George MC Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 Hi Guys Just picked up on this thread. Glad to read you have been enjoying Peiper's Nahkampftag It's a real B to play. Not long agao I had my butt handed to me in a PBEM playing as the Germans. Great fight though. Aco4bn187inf: You like Stuetzpunkt Glowaczow? Yup must admit I like it too - Like the tank fighting in it Cheers fur noo George 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slysniper Posted January 28, 2008 Share Posted January 28, 2008 If you can imagine, about 30 Halftracks now making a mad dash for their home lines, with only a tiger, Pz 4 and a couple of SP units for protection. 30 or so Russian tanks with about 20 of them being T34's in all sorts of positions around the fleeing units. My guess at the moment will be that the tiger and maybe a sp unit with most of the Halftracks making it out alive. Hard to say. Every turn a tank can get within range he loses one to two halftracks. For him the only advantage is he has most of my units behind him now. The smoke of battle is littering the field, the German excaping army has fled, now it is just a few turns away until we see the verdict of the score. As far as I can tell he might of exited 15 Halftracks or so, will it be enough to swing the battle, I think not but we will soon see. The tiger still roams the field, he has two Halftracks still caught on the map and some infantry scatered around from where they have excaped death from their destroyed transports. I did as well as I thought nailing the last 3 sp guns , the PZIV, and did get 14 Half tracks, so about half, not bad considering he did find a weak location to make the breakthrough at. His tiger has 5 kills, not bad. but not like the 29 tank kills that he was getting playing the AI. He might be converted to PBEM now, the next battle will be more even and he has the skills to play well without needing to play the AI.Good Hunting [ January 28, 2008, 09:33 AM: Message edited by: slysniper ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWittman Posted January 30, 2008 Author Share Posted January 30, 2008 Hell yes I'm converted alright! I've never had so much fun before in a battle, even if the odds against me were pretty stacked from the beginning. Well done George Mc for such an entertaining battle but the best part is it's historical which is important to me. Now I'll have to check out this other scenario that has been mentioned. Perhaps it will be the next chance to test my skills versus slysniper. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted January 31, 2008 Share Posted January 31, 2008 MichaelWittman, Welcome to the wonderful world of PBEM! If your life is dull, may I suggest Royal Opponent against a live foe? That should end the doldrums! Either that, or play Tiger Valley in CMAK the same way. Presto! No more boredom. Have posted AARs for both. No peeking if you haven't played Tiger Valley! Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sivodsi Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 If you have not had an ice cream, you do not have an ice cream. If you have had an ice cream, you do not have an ice cream. You cannot have an ice cream. An ice cream koan. Nice one! I hadn't visited these forums for a while, so I had no idea what was 'koan' on. Gee, I didn't realize that not having to have an ice cream was so much fun. [ February 01, 2008, 09:42 PM: Message edited by: Sivodsi ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Enigma Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I remember playing some scenario where you were given a few Tigers only and had to halt a Soviet tank advance through a town. I remember using one to block each of the main roads through the town and destroyed something like 30 T34/75 in the process, only loss being one Tiger imobilised, so not really a loss - although he ended up being surrounded by T34s and destroyed them all. Agaisnt someone else however, i remember racking up quite a few kills with one Tiger agaisnt my mate in a CMAK scewnario - think it was like 7 kills or something. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slysniper Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 Well, the battle has finially ended. Mother Russia holds its honor in defending its lands, Victory is theirs but Wittman did get 6 Kills with his one Tiger, that remaind alive, I did manage to penetrate the Beast on the very last turn and it was in a state of shock over a lost crewman with 6 T34s within range to maybe be able to pump some shells into it within the next minute. but he managed to stay alive in game terms. He had one PZIV with 4 kills and a few with 3, so not bad considering all the T34's I had running around. So on to another battle, this time Wittman will be the attacker and I will be the poor defender, his chance for a little revenge is close at hand. Time to move on, I must prepare my defences for the new conflict. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWittman Posted February 21, 2008 Author Share Posted February 21, 2008 Hi all, So there we have it eh? 29 kills with 2 Tigers against the incompetent AI but just 6 against a seasoned PBEM veteran with the surviving Tiger in the same battle. Sly said I did well with what little armour I had. Not bad for a noob. We have started another clash of arms in the above mentioned Glowaczow battles with me as the German attacker and then Sly will take me on in the inevitable Russian counterattack. I will keep you posted. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philippe Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 Originally posted by The_Enigma: I remember playing some scenario where you were given a few Tigers only and had to halt a Soviet tank advance through a town. I remember using one to block each of the main roads through the town and destroyed something like 30 T34/75 in the process, only loss being one Tiger imobilised, so not really a loss - although he ended up being surrounded by T34s and destroyed them all. Agaisnt someone else however, i remember racking up quite a few kills with one Tiger agaisnt my mate in a CMAK scewnario - think it was like 7 kills or something. If you remember the name of that Soviet vs. Tiger scenario, please mention it because I would like to take a look at it at some point. There was a scenario like that in Steel Panthers, and I always wondered how it would play in CM. The Steel Panthers scenario was historical or semi-historical, and I think it involved Michael Wittmann. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuirassier Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 In a PBEM I am doing now my Jagdpanzer IV has racked up a number of kills. It has killed 4 or 5 T-34/85 and is now leveling some houses with HE. I just hope my Grenadiers can hold. The Soviet infantry is hitting them hard 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 A relevant test statistic for Tiger hunters, and deflator for Tiger drivers who think it is them - Place a T-34/76 with T ammo, 1944 era, at 100 meters from the exact 90 degree side of a buttoned Tiger I, facing said Tiger with turret aligned on it. The Tiger's own turret is straight ahead, aka 90 degrees off. Give the T-34 no movement order but a definite fire order. Hit "go". The Tiger is a 4 to 1 favorite to kill the T-34, instead of the other way around. The reason is behind armor effect. It is modeled as very poor for rounds not far over the penetration needed to "get in", and it is also very generous to large vehicles by tonnage. The average number of penetrating hits with Russian 76mm typically needed to fully KO a Tiger I is around 5. Sometimes sooner of course - the chance with each round is around 1 in 6. The chance of the dreaded "no significant damage" is more like 1 in 3. It isn't a death clock issue, it is a "hit it, but didn't kill it" issue. And the Tiger turns. Hull and turret. The hull can take the time of 4 shots to align, but the turret takes only 2 to start showing front facing (at side angle), and by shot 3 the Tiger will be firing itself. Front turret hits can and will bounce ("reinforced turret front" can amount to up to 200mm simulated thickness). So your chances are basically, the first hit might kill it, or the second might hit the hull rather than the turret and then might kill it, and otherwise you are much more likely to be killed than to kill it, and more time doesn't much help. Note, the Tiger will continue to rotate and will even fire, while down a crew member or panicking. A full T-34 *platoon* in that perfect kill set up, are favored. They will pump in enough hits to wreck the tank, either with full penetration kills or cumulative gun damage and immobilization etc. There is still a chance that their first hits all fail and the Tiger then "runs the table", but it is rare. 2 are about an even chance. Alive in perfect position with the Tiger initially distracted. You don't have to drive well to get numerous kills in a Tiger. It is mostly a matter of whether chance favors or afflicts an opponent who drives well. If they stuff up, that can help too. (And as the thread relates, the AI usually does and humans usually do not). But both skill and luck factors are largely on the other side - and the luck one is largest if the "tank odds" are close. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slysniper Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 So in simple man terms, swarm a Tiger with about (5) T34's from every direction except where the gun is directed, still pray for luck. And I sure do not remember much T ammo being available, but thats because "Lets try and do the impossible" is a good motto in this match up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWittman Posted June 14, 2008 Author Share Posted June 14, 2008 A long time since I have posted in my thread. ****SPOILERS**** Sly and I are in our 2nd battle in Glowaczow and after a tough first battle attacking the hill I am giving Sly a very hard time defending it with my Panthers. He has taken many casualties from mainly two of my Panthers who have racked up around 15 kills between them. He still has a few enemy tanks near the hill but not nearly as many as he started with. Still this has been a brutal battle and it hasn't been decided yet... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Originally posted by MichaelWittman: A long time since I have posted in my thread. ****SPOILERS**** Sly and I are in our 2nd battle in Glowaczow and after a tough first battle attacking the hill I am giving Sly a very hard time defending it with my Panthers. He has taken many casualties from mainly two of my Panthers who have racked up around 15 kills between them. He still has a few enemy tanks near the hill but not nearly as many as he started with. Still this has been a brutal battle and it hasn't been decided yet... Keen to hear how you get on with this One of my favourite scenarios. Cheers fur noo george 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slysniper Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 I will tell you how the battle is going, any smart Russian would have pulled out and licked his wounds a long time ago. I did not anticipate the level of defense I was up against, did not have a large enough amount of units commited to the flanks and am amazed that I have killed any Panther that is sitting on the main hill since that is helping that front sloped armor even more. But with that said, we play the game, where pulling back and waiting for another day is not a option, so I push the attack which is costing me dearly, somehow I have managed to make myself a thorn in his side but at this point he is sitting pretty good, making his own efforts to remove my few units that have managed to push around the base of the hill. But he cannot sit back and rest just yet since I still poise a threat as too gaining a draw at this point. He would not be doing so well if he would have had to use the units that he had left from our previous battle of him trying to take the hill which did not fare well for him, but now it is my turn to winch Love the game and am having great fun, even if this is likely a lost cause. Think, wow, how a operational level and this tactical level game tied together would make for such a great sim. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George MC Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 Hi Slysniper This action is based a RL incident. It's on page 209 of vol 2 of Panzertruppen. OOBs etc are pretty much as was as far as I could determine. It's tough for the Soviets that's for sure but winnable. I think several guys over at BoB have played this and it was playing out 50/50 who won. Good luck with the rest of it Cheers fur noo George 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelWittman Posted July 20, 2008 Author Share Posted July 20, 2008 Hi all, Well the slugfest between Sly and myself is finally over and I'm happy to report I got my first draw (54 to 46) in my favour. I knocked out 36 of his 39 tanks with 17 falling to 2 crack Panthers alone. I myself lost 15 tanks and 10 h/ts but held the hill overlooking the battlefield. We both had the same amount of infantry left although he had taken more casualties from the heavy shelling I had given him. So although not as robust as the mighty Tiger the humble Panther came through for me. Great battle George MC and thoroughly recommended. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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