Guess what's coming next...

[Earl Grey]

Since I hope to break some new ground with it, I'd like to introduce you to my current mod project. But so it doesn't get too tedious, I'll let those that don't already know take a guess at what vehicle it will be:

If someone solves the mystery, I'll post a full picture of the pre-production model.

[phil stanbridge]

Looks great whatever it belongs too! Some kind of Rusky HT?

[Yushal]

One of the benefits of having female soldiers.

Drapes!

[z-warfare]

Something Panzer III-related? There seem to be clues at the right side of the picture.

[Ardem]

I got a feeling it is russian, by the colouring, looks like it has a rusty drum on the back of it indicated. I going to go with the obvious T34, this is without going through a thousand bitmaps to find out what else had oild drums on the rear.

[GenSplatton]

Is that a pistol port above the maroon curtains?

[Tux]

Looks like the rear of a Panzer hull to me. A Panzer IV variant, maybe?

[Earl Grey]

Tux is on the right path. Here's another hint:

[Chainsaw]

Its a Panzer IV

and its not a rusty drum, its the exhaust.

[Tux]

Yup, so, judging by the exhaust it's either a Pz IV (up to, but not including J?), a JPz IV, a Wirbelwind or an Ostwind?

[Earl Grey]

Okay, since you almost figured it out - and any other hints would reveal it, anyway - here it is:

I was never really satisfied with any of the jagdpanzer mods out there, so I did my own. It sid rawn entirely from scracth, except the running gear which was taken from MikeyD's awesome PzIV mods.

Some details aren't finalized yet (periscope cover and tools), but will soon be. Depicted in this picture is the PzIV/70, sometimes called the "Jagdpanzer IV (lang)".

Since all Jagdpanzers share the same BMPs, I'll include a wider range of options for the different models.

[John D Salt]

Originally posted by Chainsaw:

Its a Panzer IV

and its not a rusty drum, its the exhaust.

Mr. Picky isn't at all sure you can have that flavour of exhaust with the three-return-roller chassis. Anyone got a huge Jentz or Spielberger tome on Pz IV variants to check for sure?

All the best,

John.

[Earl Grey]

I have checked a lot of available literature and this suggests that there was a kind of transition model at the end of 1944 with 3 return rollers and the eraly exhaust - will try to find a photograph.

Historical accuracy aside, I have to make do with what I get from BFC - and the polygons are horribly wrong either way.

[Doodlebug]

A lovely looking mod in the making although I'm inclinded to agree with JDS on the chassis/ exhaust issue. My preliminary check (and it is very superficial) indicates Pz IV ausf H chassis used initially for the early L/48 production and would have had the shown exhaust and 4 return rollers as opposed to the ausf J chassis with altered exhaust and 3 return rollers. As you say though, given the polygons you're working to I'm sure it'll be a beautiful beast and a popular mod when finished.

I actually hope a grog on a white horse gallops in to support this combination though.

[Vergeltungswaffe]

You know what that needs?...Ambush!

[Tux]

Very nice, Earl Grey, I look forward to the finished item.

As an aside, I've never really used JPz IVs much in CM - they seem very expensive the whole time. The same applies for StuG IVs. How widely used were these two types in real life, as compared to, say, StuG IIIs, Marders and Hetzers? Also, were JPz IV(70)s at all numerous or were they very much outnumbered by 75L48-armed versions?

[Earl Grey]

@Vergeltungswaffe: It will get Ambush, be assured!

@Tux: According to my sources there were built:

- 1141 StuG from December 1943 to April 1945

- 278 PzIV/70(A) from August 1944 to April 1945

- 930 PzIV/70(V) from August 1944 to April 1945

That stands against the number of ~800 Jagdpanzer IV built from January 1944 to October 1944. Therefore I'd conclude all variants are quite rare, but the early Jagdpanzer IV even more than the others.

[MeatEtr]

Darn, I was hoping it was the mighty HE chucker the Brummbar or Bear. There's almost no mods for it, so it could certainly use a facelift. It would also get double exposure too in both CMBB/AK.

I can still dream right?

IMO theres already some nice Jagdpanzer mods out there. So this mod will be good for a change from the existing ones. Thanks alot Earl, looking forward to the finished product.

[ June 02, 2008, 11:52 AM: Message edited by: MeatEtr ]

[Earl Grey]

The Brummbär will get a proper facelift in time. I've already accumulated lots of literature for it and will tackle that one, too. What I've seen of the stock textures I'll probably redraw the bigger part of them based on what I already did for the Jagdpanzer. My aim is getting the details as correct as possible which isn't the case for most stock textures in the game... Just give me time!

As it stands now a lot of people want me to do 'historical' mods and drawing from scratch takes a lot of time. But I'll get to it - CMx2 is still some time away and there are still people around playing this CMBB for years to come...

[MeatEtr]

Awesome to hear Earl, looking forward to anything you decide to do. It's great to see the old CM series still being modded. And with CMC soon to be released, long live the CMx1 series.

[Vergeltungswaffe]

Great news indeed, Herr von Schr...err, Earl.

[Earl Grey]

So there's still the question what kind of pattern/vehicle you want to have. I actually started this as a late-war PzIV/70 for the now closed-down Lauban campaign... But I think a late Jagdpanzer IV might look more appropriate since it'd get a Dunkelgelb base color pattern which is suitable for every scenario from 1943 to 1945.

What do you say? Wanna see some color profiles and you decide which you like best?

[ June 03, 2008, 08:43 AM: Message edited by: Earl Grey ]

[Tux]

How easy is it to produce several different base colour schemes? I ask merely because back when I used to skin aircraft for the IL-2 series the creation of the detail template layers was always the time-consuming bit. The paint jobs themselves were relatively quickly and easily applied.

Personally, I like plain Dunkelgelb vehicles but I also like the Red Oxide Primer schemes. I like the idea of AFVs in late war scenarios having been rushed to the front in nowt but a coat of primer, with no-one having/ taking thwe time to apply proper camouflage. Did that ever occur in reality?

By the way, does anyone put layered templates for CM vehicles up for download?

[Earl Grey]

Well, once the template is done (like the one above) camouflage can be done pretty fast, depending on the complexity of the pattern. What does take some time, though, is getting the pattern to fit at the edges of the BMPs. Some people don't look that closely, but I don't like non-fitting patterns. Just doesn't look right...

Red oxide primer only would have been pretty scarce since that was only applied from end of October 1944 until the end of November 1944 when base color changed to olive green. Judging from original photographs no Jagdpanzer was ever delivered with basecoat only, but the receiving units could still have camouflaged them at the front if no factory camopuflage was applied - which is hard to tell, actually. I haven't seen a photograph that allowed me to confirm a one-color-only Jagdpanzer yet. As far as I know, at least some patches/stripes were applied before sending the vehicle into combat if the vehicle wasn't camouflaged at the factory which was more or less standard for late-war patterns.

And what do you mean by 'layered templates'? AS far as I know there are some templates for the stock textures (mostly Panther, though, if I remember correctly) and Vossie put his 251 mods up with layers...

If you want to camouflage the vehicle by yourself I can just upload a 'virgin' version in Dunkelgelb...

[Tux]

Hi. No I have every faith in your ability to produce good-looking Jagdpanzers. By 'layered template' I meant a file such as a Photoshop file or .psp Paintshop Pro file that allowed the camouflage to be painted onto a layer beneath all of the details. If I were to paint camouflage onto a flat, 'virgin' bmp I would have to deal with painting over the details of the vehicle structure, which would then have to be re-drawn.

I was just interested because occasionally I get the urge to produce my own set of skins so that all the vehicles in game 'fit' with each other.

As far as known schemes go, what is the most common scheme that there is evidence of? Was time found to apply an 'ambush' scheme to most JPz IVs or did most make do with dark green or brown patches, etc.?