John Kettler Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Michael Dorosh, Years ago, I read an essay by a former Scotland Yard detective in which he analyzed the potential impact of the Holy Grail of the antigun forces, total gun ban for everyone save police and military. His conclusion was that per attack lethality would go up. Why? The average chance of being killed if shot was ~25%, whereas if one of two likely alternate weapons (lead filled pipe or knife) were to be used, the chances of survival dropped to around 50%. This is because the former tended to inflict massive head trauma as normally used, and the latter could not only reach internal organs but tended to carry surface contaminants deep into the wound, increasing the likelihood of sepsis atop deep wound trauma. Thus, taking firearms out of circulation would've had the splendidly ironic effect of making the average mugging much more deadly. Regards, John Kettler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
civdiv Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Originally posted by John Kettler: Michael Dorosh, Years ago, I read an essay by a former Scotland Yard detective in which he analyzed the potential impact of the Holy Grail of the antigun forces, total gun ban for everyone save police and military. His conclusion was that per attack lethality would go up. Why? The average chance of being killed if shot was ~25%, whereas if one of two likely alternate weapons (lead filled pipe or knife) were to be used, the chances of survival dropped to around 50%. This is because the former tended to inflict massive head trauma as normally used, and the latter could not only reach internal organs but tended to carry surface contaminants deep into the wound, increasing the likelihood of sepsis atop deep wound trauma. Thus, taking firearms out of circulation would've had the splendidly ironic effect of making the average mugging much more deadly. Regards, John Kettler John, Studies done in Florida clearly indicate that lack of gun control (freely distributed concealed carry permits, open carry, less restrictive gun laws when engaging intruders, etc) leads to less crime and a vastly improved rate of survival and less injuries for victims. civdiv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sross Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Always have a transitional weapon if you are going to engage in any sort of CQB, which in Iraq appears to be fairly regular. You are far better off to transition than to attempt to clear a weapon in the heat of the moment. Whether the secondary weapon is a knife or a handgun, make sure that you drill yourself for a smooth transition and that the placement is accessable. Knives are your best friend, the Kabar is an outstanding battle knife. Whatever is carried should be sharp for cutting and have a strong, thick (at least 1/8") blade for penetrating the skull and ribcage rapidly and decisively without the fear of it breaking, bending or glancing. The knife will produce more damage than the bullet and when used with the proper war face and fervor is very psychologically intimidating. The key is to have your mind right for using that type of physical force. Shooting people is easier. The further away the easier it is. If you have the chance before you leave, do some range time at very close distances up to muzzle contact with the targets and practice 25 yards or less with point shooting without using your sights. You'll be surprised how easy it is and how accurate you can be within a short period of time. He who shoots first, wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperial Grunt Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 He who shoots first, wins. Actually its He who hits first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Originally posted by civdiv: John, Studies done in Florida clearly indicate that lack of gun control (freely distributed concealed carry permits, open carry, less restrictive gun laws when engaging intruders, etc) leads to less crime and a vastly improved rate of survival and less injuries for victims. civdiv This seems consistent with studies in other states as well that I've read about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 Those of you deploying to the "balmy" climes of Iraq and the like may wish to strongly consider this item. I got an earlier model for my now retired brother who was being roasted alive in his Hummer in Iraq back then as part of the first SBCT to see combat. http://www.mistymate.com/carepackage.html As for the correlation between an armed citizenry and firearms, studies have consistently shown two things prey on the criminal mind: the likelihood of encountering armed resistance and how fast and likely their misdeeds are apt to be punished. The conclusion? They hate real time karma! The threat of jail simply can't compete with the fear of being shot on the spot. Years ago, Dade County, Florida had a rape epidemic going, which local law enforcement fought very effectively by publicly offering firearms training and concealed carry permits to some 10,000 women who passed the course. That alone was enough to act as a powerful corrective not merely to rape stats, but many other crimes as well. Regards, John Kettler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 John, I think you miss the point... studies have consistently shown two things prey on the criminal mind: the likelihood of encountering armed resistance and how fast and likely their misdeeds are apt to be punished.Studies have consistently shown that where there are fewer guns there are fewer violent deaths. There can be no argument about this. Major US cities have more gun deaths per capita that pretty much all Industrialized nations, regardless of gun laws. The reason? Firearms are highly restricted, especially concealable ones, in those nations compared to the US. The often repeated "you would rather be attacked by a guy with a gun than a guy with a lead pipe" stats often quoted, as did you, are taken totally out of context. Take someone who is a true violent criminal and give him a "reason" to kill someone and he will find a way to do so no matter what. No doubt about it. But most criminals aren't like that. They don't have the guts, if you will, to sit there and pound someone's head in or cut their throats with a knife. They are, for the most part, cowards. A firearm is the coward's best option for killing. It is also the best choice for someone caught up in the heat of the moment to act before he can think about things. Psychological study after study shows this to be a reality. Also, I have never heard of a person killing and wounding a dozen people in a workplace dispute with a baseball bat. And let's not forget that few children die every year from accidental self bludgeoning or accidentally stabbing their best friend 3 times in the heart. Then there are things like this, where the criminal actually didn't care about others having guns (we had a suicide by cop the other day in my State): http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/05/cnn.shooting.security/index.html I've got enough firearms in my house to start a small war, but I'm not going to kid myself about their downsides. Statistically speaking, there is no doubt that the average US citizen would be safer if all the guns in the country were removed. But that isn't going to happen... Steve [ April 05, 2007, 01:33 PM: Message edited by: Battlefront.com ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'Rogers Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 There can be no argument about this.Well there can be arguments about pretty much anything, just read one of the conspiracy theory threads on here (which I know you have because you posted in them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 I certainly didn't mean to reopen the firearms debate in Lt Mike's thread - good luck to all you guys going into the **** for real - have a safe tour and post when you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 C'Rogers, Good point Well, I think I should have closed it up before I posted, but I'll make good on that boo-boo and close it up now. I think Mike got some great 1st hand advice to help him with his gear. Thanks everybody! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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