Something I Hope WILL-HAPPEN in SC2!.

[Retributar]

Vortex Science - Implosion Forces

--These points below are to illustrate...that levitating a vehicle by an Anti(Against)Gravity against our own Earths natural Gravity-Force is not some wild-eyed hypothesis. In other words...those NAZI-UFO's may have been for real...and there is much more on the subject than i will post here.

I am posting information on NAZI-UFO's because according to the evidence it did take place before and during WW2. I will later post some current information on this same subject regarding efforts in area 51...where apparently the U.S. now has perfected this technology and has constructed these ships which fly like flying-saucers or UFO's.

The problem with these levitating machines is that you need inertialess weapons...like LASERS because remember...with this AG(Anti-Gravity) force making your ship light as a feather...if you now let loose with with an armour-piercing cannon weapon...the force required to propel that ammunition will result in an opposite force that would force your ship backwards...you would not be able to stay in a stationary spot and fire at will with conventinal weapons. Perhaps that might be one reason if there are any reasons as to why this particular levitating machine was never used in a combat situation.

These machines as far as i can see may not have been a practical weapons platform (But, what do i know)...however, with this article i just wanted to show that technology accelerated at tremedous leaps and bounds in WW2...more than we would normally expect it to...so advanced Trans-Atlantic Jet-Bombers and Jets with advanced range and capabilities and other weapons ... advanced subs, ships mounted with Rockets for continental land bombardement instead of BattleShip shell-shot... etc...can be kept in mind for possible sceniarios. If non of this is practical for SC2 ... then perhaps someone will use these ideas for a future creation.

If someone decides to do a scenario/s particularily regarding the time period near the end of the war and into an extended campaign into 1945 and beyond...which could include an invasion of North-America...perhaps some of the ideas on/in this posting starting from the 1st-one can be used as frame-work for such!.

http://www.vortexscience.com/pages/free.html

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http://www.frank.germano.com/water_power.htm

Viktor Schauberger's thoeries on vortex movement

THE VORTEX

The centrifugal effect in a vortex throws heavy liquid/air out to the perimeter whilst lighter air/ liquid is pushed to the center. Electrically, the air polarized with negative ions or as electrons will be pushed to the center and down, the air with positive ion content will move upward and outward. With mass weights for an electron at 9.109x10-31 kg. and a positive ion of air at around 2.656x10-26 kg it can be seen that the negative electron can be only one thirty-thousandth of the positive ion, and of course much more agile.

Latent Powers at Molecular Level

Professor J.H.Jeans1 writing about electrons, particularly of the innate strength of their negative charge wrote: "According to the best recent determinations, the amount of this charge is 4.774 x 10 10 electrostatic units, while the mass of each electron is 9.00 x 10 28 grammes. These determinations, which are due to Millikan and Bucherer, are probably accurate to about one part in a thousand. To a lower degree of accuracy the radius of the electron is probably about 2 x 10 13 cms. We can form some conception of the intense concentration of mass and electrification in the electron by noticing that a gramme of electrons, crammed together in cubical piling, would occupy only 7 x 10 11 cubic centimeters, while two such grammes of electrons placed at a distance of a meter apart would repel one another with a force equal to the weight of 3 x 10 22 tons.

The electric force of repulsion outweighs the gravitational force of attraction in the ratio of 4.2 x 10 42 to one."

Similar to how Viktor Schauberger's aerodynes utilized levitation thrust the ufo-type expulsion energy is a created reaction to the comprehensive densation of the air that is continually being sucked in through the vortex and therefore making the air below the craft more dense than the air above the craft. In other words the vortex is to create a higher-pressure area below the craft and a lower-pressure area above the craft.

But in this case, in the center of the accumulator reactor there are various constrictive devices in operation that are preventing the highly turbulent implosion cycloid, or vortex, from outflowing. Expulsion, then, cannot occur unless by force. Once it does expulse, when it reaches a certain threshold and the repulsion force takes over, the release would be sudden and very powerful - the highly compressed energy will immediately expand, once it has passed through the hole, or the circumferential duct, into the surrounding atmospheric air to regain its normalized state.

The usual hue of the energy around an electro-aerodyne is blue, which of course is the atoms / electrons accelerating and decelerating and then normalizing. The 8Hz (or 8 times per second) frequency that sometimes accompanies the whirling sound some observers have heard around these electro-aerodynes when just hovering may be one of the low-speed strobing cycles for that mode of energy output, the main pulses of which would be radiated at a much higher frequency (a strobed energy cycle occurs when two or more higher frequency pulses are propagated in close proximity.

A vortex has centripetal (as well as centrifugal) force that can compress its fluid to such a degree as to result in a 350,000-fold increase in pressure or a powerful implosive suction force.2 A vortex can be considered as a wave of ever-diminishing amplitude. And as a type of black hole, where energy is drawn in and by extreme compression is polarized electrically, so that particles sucked in split into electron/positron pairs, and where, as according to Hawking's Theoretical Physics 3 there is an emission - even from black holes in space - of both positive and neutral charges. Correspondingly, there is at the mouth of a vortex a relative centrifugal force which is positively charged with respect to its central (negative) throat.

Viktor Schauberger, the Austrian physicist, and Patrick Flanagan ("Secrets of the Soil" p99-115), have both found that water when revolved at high revolutions creates a substantial potential-difference in electrical energies in its structure.

According to the research of T.J.J. See in his Wave Theory: Discovery of the Cause of Gravitation (1938-52) the molecular structure of air or water (or indeed any fluid) changes quite dramatically at a critical point of inter-atomic-spacing where the normal forces of attraction transpose to an opposing force of repulsion...

Between the atoms and molecules that make up liquids and air a balance is maintained where electrons orbit a nucleus of an atom in precisely defined shells. Electron shells of one atom cannot mesh with those of other atoms - if they could the whole world would collapse into a very tiny ball ! Obviously there has to exist an all-powerful mechanism that can dramatically, if needs be, get the atomic and molecular structures out of a tight corner. So when the inter-atomic spacing between orbit shells is too tightly compressed a repulsion occurs to force things back toward normality. As the chart shows, when atoms get to a certain closeness, between d1 and d0 they undergo an attraction to each other - but further compression beyond d0 is met proportionally with repulsion. If there were a situation where the atomic structures were forced momentarily through a constriction that resulted in an ultra-high compression d1- then the repulsive forces would be very powerful indeed.

[ July 13, 2004, 12:49 PM: Message edited by: Retributar ]

[Roosevelt45(the 2nd)]

Have you been drinking again?

Or are you just another poor victim of the X-files?

[Retributar]

USAF Top Secret Nuclear Powered Flying Triangle - The TR-3B

http://www.seekers.100megs6.com/UFOManTR-3B.htm

NOTE: This machine is 600ft (182m) across and is already over 10 years old (Based on the first mentioned known flight of this craft...it might even been much more than 10 years from its first flight)...and there is much more going on with new technologies which i will not cover here...why do you think that the Soviet Union has backed off from expanding their empire and their counterance to U.S. power!.

-----------------------------------------------

The F-117A Nighthawk Stealth Fighter was in service for 6 to 8 years before the public was informed. Inside secret military leaks tell us the TR- 3B has been in service since 1994. Sources say witnessing this craft will do one of two things to you. Either make you think you really are just some wayward experiment or turn you against the governments. It's un-earthly technology and sight will literally blow your mind.

Welcome to the TR-3B:

It has been rumored for years that the military's black operations has perfected incredibly advanced gravity-defying triangular super-secret aerial platforms at least partially derived from ET technology. (Prior to and after WW2...or so they claim...i do not believe in ET's myself!)

Tonight, the world's most exotic and classified aerospace vehicle could be stealthily hovering somewhere over Phoenix, Arizona, Gulf Breeze, Florida, the country of Belgium, or your city. It is known as the TR-3B.

Science fiction or fact, you ask? High rank military officers detail the astounding government cover-up effected by the MJ-12 committee and reveal for the first time ultra top secret information about alien technology and reverse engineered technology we have developed as a result of the recovered alien artifacts.

The TR-3B is NOT fiction and was built with technology available in the mid- 1980s or earlier. The triangular shaped nuclear powered aerospace platform was developed under the Aurora Program with SDI and black budget monies.

The Aurora Program is a top secret development program for advanced aerospace vehicles and has been responsible for development of the hypersonic strategic reconnaissance SR-75 Penetrator which replaced the SR-71 spy plane, and the SR-74 Scramp, which rides piggy-back the SR- 75.

The tactical reconnaissance TR-3B's first operational flight was in the early 90s. Technology assuredly developed from reverse engineering of recovered alien artifacts and programs such as the SR-74 and SR-75 was used in the TR-3B. At least three of the billion dollar plus TR-3Bs were flying by 1994.

The TR-3B vehicle's outer coating is reactive to electrical stimulation and can change color, reflectiveness, and radar absorptiveness, thus making the vehicle look like a small aircraft or a flying cylinder--or even tricking radar receivers into falsely detecting a variety of aircraft, no aircraft, or several aircraft at various locations.

A circular, plasma filled accelerator ring called the "Magnetic Field Disrupter" surrounds the rotatable crew compartment and is far ahead of any imaginable technology. Sandia and Livermore laboratories developed the reverse engineered MFD technology. The government will go to any lengths to protect this technology.

The MFD generates a magnetic vortex field that disrupts or neutralizes the effects of gravity on mass within proximity by 89 percent. This is not antigravity. Anti-gravity provides a repulsive force that can be used for propulsion. The MFD creates a disruption of the Earth's gravitational field upon the mass within the circular accelerator.

The mass of the circular accelerator, and all mass within the accelerator, such as the crew capsule and the nuclear reactor, are reduced by almost 90%. This causes the effect of making a vehicle extremely light and able to outperform and outmaneuver any craft yet constructed--except, of course, those UFOs we did not build. The TR-3 is a reconnaissance platform with an indefinite loiter time. "Indefinite" because it uses a nuclear reactor for power!.

Many sightings of triangular UFOs are not alien vehicles but the ultra top secret TR-3B. The NSA, NRO, CIA, and USAF have been playing a shell game with aircraft nomenclature - creating the TR-3, modified to the TR-3A, the TR-3B, and the Teir 2, 3, and 4, with suffixes like 'Plus' or 'Minus' added on to further confuse the fact that each of these designators is a different aircraft and not the same aerospace vehicle. A TR-3B is as different from a Teir 3B as a banana is from a grape. Some of these vehicles are manned and others are unmanned.

The TR-3B's propulsion is provided by three multimode thrusters mounted at each bottom corner of the triangular platform. The TR-3 is a sub-Mach 9 vehicle until it reaches altitudes above 100,000 feet--then God knows how fast it can go!

--------------------------

Edgar Fouche'....the man who revealed this information...and how he did it!.

http://www.seekers.100megs6.com/UFOMANSecretFouche.htm

Some more reading by other authors...

http://www.seekers.100megs6.com/TriangleMystery.htm

http://robocat.users.btopenworld.com/tr3b.htm

--------------

If you have ' MS Flight Simulator'...you can download this ship and a patch to go with the program and fly it at home!.

Flight Simulator : TR-3B

http://www.startfinish.biz/wise/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=10

------------------------------

http://www.rense.com/general30/yrb3.htm

TR-3B Antigravity Physics Explained

By John Kooiman

10-16-2

To be correct, I probably should say, "TR-3B Antigravity Physics Explained, insofar as General Relativity can be considered an explanation for gravity."

Many readers of this list are probably already familiar with Edgart. If not, read about it here: http://fouchemedia.com/arap/speech.htm.

Mr. Fouche describes the TR-3B's propulsion system as follows: "A circular, plasma filled accelerator ring called the Magnetic Field Disrupter, surrounds the rotatable crew compartment and is far ahead of any imaginable technology... The plasma, mercury based, is pressurized at 250,000 atmospheres at a temperature of 150 degrees Kelvin, and accelerated to 50,000 rpm to create a super-conductive plasma with the resulting gravity disruption.

The MFD generates a magnetic vortex field, which disrupts or neutralizes the effects of gravity on mass within proximity, by 89 percent...

The current MFD in the TR-3B causes the effect of making the vehicle extremely light, and able to outperform and outmaneuver any craft yet ...My sources say the performance is limited only the stresses that the human pilots can endure. Which is a lot, really, considering along with the 89% reduction in mass, the G forces are also reduced by 89%. The crew of the TR-3B should be able to comfortable take up to 40Gs... Reduced by 89%, the occupants would feel about 4.2 Gs.

The TR-3Bs propulsion is provided by 3 multimode thrusters mounted at each bottom corner of the triangular platform. The TR-3 is a sub-Mach 9 vehicle until it reaches altitudes above l20,000 feet - then who knows how fast it can go!..."

I was skeptical of Mr. Fouche's claims when I first read them, as I' m sure that many of you are, but I was interested enough to do further research on what happens when you spin a plasma at high speeds in a ring (toroidal) configuration. I came across a physics article (sorry, I can't seem to locate the source right now) that described this exact configuration. The article said that, surprisingly, the charged particles of the plasma don't just spin uniformly around the ring, but they tend to take up a synchronized, tightly pitched, helical (screw thread) motion as they move around the ring. This can be understood in a general way as follows: the charged particles moving around the ring act as a current that in turn sets up a magnetic field around the ring. It is a well-known fact that electrons (or ions) tend to move in a helical fashion around magnetic field lines. Although it is a highly complex interaction, it only requires a small leap of faith to believe that the end result of these interactions between the moving charged particles (current) and associated magnetic fields results in the helical motion described above. In other words, the charged particles end up moving in very much the same pattern as the current on a wire tightly wound around a toroidal core.

I thought that this was an interesting fact, but didn't see how it could possibly relate to antigravity, until I ran across the following article: "Guidelines to Antigravity" by Dr. Robert Forward, written in 1962 (available at: http://www.whidbey.com/forward/pdf/tp007.pdf). Dr. Forward's article describes several little known aspects of Einstein's General Relativity Theory that indicate how moving matter can create unusual gravitational effects. When I saw Figure 5 in Dr. Forward's article, the pieces of the puzzle all fell together. I instantly saw how the moving matter pattern that Dr. Forward describes as necessary to generate a gravitational dipole was exactly the same as the plasma ring pattern described in the physics article discussed above!

If Fouche's description is even close to correct, then the TR-3B utilizes this little known loophole in General Relativity Theory to create it's antigravity effects! Even though the TR-3B can only supposedly cancel 89% of gravity (and inertia) today, there is no reason why the technology can't be improved to exceed 100% and achieve true antigravity capability!

In theory, this same moving matter pattern could be mechanically reproduced by mounting a bunch of small gyroscopes all around the larger ring, with their axis on the larger ring, and then spinning both the gyroscopes and the ring at high speeds. However, as Dr. Forward points out any such mechanical system would probably fly apart before any significant antigravity effects could be generated.

However, as Dr. Forward states, "By using electromagnetic forces to contain rotating systems, it would be possible for the masses to reach relativistic velocities; thus a comparatively small amount of matter, if dense enough and moving fast enough, could produce usable gravitational effects."

The requirement for a dense material moving at relativistic speeds would explain the use of Mercury plasma (heavy ions). If the plasma really spins at 50,000 RPM and the Mercury ions are also moving in a tight pitched spiral, then the individual ions would be moving probably hundreds, perhaps thousands of times faster than the bulk plasma spin, in order to execute their "screw thread" motions. It is quite conceivable that the ions could be accelerated to relativistic speeds in this manner. I am guessing that you would probably want to strip the free electrons from the plasma, making a positively charged plasma, since the free electrons would tend to counter rotate and reduce the efficiency of the antigravity device.

One of Einstein's postulates of GR says that gravitational mass and inertial mass are equivalent. This is consistent with Mr. Fouche's claim that inertial mass within the plasma ring is also reduced by 89%. This would also explain why the vehicle is triangular shaped. Since it still requires conventional thrusters for propulsion, the thrusters would need to be located outside of the "mass reduction zone" or else the mass of the thruster's reaction material would also be reduced, making them terribly inefficient. Since it requires a minimum of 3 legs to have a stable stool, it follows that they would need a minimum of 3 thrusters to have a stable aerospace platform. Three thrusters, located outside of the plasma ring, plus appropriate structural support, would naturally lead to a triangular shape for the vehicle.

I was extremely skeptical of Mr. Fouche's claimed size for the TR-3B, of 600 feet across. At first, I thought that this must be a typo. Why would anyone in their right mind build a "Tactical Reconnaissance" vehicle 2 football fields long? They must be nuts! However, the answer to this may also be found in Dr. Forward's paper. As Dr. Forward's puts it, "...even the most optimistic calculations indicate that very large devices will be required to create usable gravitational forces. Antigravity...like all modern sciences, will require special projects involving large sums of money, men, and energy."

http://www.mufonla.com/tr3b.htm

[ July 13, 2004, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: Retributar ]

[With Clusters]

"The government will go to any lengths to protect this technology".

If I were you, I'd get out the tinfoil helmet, and hide in the deapest hole you can find!

[Roosevelt45(the 2nd)]

Tonight, the world's most exotic and classified aerospace vehicle could be stealthily hovering somewhere over Phoenix, Arizona, Gulf Breeze, Florida, the country of Belgium, or your city. It is known as the TR-3B.

you're not threathening me are you?

Ok,I apologise about my first reaction but you know how first reactions can be.

It just all sounds so unbelievable to me.

I can see you're well-informed(though some of the links brought me to some very strange sites but my computer has been acting strange all week so it's not neccesarily the link) but I hope that you site doesn't claim those pictures(with the purple UFO on them) to be real because then they've wasted the last bit of credibility they had.

I can imagine that the US army could very well have gotten away with keeping these things secret and it would explain a lot but I'm still not convinced and doubt I ever will be.

[Retributar]

Some of the links are Buggered-Up!...i didnt check them...just copied them from the web-page...if you want to research the subject more just type in TR-3B into your search engine. I use 'Copernic Agent Basic' myself!.

It mentions in the readings that the ship can change color...so it doesn't necessarily have to be purple...it could be black or some other color.

[ July 13, 2004, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: Retributar ]

[Retributar]

AIRBORNE LASER:

http://www.fas.org/spp/starwars/program/abl.htm

Think of it ... could the USAF Top Secret Nuclear Powered Flying Triangle (TR-3B) and the Airborne Laser marry-up to produce a Missile Deterence Weapon?.

For now a Boeing 747 Jumbo-Jet will house this Laser...and if all goes as planned, a fleet of seven ABLs should be flying operational missions by 2008.

The ABL (Airborne Laser) weapon system consists of a high-energy, chemical oxygen iodine laser (COIL) mounted on a modified 747-400F (freighter) aircraft to shoot down theater ballistic missiles in their boost phase. A crew of four, including pilot and copilot, would be required to operate the airborne laser, which would patrol in pairs at high altitude, about 40,000 feet, flying in orbits over friendly territory, scanning the horizon for the plumes of rising missiles. Capable of autonomous operation, the ABL would acquire and track missiles in the boost phase of flight, illuminating the missile with a tracking laser beam while computers measure the distance and calculate its course and direction. After acquiring and locking onto the target, a second laser - with weapons-class strength - would fire a three- to five-second burst from a turret located in the 747's nose, destroying the missiles over the launch area.

The Airborne Laser is a Major Defense Acquisition Program. After the Concept Design Phase is complete, the ABL will enter the Program Definition and Risk Reduction (PDRR) Phase. The objective of the PDRR phase is to develop a cost effective, flexible airborne high energy laser system which provides a credible deterrent and lethal defensive capabilities against boosting theater ballistic missiles.

[Liam]

Neat info :)some stuff that modern Nations haven't even employed yet in actual use.

[Retributar]

I think it's time for some 'EYE-CANDY!'....Take a look at these pictures!.

Done by Japanese Artists from Hiroshima-Japan.

http://www2.cc22.ne.jp/~harada/english/t_index_e.html

[ December 13, 2004, 09:04 AM: Message edited by: Retributar ]

[Bruce70]

I haven't been following the forum much lately so I assume this is some kind of joke thread, like the Peng threads or somefink?

[Retributar]

Im sorry you think its a joke thread... Bruce70...its not a joke thread.

Please start at the beginning and look at all the postings...the reason for the posting should then become evident.

Main theme of the posting is...

***ADVANCED & SECRET WEAPONS SYSTEMS DEVELOPMENT***

Tiger's in North Afrika' :

http://www.homepurchaseprogram.com/monster2.html

[ December 13, 2004, 09:10 AM: Message edited by: Retributar ]

[Bruce70]

My apologies, now that I have read the entire thread I must say that it is a very interesting read.

[Retributar]

http://worldatwar.net/chandelle/v1/v1n1/ww2space.htm

Weird Science: German Military Spacecraft of World War 2

In its operation, the Antipodal Bomber was a hybrid of aircraft and orbital spacecraft. It was to take off from a special rocket sled running on a monorail. When it reached 1640 ft/sec, it would lift off and climb to operational altitude in a steep, near-ballistic trajectory. But the Silver Bird would shut down its engines before attaining orbital velocity. It would sink back to earth until it bounced off the upper edge of the atmosphere. The bomber would proceed to the target like a stone skipping over the surface of a pond. After dropping its weapons, it would continue on around the globe to its base.

As near as we know, the Sänger aerospace plane got no closer to the hardware stage than the afore- mentioned wind-tunnel models. Germany's other notable manned space venture, on the other hand, was a member of the V2 rocket family. Many of its elements were actually tested using sub-scale, V2 components. The A9/A10 project was a two-stage, hypersonic, semi-ballistic manned bomber with a planned 3000-mile range. Taking the aerodynamics of the experimental, winged A4b version of the V2 for their starting point, the engineers at Germany's Peenemünde rocket center added a pressurized cockpit, landing gear, flaps, ailerons, elevators, and a turbojet sustainer engine. They planned to mount this A9 on a huge A10 booster, in essence a V2 grown to monstrous proportions.

The A9/A10 composite would take off vertically. After staging, the A9 component would follow a ballistic trajectory to the edge of space, 210 miles up. It would then fall back to earth until, 750 miles from its base, at an altitude of about 30 miles, and at speeds of over 8000 mph, the wingborne portion of the flight began. The A9 would approach its target in a high-Mach, unpowered glide. Forty-five minutes into the mission, it would release its modest one-ton bomb load, start the turbojet, and turn for home.

The most ambitious and, perhaps, delusional of the Nazi space schemes was a 1945 project for an orbital space station armed with a death ray, a huge space mirror. In 1929, Herman Oberth had proposed a potentially practical space station that served as the basis for the later project. But the 1945 station was to be one giant mirror fabricated entirely from metallic sodium. Over-sized V2 rockets were to carry the thing to its 1500-mile orbit in prefabricated sections. Here, Nazi spacemen would assemble it , using electricity provided by a system of solar-fired boilers and steam-driven dynamos. Breathable oxygen would come from pumpkins grown under flourescent light. When they were finished, the crew would steer the station over target nations, focus the sun's rays, and burn cities and boil reservoirs.

The space station is patently ridiculous, even today. It is hard to say how practical either of the rocket plane schemes could have been either, given the state of the art in the 1940s and the ever-worsening shortages of rare metals and petrochemicals. The German engineers appear to have grossly underestimated the thermal loads on a winged re-entry vehicle. These would not be on the order of an Apollo capsule, but they would still pose a formidable problem. Stainless steel might not be up to the job and was hard to fabricate. Titanium was still in the future. Inconel and the nimonic alloys that made the X-15 possible were still a few years away. Even now, the only working aerospace plane, the Space Shuttle, has to have ceramic tiles over all highly heated surfaces. Propulsion would also be a problem. As the new masters of German science, the US and USSR, discovered in the 1950s, V2-type engines could not simply be scaled up in the manner planned for the A10. Sänger-style, single-stage-to-orbit systems are still no more than a dream after sixty years.

Even if the A9/A10 or the Antipodal Bomber had been built and made to work, one wonders what it would all be for. A paltry ton of high explosive could hardly have a measurable effect on the war. It could never justify either program's staggering cost in money, raw materials, and industrial capacity. Some writers have suggested that one or both was an intended delivery vehicle for a Nazi nuclear weapon. But the Nazis had no hope of fielding an A-bomb by 1944 or 1945. In any case, it would be decades before nuclear weapons could be had in 2000-4000 lb packages (the Hiroshima and Nagasaki weapons weighed in at around 10,000 lbs each). The Nazi space program is thus best understood as little more than a self-indulgent delusion, one of many that occupied Germany's bunker-bound leadership and self-serving intelligentsia as disaster and defeat overtook the nation they professed to lead.

[With Clusters]

Yeah, I think "delusion(al)" sums it up. Too bad, if there hadn't been the War, some of these people might have made great SF writers!

[Retributar]

Additional research on the "ANDROMEDA - GERAT"

Good detailed information on the 'ANDROMEDA - GERAT' is sparse at best...this is all i could find on it.

-----------------------------------

http://www.netowne.com/naziufos/boblee/index.htm

Cylindrical UFO:

"On September 29, 1944, at 10:45 a.m., a test pilot was trying out a new Messerschmitt Jet, ME 262 Schwalbe, when his attention was suddenly caught by two luminous points situated on his right.

He shot at full speed in that direction and found himself face to face with a cylindrical object, more than three hundred feet long with some openings along its side, and fitted with long antennae placed in front up to about halfway along its length.

Having approached within about 1,500 feet of the craft the pilot was amazed to see that it was moving at a speed of more than 1,200 m.p.h." - from U.F.O.s and Extra-terrestrials in History (Vol. 4) by Yves Naud.

I believe that many of us can make some contribution to explaining the UFO mystery. This page is my modest contribution.

I am sharing with those of you who are interested, an interview with Richard L. Cornwell, a veteran who was an Investigator with the 970th detachment of the U.S. Army Counter Intelligence Corps.

Shortly after the end of WW II, this remarkable man actually was on site at the Harz mountain facility where Germany apparently manufactured at least some of their electromagnetic propulsion craft (also known as field propulsion craft) during the war.

In retrospect, Americans should have correlated the WW II and post-war sightings of flying spheres, saucers, and cylinders to the wondrous technology of National Socialist Germany. It is an understatement to say that our government has deliberately misled us on the UFO question.

My own interest in the UFO phenomenon was first sparked in February 1955 when I noticed a glowing yellow sphere hovering a few feet above a tree.

This extremely fascinating object was only about twenty-five feet from where I was looking out of a window. After a few seconds it moved away horizontally at a speed of perhaps 30 mph. I had an immediate sense that this amazing machine was under intelligent control.

This sighting occurred on a Sunday afternoon in Nashville, Tennessee. I would estimate the object to be between 5 to 6 feet in diameter. In retrospect, I might add that it had an uncanny resemblance to a WW II vintage "Foo Fighter.".

It is likely that the German cylindrical (or cigar-shaped) craft had large photon reflectors mounted in an opening at the tail end of the ship.

WW II German scientist Eugen Sänger once wrote, "Reflectors are used to direct the beams not only of searchlights and weapons rays but of various kinds of photon and pure fission rockets as well.

Here they serve to reflect and collimate electromagnetic or corpuscular radiation. So doing they replace the conventional firing nozzle in directing the force which propels the rocket." Of course, there were problems associated with photon propulsion. According to the late NASA scientist, Paul R. Hill, the energy of a photon beam required to propel a UFO weighing 60,000 pounds in earth's atmosphere would be approximately 2,000 times greater than the jet energy of a Saturn class rocket with a thrust of six million pounds.

German scientists were well aware of the above constraints. They knew that gravity had to be overcome by some means. Cancellation of gravity was the real challenge. I believe that through experimentation they discovered that rings fitted with ports for emission of bursts of high energy electromagnetic waves could cancel gravity by relaxing the tension in the fabric of space-time. Photon propulsion became feasible in our atmosphere and strange UFO's ("Foo Fighters", flying saucers, wingless cylinders, etc.) raced across the skies of WW II confounding the eyes (and nerves) of those who saw them.

(Author's note: I will remind the reader that numerous eye witnesses have reported flashing lights along the rims of flying saucers. These lights (glowing air molecules) are actually caused by bursts of x-ray photons which distort gravity by relaxing the tension found in the fabric of space-time. See my article on gravity: Is Gravity Caused by Tension in the Fabric in Space-Time?)

In March of 1997, I was very pleased to conduct a series of five interviews with a (then) 76 year old US Army Counter Intelligence Corps veteran, Richard L. Cornwell, who was actually present at the German facility where photon propulsion craft were manufactured during WW II. I believe that the following excerpts from my interviews can help each of us to decide on what really took place.

RJL: What circumstances brought you to the German manufacturing site for the flying saucers?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: I was on an intelligence mission which I would rather not discuss. We visited the Harz mountain facility out of intense curiosity.

RJL: Did you see any flying saucers at the plant?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: Well, to begin with, I don't recall anyone using the term "Flying Saucers." Our people referred to them as craft. I only examined one craft while I was there.

RJL: What did it look like?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: It was a large cylindrical-shaped metallic craft resting on two long, wide skids. It was painted a gray-green color and did not have any markings or German insignia what-so-ever. I gathered that it was partially assembled and when the US Army was drawing near, the Germans hastily removed the propulsion system and other sensitive items.

The propulsion system had been located in the belly of the craft. You could see where it had been removed. The bottom of the craft was somewhat flattened and the top was rounded. The nose of the craft was rounded.

I went all through the thing and I noticed that one of the two front windows had been broken out. They appeared to be made out of very thick glass. Several of the gauges were missing from the control panel. There were round porthole windows on each side. The outside of the craft was smooth with riveted joints.

RJL: How big was the craft?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: Frankly, it is hard for me to remember. I do recall thinking that it was larger than any WW II submarine. I will estimate that it was several hundred feet long and maybe 30 feet high and perhaps 20 feet across the top.

RJL: Did it have a searchlight?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: I don't remember seeing one.

RJL: What about the craft's entrance doors?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: Strange as it may sound, we could not figure out exactly where the entrance doors were located, due to damage done to the sides when the Germans dismantled the parts they wanted to remove. We concluded that the doors must have been located on the sides.

RJL: Was the craft located in an underground facility?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: It was stored in a well-camouflaged aboveground building.

RJL: Were you briefed about the nature of this German craft?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: We were told that the Germans designed it to go to the moon and that they had flown all of the operational craft which had been kept at the plant to South America and Africa.

(Author's note: Germany also had an electromagnetic propulsion 300 meter long cylindrical ship which was alleged to be capable of traveling to the moon. A possible postwar siting of one of these giant ships is included in Strange Worlds by Frank Edwards.

On June 30, 1947, the steamship Llandovery Castle was passing through the Straits of Madagascar, when those on board observed a 1000 feet long cigar shaped metallic craft descend from the sky and cruise along beside them for about one minute. Given the time frame of the above incident it would seem likely that this UFO was in fact a craft from a displaced Reich operating out of a secret base in Africa - or possibly Antarctica.

George Leonard, author of Somebody Else is on the Moon, mentions the puzzling mystery of runic symbols appearing on the moon's surface. He cites considerable evidence of activities on the surface of the moon.

Rumors have persisted for decades that German forces continued to wage a secret war after May 1945, using exotic technology - especially UFO based psychological warfare.

In 1952, CIA director Walter B. Smith wrote, in a now declassified memorandum, to the director of the Psychological Strategy Board, "I am today transmitting to the National Security Council a proposal (TAB A) in which it is concluded that the problems connected with unidentified flying objects appear to have implications for psychological warfare as well as for intelligence and operations."

He went on to write in section 3 of the same memo, "I suggest that we discuss at an early board meeting the possible offensive or defensive utilization of these phenomena for psychological warfare purposes.")

RJL: Were you instructed to keep this information secret?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: I have been warned at least three times.

RJL: Were you contacted after you returned to the states?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: Yes. Once by a government visitor to my home.

RJL: What type of ID did he show you?

CIC Veteran Cornwell: He showed me a Military Intelligence ID.

Copyright © 2002, 2003 by Robert J. Lee All rights in the above article are reserved.

No portion may be reproduced in any form without the express permission of the author.

I hope to update this page periodically with additional facts. I am not interested in email concerning aliens, the occult, or other irrelevant topics; however, if you have documentation, or relevant new facts about German WW II electromagnetic propulsion craft to contribute, then please feel free to contact me. Thanks.

E-mail: rjustinlee@yahoo.com

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http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/nordicsaucer.html

7.) Haunebu III. An SS E4-planned deep-space disc craft. Various photographs show design variations. Over 400 feet in diameter.A side view drawing with data survives. Reportedly, U.S. found none References 3, 5, 7,8. A Haunebu IV also is reported (reference 9)

8.) ANDROMEDA PROJECT-VRIL 7: A large craft planned by SS E4 for interstellar travel, Over 100 ton capacity. Plan shows a Vril 7 craft and other smaller craft (see graphic below) contained within it. References 3,5,8. 360 feet long (Reference 9)

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http://www.buforadio.com/ufofilespennsylvania/id22.html

ANDROMEDA PLAN: The Andromeda was a craft with a diameter of 139m that was meantto transport troops, up to 5 saucers, and equipment

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http://www.galactic2.net/rune/vril4.html

At the beginning of 1943 it was planned to build in the Zeppelin works a cigar-shaped mother ship. The ANDROMEDA DEVICE of a length of 139m should transport several saucer-shaped craft in its body for flights of long duration (interstellar flights).

By Christmas 1943 an important meeting of the VRIL-GESELLSCHAFT took place at the seaside resort of Kolberg. The two mediums Maria Ortic and Sigrun attended. The main item on the agenda was the ALDEBARAN PROJECT.

The mediums had received precise information about the habitable planets around the sun Aldebaran and one began to plan a trip there.

At a January 22, 1944 meeting between HITLER; HIMMLER, Kunkel (of the Vril Society) and Dr. Schumann this project was discussed.

It was planned to send the VRIL 7 large-capacity craft through a dimension channel independent of the speed of light to Aldebaran. According to Ratthofer a first test flight in the dimension channel took place in the winter of 1944.

It barely missed disaster, for photographs show the Vril 7 after the flight looking "as if it had been flying for a hundred years". The outer skin was looking aged and was damaged in several places.

The ANDROMEDA DEVICE existed on the drawing board, it was 139m long and had hangars for one Haunebu II, two Vril I's and two Vril II's.

There are documents showing that the VRIL 7 large capacity craft has started for secret, still earth-bound, missions after it was finished and test flown by the end of 1944:

1. A landing at the Mondsee in the Salzkammergut in Austria, with dives to test the pressure resistance of the hull.

2. Probably in March and April 1945 the VRIL 7 was stationed in the "Alpenfestung" {Alpine Fortress} for security and strategic reasons, from whence it flew to Spain to get important personalities who had fled there safely to South America and "NEUSCHWABENLAND" (explanation follows) to the secret German bases erected there during the war.

3. Immediately after this the VRIL 7 is said to have started on a secret flight to Japan about which however nothing further is known.

---------------

http://membres.lycos.fr/rr0/NaziUFO.html

Antigravity research began in the 1920s with the first hybrid antigravity circular craft, the RFZ-1, constructed by the secret Vril society.

In 1942-43 a series of antigravity machines culminated in the giant 350-foot-long, cigar-shaped Andromeda space station, which was constructed in old Zeppelin hangars near Berlin by E4, the research and development arm of the SS." [30]

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http://www.beyondweird.com/ufos/Bruce_Walton_The_Underground_Nazi_Invasion_28.html

NAZI UFOS

In his controversial presentaion UFO SECRETS OF THE THIRD REICH, Vladimir Terziski [refers to such] German secret societies as the Tempel- hoff, the Thule, the Vrill, and the Black Sun...

Terziski maintains that antigravity research began in Germany in the 1920s with the first hybrid antigravity circular craft, the RFZ-1, constructed by the secret Vrill society.

In 1942-43 a series of antigravity machines culminated in the giant 350-foot-long, cigar-shaped Andromeda space station, which was constructed in old zeppelin hangers near Berlin by E4, the research and development arm of the SS

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http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/editorialdiscs.shtml

Germany 1944.

Things were getting desperate for hitler, as the allies were sweeping through france and denmark. He ordered another two projects, Hannebu 3 and the Andromeda project.

Hannebu 3 was the same as the last two but could hold upto 30 people, and stay aloft indefinitely.

Andromeda, was a cigar shaped craft, that could fly out of atmosphere. It could hold at least two craft, and could hold over 80 people. Only one was rumored to be made

Germany 1945.

The allies were in german territory and capturing facilitys. Hitler orders the Kuegal Baull fleet to be destroyed (to stop technology falling into allied hands), and one of them to be sent to japan.

Hitler then orders the whole flying disk projects to be sent to Neu Schwabenland Antartica (aka Base 2-11, New Berlin, a not so secret antartic facility made by germany in 1937).

All the hannebu craft that were still under construction were dismantled, and shipped to the antartic.

All the rest of the craft made their way there under their own power. 7 hours before Berlin falls, hitler escapes to argentina via a ME226 piloted by a female german officer.

The Allies march into berlin after tough fighting, nothing remained of hitler, or the flying disk project.

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http://www.magonia.demon.co.uk/abwatch/naziufo/naziufo6.html

"an 'alien tutor race' that secretly began cooperating with certain German scientists in the late 1920s in underground bases and began to introduce their concepts of philosophical, cultural, and technological progress" . . "

(he) maintains that antigravity research began in the 1920s with the first hybrid antigravity circular craft, the RFZ-1, constructed by the secret Vril society.

In 1942-43 a series of antigravity machines culminated in the giant 350-foot-long, cigar-shaped Andromeda space station, which was constructed in old Zeppelin hangars near Berlin by E4, the research and development arm of the SS." [30]

-------

HISTORY:

http://www.zephonministries.com/human_machinations.htm

On January 3-4, 1934, a purported meeting took place between Hitler and Heinrich Himmler, chief of the Nazi SS. The basis of the meeting was to formulate and plan a journey to the stars in order to reach the location from which the technology they received had originated.

After years of self-education and outer-worldly influence, Hitler’s “black sun worshipping” SS storm troopers developed the RFZ-1 anti-gravitational aircraft. It was originally designed for military reconnaissance applications and land-based conventional warfare.

Soon followed the development of the RFZ-2 which was a round aircraft with magnetic impulse steering capability. Still pursuing the search for a way to become independent from the need of foreign oil Hitler founded the SSE-4 — a research group on alternative energy.

By 1935, the German Nazi hierarchy were intensely aware of the existence of life and technology on other stars in the universe. At least, that is what they were led to believe by an elite few associated with Asian occultism. Hitler began to “open” the portal to the worlds beyond via his SS.

The drive to abandon the energy sources gained via explosion and move toward an alternative energy source of electro-gravitational propulsion via implosion led to the development and construction of the HE 138, 178, and 280

Yet, all of these round, saucer-shaped crafts were still powered by conventional propulsion. In 1938, the RFZ-4 and RFZ-5 were constructed.

This year was also when the German military undertook a massive Antarctica expedition which culminated in Hitler’s SS staking claim to a land area of nearly 229,000 sq. miles.

Evidence supports the assertion that the Germans had established a submarine base here to hide and further develop their “alien” technology.

In 1939 came the RFZ -7. And in July of 1941, the development of the “flying gyroscope” led to the testing of the RFZ -17 by the end of 1942.

Retired CIA agent, Virgil Armstrong, stated that Adolph Hitler was given unlimited financial backing for an 8 month period to further develop this extraordinary technology.

In “Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler,” Dr. Anthony Sutton provides the unquestionable documentation which substantiates that some of this funding was received from the Bush and Kennedy families in America.

On April 17, 1945, Hitler tested the V-7 above the Baltic sea. The VRIL-7 was a supersonic helicopter powered by 12 BMW 028 turbo engines fueled with helium.

On it’s maiden flight it reached an altitude of 78,000 feet; 80,000 feet on it’s second flight. The first VRIL craft (V-1) had attained a speed of 1200 mph.

The V-2 reached a speed of 2500 mph and was capable of 900 turns. It was outfitted with a laser beam weapon capable of penetrating 4” of armor. Modem day physicists still question these possibilities.

PROJECT “Andromeda,” the latter being the cigar-shaped mother crafts — some of which were estimated to be nearly 106 meters long

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HISTORY:

http://www.zephonministries.com/human_machinations.htm

[Michael Dorosh]

heh...now I don't feel so bad that Retributar claimed that Canada wasn't pulling its weight in World War Two and implied we should have had 300 percent more men in the field than we had. I think this thread shows the depth of his historical research...

Pretty pictures, though.

[Neutrino 123]

There are certainly some feasible weapons here, but anti-gravity? I think not.

If the U.S. has anti-gravity then it would have all it needs to manufacture fleet of warp-capable starships to go on a continuing mission: to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilazation, to boldly go where no one has gone before...

Anti-gravity is now theoretically possible (and may one day be utilized or it may be determined to be definatly impossible). However, it would not make an object 'inertialess'. A starshipship that utilizes antigravity would be able to fire photon torpedoes with the normal amount of recoil.

[it's Les]

Hmmm.

What's the difference between an elaborate scam, and a complete break down in common sense?

Not much, but at least in the case of the scam someone KNOWS it is a scam.

Very amusing thread though.

I'm always happy to see someone get ahead of me though in fielding ideas no one wants to accept and or hear or take serously

You might want to consider writing books for the rolegaming industry Retributar, your material is pretty good.

[Retributar]

Ohh! Les i thought this topic was totally dead!. Good to see you reply with what-ever opinion.

I just ran across this information (Accurate or Inaccurate) as i was searching for other information and decided to put it here.

I can put it here and it should not offend nor pollute anyone else's thread. It's food for thought...for 1945 and beyond or for something else.

[Desert Dave]

As originally posted by Retributar:

I am not interested in email concerning aliens, the occult, or other irrelevant topics;

Well, too bad.

Because... the occult IS indeed intricately

ENmeshed in all of the other areas you... as Post-modern,

Deconstructing... Doktor Faust, ... are

Dangerously... dabbling in. :eek:

Suffice it to say, no-one... KNOWS

What any of this stuff means.

Or, portends.

Yet, they like to PRETEND that they do.

Advanced degrees mean NOTHING when

"The Not Knowable"

Is qua carelessly investigated.

Actually better to merely operate on intuition

And TRY to closely examine the subconscious,

And the cellular memories.

That mythic connection

Accidentally collected.

Near impossible to do, I appreciate, and

Yet... a very few HAVE indeed gotten... close.

Most of those were... shocked insane, and liable

To be post-haste stuffed

Into a padded cell.

A few... a very few... yet roam among us... YOU!

Have seen them, perhaps, and it was

Likely this result:

You shied away, stunned.

You ran screaming as secretly as you could.

You... accused.

You helped Big Brother put them away, literally,

By holding "the freak" down

Until the Authorities might soon arrive,

Strobe-lights squalling!

Ah, let us not... "tamper"

With... "odd phenomena."

Scientists know better... they simply IGNORE

(... and X-claim: superstition! Not yet explained! Co-incidence! Etc, etc, LOL!)

ANYTHING... unusual.

(... or, so we... suppose... LOL!)

[ August 28, 2004, 08:56 AM: Message edited by: Desert Dave ]

[flamingknives]

I love this stuff - good for a chuckle.

Let's see.

Antigravity (supposedly) negates the effects of gravity on mass. It does not negate mass itself, so we don't need no frikkin' laser beams (though the ABL and the MTHEL are both very cool)

Inertia is a function of mass and not weight. So you can cut loose with all manner of recoiling weapons from an object that masses several tons and it won't fly off that quick (if at all) in the other direction. Unfortunately, this also spoils the UFO enthusiasts claim of unprecedented maneuverability. Note that jet fighters have been capable of reaching human tolerance (9G sustained) for quite a while now (F16 was the first airframe to be cleared for it)

Mercury plasma at 150K and 250,000atm? Forgetting that 250,000atm is at least an order of magnitude greater than the hydrostatic yield stress of most engineering materials, and two order of magnitude higher than those found on aircraft, making plasma out of hydrogen requires an extremely low pressure and quite a high voltage or temperature. Somehow, though, if we drop the temperature to -123C (where Mercury is a solid) we suddenly have sufficient magic to make it a plasma?

It seems somewhat unlikely

Airborne reactors too? Allowing for coolant systems, generators, core, shielding (unless you like crispy fried pilots) and failsafes, that's going to be quite large.

[Edit: Feck, I can't spell]

[ August 28, 2004, 03:00 PM: Message edited by: flamingknives ]

[Roosevelt45(the 2nd)]

I don't know what this discussion has to do with the game but if the proposition is to include all this things is in the game as weapons or as tech, I think it's bull****.

If I want a sf strategy game I'll buy one, if I want a WW2 TBS game, I'll buy SC2 (I get a smile on my face only thinking about SC2,Does anyone know a good psy btw?).

[Retributar]

Don't get excited 'Hyper-Excited' over nothing Roosevelt45 ...no-one said that any of this will be included in the game.

Please read everything carefully before you start making wild accusations...which have no basis in fact!.

[Roosevelt45(the 2nd)]

I apologise, but I wasn't accusing anyone.

I just asked what this thread has to do with the game? :confused:

[Retributar]

Roosevelt45 this is a discussion or information topic with some factual and some unsubstantiated information dealing with WW2 as well as some that is beyond WW2.

This game SC2 is advertised as "Rewrite history with 6 full length campaigns ('39, '40, '41, '42' 43, '44) each lasting to the historical end of the war and beyond" .

This discussion thread primarily deals with information that might be used for beyond '44...as you have seen advanced U.S., German & Russian Aircraft and Vehicles that did not actually make it to the battlefield... BUT!!!...might have had the war lasted through '45 and beyond!.

Really!, if you had taken the time and care to read carefully what was there...i wouldnt need to explain any of this information.

Granted...it goes into UFO type subjects and so on...but, Foo-Fighters (Have you ever heard of Foo-Fighters???...they did exist!.) were a reality experienced by Allied pilots...and the main UFO phenomena also began in WW2...so even though some of these subjects are just too unacceptably bizarre for you...doesnt mean that there isnt any truth at all to it.

Some of these ideas,...of course the more acceptable ones might reach this game...as for the example some of the advanced weapons...and the hypothetical invasion opportunity of North America.

It baffles me why this subject matter is so puzzling???.