I don't get it

[Crazy]

Situation : i noticed that german tank take out russians with one shot, why? One hit and knocked out. Tiger vs IS-2 (44 early): one shot front upper hull penetration and that's it, while if IS-2 shots and gets a hit noooo, shot more.A lot this happens with PANTHERS which get side hull penetrations from t-34/85 and noooo you must hit them several times and only then while if a t-34/85 gets a single hit that's it for him.Same thing with Panzer IV vs t-34/85, my tank gets a single penetration (doesn't matter there) and gets knoked out.Maybe i am doing something wrong but it irritates me than a Panther gets a front turret penetration (less than 90 meters) and a side hull from two t-34/85 , and nothing just turns turren takes one and than another with single shots.

[Soddball]

Originally posted by Crazy:

Situation : i noticed that german tank take out russians with one shot, why? One hit and knocked out. Tiger vs IS-2 (44 early): one shot front upper hull penetration and that's it, while if IS-2 shots and gets a hit noooo, shot more.A lot this happens with PANTHERS which get side hull penetrations from t-34/85 and noooo you must hit them several times and only then while if a t-34/85 gets a single hit that's it for him.Same thing with Panzer IV vs t-34/85, my tank gets a single penetration (doesn't matter there) and gets knoked out.Maybe i am doing something wrong but it irritates me than a Panther gets a front turret penetration (less than 90 meters) and a side hull from two t-34/85 , and nothing just turns turren takes one and than another with single shots.

It isn't "one-shot, one-kill". Taking out a tank depends on alot of factors.

For example: Play an early-war game, and use German anti-tank rifles against Russian T-26 tanks. You might find that you need 15 or 20 penetrations to kill the tank.

Whether or not the tank is destroyed by the hit is affected by lots of things - such as how much High Explosive charge is in the round which penetrates the tank.

If you're only playing with Tigers, Panthers, IS-2s and T34/85s, then you will most often see one-shot kills. Play early-war or lighter tanks and things will be different.

[landser]

I think perhaps this is the "death clock" in action, at least in part. Those enemy tanks may have in fact been knocked out on the first penetration, only you don't know it. When your tanks are knocked out the game gives you that information immediately. Not so for enemy tanks, which don't become knocked out until the tank brews or the crew is observed to bail out. Quite satisfactory feature IMO.

[momishuli]

It happens too often that German crews score hits with their first shots (regardless of vehicle type ie. assault guns, tanks, spws etc). I know that German tanks had very good optics in comparison, yet within 500m range, such should be the case for Soviet vehicles, too, in my opinion. Yet, I have never seen it happen that at ranges beyond 200 Soviet tank can hit unless they shoot at least 3 times. Also, sometimes they miss after a succesful hit??? One would think, after a perfect line-up and range determination, they would not re-align?

[Soddball]

Originally posted by momishuli:

It happens too often that German crews score hits with their first shots (regardless of vehicle type ie. assault guns, tanks, spws etc). I know that German tanks had very good optics in comparison, yet within 500m range, such should be the case for Soviet vehicles, too, in my opinion. Yet, I have never seen it happen that at ranges beyond 200 Soviet tank can hit unless they shoot at least 3 times. Also, sometimes they miss after a succesful hit??? One would think, after a perfect line-up and range determination, they would not re-align?

Try doing a search on 'optics', 'gun accuracy' and the like.

[hardcampa]

After I read about the german tanks killing with 1 hit in this thread I almost understood what they talked about. Until I realised that it have been exactly the same for me on occations. But for the Russian side =/

Conclusion.

**** happens. =)

[aka_tom_w]

Both the Death Clock and The way Gunnery Optics are NOW modeled in CMBB are VAST improvements over CMBO!

Both work very well and many on this forum would agree they simulate WW II historical AFV combat events really well in a $45 US video game :eek:

(IMHO)

-tom w

[Crazy]

Soddball i did, i noticed than and T III (short) is "useless" agains t-34 front armor.But in mid/late war years s firefite between T-34/85 whicth has an ap (a large HE round) and T IV, 34 hits a T IV front turret, says smth. like a penetration and gets a hit from T IV in front and "dies".

IS-2 and tiger there fiting over 1076 meters and IS-2 got a hit in front upper full whitch is 105/30 (model 44, early), in Tiger "properties" says it has a 101/30 penetration at this range and that was it for IS, i replayd it and IS-2 got the first shot (front upper hull) penetration (IS-2 136/0 penetration level) and nothing Tiger was still alive (he got my IS-2) than drove around chasing infantry.

Landser.I saw that "death clock" it was over 650 meters T IV got taken out by ZiS-2 and it was still "alive" but ZiS started shooting at another tank and only in the end of turn T IV got a knoked out sine, but between Panther and two T-34/85 there less than 100 meters, it couldn't be it.German tank too often go just bailing out, while russian tank just get knoked out imediatly.

Momishuli. The same thing i'm saying, it's says that for moving tank it's hurder to score a hit.And whtat i see : A Tiger reverses , at the same moment two of mine t-34/85 one from left another right shoot at him, miss.Tiger (moving) SLOWLY turns turrent in left shoots (knokes out one 34), than SLOWLY to right (knockes out another 34).

Besides what is it with no optics for russian tanks/assaultguns/tank destroyers ? I agree Germans had better optics, but optics had russians too.For exsample ISU-152 had telescopic sight СТ-10 and панорамой Герца (sorry i don't know how to translate this) which provided firing as with a straight line , and from the closed positions.Isu-152 wal also knowen as Soviet "Зверобой" and German "Dosenoffner".

It's something strange than russian crack ISU-122 mises from 150 m. (target : T-IV (green)) and T-IV scores a hit on ISU.(T-IV was ambushed, ISU was at 90 degrees to him (side hul)).

If you want visit www.armor.kiev.ua (it's in russian)

[Panzer76]

Originally posted by Crazy:

Besides what is it with no optics for russian tanks/assaultguns/tank destroyers ? I agree Germans had better optics, but optics had russians too.

CMBB simulates optics for russian armour also. But it doesnt state so in the "unit chart" because CMBB simulates that all russian optics are of avreage quality. The germans has lots of different high quality optics, and is therefore specified in the "unit chart". What you can discuss is the quality of the russian optics. If you have anything to add on this subject, feel free to do so.

[Ellros]

Originally posted by momishuli:

It happens too often that German crews score hits with their first shots (regardless of vehicle type ie. assault guns, tanks, spws etc). I know that German tanks had very good optics in comparison, yet within 500m range, such should be the case for Soviet vehicles, too, in my opinion. Yet, I have never seen it happen that at ranges beyond 200 Soviet tank can hit unless they shoot at least 3 times. Also, sometimes they miss after a succesful hit??? One would think, after a perfect line-up and range determination, they would not re-align?

WW2 tanks did not have today's stabilized systems. Recoil could and did knock the aim off for consecutive shots. Secondly, German optics were better than Soviet. Again, that can be found by a search.

[momishuli]

Originally posted by Soddball:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by momishuli:

It happens too often that German crews score hits with their first shots (regardless of vehicle type ie. assault guns, tanks, spws etc). I know that German tanks had very good optics in comparison, yet within 500m range, such should be the case for Soviet vehicles, too, in my opinion. Yet, I have never seen it happen that at ranges beyond 200 Soviet tank can hit unless they shoot at least 3 times. Also, sometimes they miss after a succesful hit??? One would think, after a perfect line-up and range determination, they would not re-align?

Try doing a search on 'optics', 'gun accuracy' and the like.</font>

[ASL Veteran]

Originally posted by momishuli:

I meant to express my opinion, rather than seeking an answer for why they miss after a hit. Seeing a crack tank crew missing a target 350 meters away, wasting 2 more shots and still won't score a hit is not something, I believe, I can find answer for by making a search.

respectfuly

The search suggestion was probably made because there have been numerous very long, heated, and sometimes informative discussions on this topic in the past. Some of the longest and most heated exchanges are contained within those threads ... and yes, pretty much everything was covered in the most excruciating detail (along with hit chances, actual diagrams of the optics on various tanks, and accuracies of various guns on test ranges).