias as heretics with dangerous religeous views while Christians are just ignorant.

I can tell you with some certainty though that the Iranian government hates the Taliban and was even rumoured to be preparing an invasion of their own in 2001. Certainly they were one of the main suppliers of the northern alliance (along with Russia and India) before the invasion and supported many anti Taliban warlords. They even offered to help the Americans in their removal of the Taliban! This was turned down very firmly by Bush

While there have been cases of Iranian weapons being used by the Taliban, my interpretation is that they were supplied to anti Taliban fighters who then either switched sides or were defeated. Even after the invasion, Iran has been cultivating its own power base inside Afghanistan to use when the Americans leave because they want an Iranian favoured group in power - or at least Taliban influence held in check near their border. The reason for this is partly ideological but it is also to do with the flow of drugs across the border which is devastating to Iranian society and is killing thousands every year.

[Homo ferricus]

I generally agree with you hcrof, and I was never naive enough to consider this leak to be as substantial as wikileaks makes them sound, but it is still very interesting to read through all those articles about specific engagements and events, like the ANA/ANP friendly fire incidents, the stories about corruption that US civil affairs and mentor units have to deal with and try to correct, the special forces night raids. Interesting at least, but to others it is completely essential to understanding the nature of the war.

Yeah it doesn't surprise me either about the MANPADS, seeing as most other guerrilla/insurgent groups seem to be using them as well, from the Philippines to Chechnya.

[dieseltaylor]

The sooner drug users in the West are executed for using drugs deriving from Afghanistan/Middle East I am sure financing the bloodshed will become more difficult.

It seems to me insane that the cause and effect of a $11000 purchase price to a $1.2M street price in the West is not enough evidence that If the West really wanted to end the war they should be killing those who choose to finance it. Send soldiers to Afghanistan to fight and die [ not to mention Afghanistanis] or execute here those who help to corrrupt the countries.

If the West prefers not to be bold then simply legalise its growth in Europe and Russia and use the money to finance the Forces, or Afghanistan regime of choice.

[Tero]

Yeah it doesn't surprise me either about the MANPADS, seeing as most other guerrilla/insurgent groups seem to be using them as well, from the Philippines to Chechnya.

Not to mention the fact that (AFAIK) the Afganis received Stingers from the US and training to use them by members of US Special Forces during the Soviet occupation.

As far as the extent of the leak goes I would say it is fair to assume a fair amount of disinformation and propaganda is injected among the data.

[hcrof]

Homo ferricus - I definitely agree the information is interesting. I imagine it will be a fascinating resource for historians in years to come.

[Lt Belenko]

The sooner drug users in the West are executed for using drugs deriving from Afghanistan/Middle East I am sure financing the bloodshed will become more difficult.

It seems to me insane that the cause and effect of a $11000 purchase price to a $1.2M street price in the West is not enough evidence that If the West really wanted to end the war they should be killing those who choose to finance it. Send soldiers to Afghanistan to fight and die [ not to mention Afghanistanis] or execute here those who help to corrrupt the countries.

If the West prefers not to be bold then simply legalise its growth in Europe and Russia and use the money to finance the Forces, or Afghanistan regime of choice.

Perhaps, the sooner the renewable energy sources come online in the West and oil imports are curtailed the financing of certain intolerant countries and despots would be reduced.

[hoolaman]

The sooner drug users in the West are executed for using drugs deriving from Afghanistan/Middle East I am sure financing the bloodshed will become more difficult.

It seems to me insane that the cause and effect of a $11000 purchase price to a $1.2M street price in the West is not enough evidence that If the West really wanted to end the war they should be killing those who choose to finance it. Send soldiers to Afghanistan to fight and die [ not to mention Afghanistanis] or execute here those who help to corrrupt the countries.

If the West prefers not to be bold then simply legalise its growth in Europe and Russia and use the money to finance the Forces, or Afghanistan regime of choice.

Exceuting drug users??? That's "bold" is it? Even executing drug dealers in certain countries does nothing to stop people trying it, and that is just where money is the incentive, not an all consuming physical addiction.

I think your latter idea is closer to earth. Legalisation and control is simple if our politicians could grow some balls, and takes away the global crime, war and instability by the trade. Mexican Mafia, Afghan warlords, crime at home, all gone. Sure there would be other problems with druggies on the streets crashing cars and going psycho, but the net benefit would be massive.

[dieseltaylor]

The real interest in the documents surely must be that the existence of Wikileaks , I suspect, makes people less likely to do actions which they know are a bit iffy. Would My Lai have happened if the average grunt was aware of a bean spilling organisation beyond the US armys control?

"Bold" was ironic a bit. : )

But the hypocrisy of the West is breathtaking in its treatment of growers/non-natives and what one is prepared to kill/imprison within ones own population. Killing oversease to weaken the drugs trade seems infinitely preferable to taking on ones own legal system and the sanctity of western civilian life. My preferred solution is lots of bad batches of cocaine and opium in the market ....tragic but effective.

[Dietrich]

Three months later and neither Bigduke6 nor JonS have weighed in on this? Must not have been as important as Wikileaks made it out to be.

[dieseltaylor]

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

How to deal with drugs.

[costard]

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

How to deal with drugs.

Interesting article. Ok, some thoughts on where the debate goes from here. Outright denial of the demonstrated facts, followed by an emotional appeal to "save the kiddies" followed by "big business will come in and take over our society if we let this get through". Throw in an "elite" somewhere - "Only the elite (sportsmen, actors, bankers, rock'n'rollers) can afford to take drugs and manage to lead a good life: why let them get away with it?".

We've had the call for a debate over here by a top policeman, but his contribution was "If we had our time again we'd ban alcohol and tobacco." so I can only see it as trying to steer the outcome (i.e. nothing's going to happen - 'cept more money for the cops). When the dill sets the tone you have a lot to do to get anywhere.

That stat on the world prison population (America houses 25% of prisoners) has to be a typo, yeah? I mean, that's not scary, that's proof by inspection of a police state.

[JonS]

That stat on the world prison population (America houses 25% of prisoners) has to be a typo, yeah? I mean, that's not scary, that's proof by inspection of a police state.

Ther numbers vary a little, but broadly 25% is about right.

The get out of jail card (heh) is that it is 25% of reported prison populations. Then again, if you're relying on the unreported incarceration rate in places like Nigeria and Lybia to make you feel better ... ur doing it rong.

[costard]

Thanks for the link Jon.

2.4 million prisoners @ $62 / day = $150 million / day, for incarcerating people. That's a big privatised industry, and it's sucking on the public tit.

Gee we got off topic somewhat here....

[dieseltaylor]

Wikileaks- Afghanistan - how to fight the war- drug financing - drugs and societies.

Very straightforward : )

which leads to:

Alcohol is more harmful than heroin or crack, according to a study published in medical journal the Lancet.

The report is co-authored by Professor David Nutt, the former UK chief drugs adviser who was sacked by the government in October 2009.

It ranks 20 drugs on 16 measures of harm to users and to wider society.

Tobacco and cocaine are judged to be equally harmful, while ecstasy and LSD are among the least damaging.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11660210

oops

and

http://blogs.alternet.org/speakeasy/2010/10/31/las-sheriff-baca-stirs-fear-against-marijuana-days-before-the-election/

[Bigduke6]

Three months later and neither Bigduke6 nor JonS have weighed in on this? Must not have been as important as Wikileaks made it out to be.

I'm like Elmar, it was kind of cool the information got into the public realm, but pretty much all the Wikileaks info did for me was reconfirm stuff I was already personally convinced on.

That was a great article on Portugal, thanks.

I guess the next thing the world needs is some reporting on who exactly is making money from the War on Drugs, and how much. Prisons, police, lawyers, courts, health providers;, the people who build the prisons, the people who equip the police, etc. etc. Plus there's all that money that we spend abroad, buying helicopters for the Columbian government, sending FBI agents to participate in drug task force conferences everywhere from Dublin to Saigon, using satellite recon to hunt the smugglers, Coast Guard time in ships and men. The number has got to be so big, you could probably provide the US population every major drug of its choice, for free, and pay for the damages caused by all the stoned people, and still it would cost way less than fighting the "problem."

Some long-time readers here may recall that's my recommended first-step in dealing with Afghanistan: Legalize heroin in the US and Europe, now, cut off the Taliban's drug income, make them earn their money the old-fashioned way by waylaying travelers and stealing each others' livestock.

Unfortunately the decision-makers of the world haven't yet adopted this brilliant plan, their loss for not reading the BFI forum.